NYTimes Auto Affordability Article
- Thread starter jghall00
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As someone who grew up dirt poor I can tell you for sure poor people don't buy brand new cars. Not even the $25K ones. More like the $5K one at the back of the lot. Being poor is expensive.
Sorry to burst your bubble.
Sorry to burst your bubble.
Totally agree. I didn't mean to suggest that it was not important, but instead was trying to show that there are real reasons that the price of automobiles keeps increasing.
Getting where we need to go safely is #1. All I'm saying is it all comes at a price. All those safety features add up quickly. I suspect we would be shocked to find out how much mandated safety features add to the price of an automobile.
In the late '70's, I was selling cars at a Chevrolet/Oldsmobile dealership. In some of the industry news of that time, I recall reading that the average car purchase price was equivalent to about 6-9 months gross earnings of the buyer. It would be interesting to see what it is these days.
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4wd
$50 site donor 2026
Notice I never mentioned large SUV’s
But, I already have two - thanks …
Agree; but with a possible caveat... People may buy vehicles that may lead them to poor financial positions.
When I made it to high tech, the parking lot was full of drop-dead gorgeous German cars. BMW musta shipped cars directly to Silicon Valley! And the Boxsters and 911s; OMG. MBZ. Sheesh. I surmised they must make much more that I. I was wrong.
Now many of those BMW buyers wearing Macy-Nordy threads are retiring and have to leave the area...
Also @JeffKeryk
I’m not quite understanding your post
There’s over a dozen to 20 vehicles around $25,000 on the market from manufacturers all over the world and sold in the US market
In post number three I gave two links
Here is the one from consumer reports and there is another link in post number three
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/cheap-cars-recommended-by-consumer-reports-a1059266229/
There are plenty of cars on the market that are affordable
The common manufacturers scale their production to the buyers. Come on guys how much cheaper can a car get?
Not only that but years ago, you couldn’t come close, not close to getting the amount of features and safety features in a vehicle in this price range
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I was shocked at the number of 1 year old Equinox EVs on sale near me for barely over $20K and most with less than 15K miles. I saw a purple 2LT (pretty nice spec) for $23K in the next town over. Don't really want a purple car if I had a choice, but man if I just needed to get from point A to B, with a really nice interior spec, I think that's what I'd do.
If only we allowed the Chinese to sell their junk cars here, the affordability crisis would be averted. 
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I think we do ourselves a disservice by characterizing Chinese vehicles as junk. Given Fords issues with phasers and 10 spd transmissions, GM V8 engines self disassembling, Toyota with engine failures, and Stellantis all around poor rep, who is to say the Chinese are worse? As with many things, they likely have varying levels of quality. My whole house inverter is sourced from China and by all accounts, it's one of the best in the industry.If only we allowed the Chinese to sell theirjunkcars here, the affordability crisis would be averted.
Then you clearly don’t understand how all of the outsourcing works.
You see, the Chinese manufacturing process needs strict supervision from the western corporations in order to meet the intended QC levels. And I mean very strict supervision. That’s why there are hoards of quality and manufacturing engineers constantly traveling to China. You need to physically see what they’re doing.
But if you leave them to their own devices, they will start making shortcuts and changes without notice and if you catch them, they usually play dumb and pretend they don’t know what happened.
That’s how quality is achieved, by babysitting their processes and constantly checking that they stick to them. And these guys are crafty at subverting the established procedures and evading responsibility.
But all you see is a “made in china” sticker on your favorite gadget and think they did it all by themselves.
Somehow Apple makes it work. In 30 years of owning Macs and iPhones I have never once had a single QC issue with an Apple product. I've never had to have anything repaired. The closest I've been to an issue was an AppleTV that was used +18 hours per day, every day, stopped working, but I still think I got my money's worth out it.
They make it work exactly how I explained it.
I know few engineers working for Apple and they can go on nice vacations simply from the points collected for their company travel to China. To overlook all aspects of production.
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My personal experience suggests otherwise. My inverter is made by Deye and is branded as Sol-Ark, but Sol-Ark isn't doing QC because the inverter is sold worldwide. In fact, Deye disabled their Deye inverters in the U.S. because consumers were importing the Deye units directly to get substantial cost savings, which violated the distribution agreement with Sol-ark.
Nearly all my TVs for the past 10+ years have been TCL. DJI is a worldwide leader in drone tech. My Reolink camera is one of the most popular brands among home automation enthusiasts. I've had my Ego electric mower for over ten years. It still starts with no issues. All my Ego tools have proven to be very reliable. My Ryobi tools, same thing.
I understand what you're saying about many companies cutting corners, as I have heard that sentiment from others, but I think it's an overstatement to apply it universally. Yes, there are some outsourced manufacturers that will try and cut corners to save a buck, but in many industries Chinese companies are now at the forefront of the market, if not outright leadership.
Median family income in the USA is $144,000
Using your 10% figure would mean a new car in 1975 should have cost $1,500. or $11,000 in 2019
If vehicles weren't affordable people would not buy them. Even though their are a large amount of models 20k to 30k many spend way above this.
Source https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MAFAINUSA646N
I would have been sick if my wife chose the EV version over the Gas version in Nov 2024 (2025 model)
GM is giving the EVs away for months now. Back in Nov 2024 they were sticker priced... then again, I think you still got $7,500 from your fellow taxpayers...
Heck if I could have convinced here now, to sell the 2025 Gas and pick up a NEW 2026 EV version I wouldnt lose too much I think. lowest I see here is a new 2026 EV for 28K OMG !... This is a small sample and it's been going on a while. From the GM website.
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That's the mean (not median) and it's hugely different from the median, suggesting it's probably heavily skewed upwards by high wage earners.
You posted Mean family income. AKA average.
Median family income in the USA currently is about $105K - meaning 50% of households are below and 50% above.
Realize most families have 2 people working and hence need 2 cars.
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You're correct. I realized my error when I looked at your chart. My number was 2024 median, not mean. I don't think the 2025 number is out yet.
The part about two cars is why I think new vehicles at 25k aren't really a good financial choice for the median wage household. It would be well above that 10% threshold. But there are many used reliable used vehicles priced well below 25k. I'm well above the median, but I have four cars and even I shudder when I think about the cost of ownership. That's a big part of the reason I do my own repairs and maintenance.
The median household income hasn't kept up with the cost of living, so the bottom 2/3 are getting their dollars stretched further.
So I think 1/2 to 2/3 of households have given up on a new car, especially at $25k for a base model sedan or tiny SUV?
Our US made, 2018 Outback new, was less than $25k USD, and its a capable AWD mid size wagon family vehicle. $25k for a 2wd compact sedan, or SUV, with half the cargo space, made in China or Korea, just doesn't make sense to me, other than the dollar has be devalued that much?
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