No Pain Free Cure

[Tempest]

Quote:
There were far more workers supporting far fewer recipients. Simple math. Now one could surely argue that they dispersed too many benefits to too many people when the operation wasn't so top heavy ..but AGAIN, you come back to the productivity in commerce that the release of these funds into the society produced.

So the early getters got the goods and that is not a ponzi scheme? You admit that there is an ever lower ratio supporting fewer people (for doing nothing but getting old) and that those that got in the game late get less or nothing and that is not ponzi scheme? Come now Gary??

And those funds had to be first TAKEN OUT in order to be "released" back into the economy.

 

[Tempest]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: Tempest
All of the resources required to build/make nukes, hydros, water diversion, towns, food, booze and accommodations sourced strictly in OZ?
How much would it cost to move significant numbers of people to work at those places? And then move them somewhere else for the next "stimulus" project?


So giving people a couple of grand to spend on Chinese junk that they'll throw out within three years makes more sense ?

No, never taking the money out of the system in the first place and letting the free market determine what to do with it would be ideal.
20 Billion is about 3% of your GDP. That's a lot of private investment that could have occurred actually doing something to grow your economy as opposed to the Government collecting and sitting on it.
I bet that "rebate" didn't go to rich people, correct? So just as they did here, you give it to poorer people that will spend (consume) it on TV's or whatever, rather than letting richer people keep money that might actually want to invest in new businesses that will employ people for the long term.
This is not good to promote long term growth.

You admit that government investing in these long term, real projects is beneficial, so is it not beneficial if the same things happen in the private sector?

 

[Shannow]

Tempest, I would have been happier if they'd kept the surplus in their pockets, and invested it, using the proceeds to pay existing liabilities like pensions etc., and infrastructure.

But they didn't they just threw it out.

As to private industry investing in infrastructure, that's a great idea, but private industry won't build the next power station until there are brownouts and the wholesale price of electricity doubles.

That's not very efficient, nor good for business in general.

 

[Gary Allan]

Quote:
You admit that there is an ever lower ratio supporting fewer people (for doing nothing but getting old) and that those that got in the game late get less or nothing and that is not ponzi scheme? Come now Gary??


You deny that taxes were reduced by not having to borrow as much money? Come on, Tempest

Let's not leave out any untidy details here.

 

[Tempest]

Quote:
As to private industry investing in infrastructure, that's a great idea, but private industry won't build the next power station until there are brownouts and the wholesale price of electricity doubles.

That's not very efficient, nor good for business in general.

So then why is this $20 billion sitting around, apparently doing nothing, called a "surplus"?

Are there not currently programs in your government set up to provide these things? Funding does not seem to be a problem.

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
I bet that "rebate" didn't go to rich people, correct? So just as they did here, you give it to poorer people that will spend (consume)


It's interesting who got it. Every Single Parent, carer's and pensioners.

Working middle class missed out by and large (Non of my workmates got any).

Rich(er) people with managed affairs and great accounting practices got their handout too.

 

[Tempest]

Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
Quote:
You admit that there is an ever lower ratio supporting fewer people (for doing nothing but getting old) and that those that got in the game late get less or nothing and that is not ponzi scheme? Come now Gary??


You deny that taxes were reduced by not having to borrow as much money? Come on, Tempest

Let's not leave out any untidy details here.

No Gary, if look on the last page you will see that I agreed with you on that.

Government has been raiding the SS fund for some time. That is a large part of the unfunded $57 Trillion dollars due over the next few decades.

You seem to not like borrowing money, as do I, yet you are perfectly willing to support a program that will put extreme hardship on those yet unborn in order to "help" the current living. I don't understand.
Any ponzi scheme is future borrowing (or stealing) from those joining the party late.

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
So then why is this $20 billion sitting around, apparently doing nothing, called a "surplus"?

Are there not currently programs in your government set up to provide these things? Funding does not seem to be a problem.


The surplus (in spite of the assertions of the previous incumbents) is largely due to the windfalls that the Govt obtained from the GST (consumption tax), and the mining boom that took place when we were feeding china all the ore and coal they could swallow.

Sort of like a semi regular lottery win.

To pee it up the wall is criminal.

And if $20B p.a. was becoming a regular thing, then tax cuts should have been in order.

 

[moribundman]

Originally Posted By: oilyriser
Recessions are good in a way. You don't have to wait so long in line at the stores.


Uh, no. The lines and the wait are longer now because the stores have less cashiers and because there are nonstop sales. Buy 10 for $1 each.

Why have the lines at the post office more than quadrupled?

 

[simple_gifts]

Quote:

Why have the lines at the post office more than quadrupled?


People arguing with the clerks over UOA samples?

 

[bonnie john]

hi shannow

my main squeeze has a friend who is a single mum

her and her partner are joint custodians, 50 - 50

THEY BOTH GOT THE GRAND !!!

at what temperature does blood boil ???

 

[Shannow]

Oh sweet...thanks for that.

A guy I loosely know handed his eldest child over to become ward of the state lest week...wonder what his timing was like.

 

[bonnie john]

nothing like working for the common good ...

 

[Gary Allan]

Quote:
You seem to not like borrowing money, as do I, yet you are perfectly willing to support a program that will put extreme hardship on those yet unborn in order to "help" the current living. I don't understand.
Any ponzi scheme is future borrowing (or stealing) from those joining the party late.



No. I merely point out that you WERE in some way some form a beneficiary in the use of this capital ..and I insist that you acknowledge it.

What you're NOT saying is "Well, ...yeah ..I guess the society ..of which I'm a member of, had money put into the economy ..of which everyone benefited ...especially the sector that "needs help" in the acquisition of wealth ...and ....well ..errr...that was then and this is now. None of that counts now ..sure ..we all blew it ..but now I don't want to pay for the other shoe dropping ...nor do I care to sort out who benefited more from the raiding of the revenues and MAKE THEM PAY ..since it was really ALL OF US ...but since I'm into escaping every cost ..regardless of any past benefit ..

..that's just the way it should be ..