new valvoline "next gen" 50% recycled oil

[ferrari512]

Originally Posted By: dave1251
Originally Posted By: ferrari512

Quote:
All posts made by ferrari512.
Title Forum Post Time
Re: new valvoline "next gen" 50% recycled oil Passenger Car Motor Oil (PCMO) - Gasoline Cars/Pickups/Vans/SUVs 04/11/12 06:36 PM
Re: new valvoline "next gen" 50% recycled oil Passenger Car Motor Oil (PCMO) - Gasoline Cars/Pickups/Vans/SUVs 04/11/12 06:16 PM
Re: new valvoline "next gen" 50% recycled oil Passenger Car Motor Oil (PCMO) - Gasoline Cars/Pickups/Vans/SUVs 04/11/12 06:14 PM
Re: new valvoline "next gen" 50% recycled oil Passenger Car Motor Oil (PCMO) - Gasoline Cars/Pickups/Vans/SUVs 04/11/12 04:09 PM
Re: new valvoline "next gen" 50% recycled oil Passenger Car Motor Oil (PCMO) - Gasoline Cars/Pickups/Vans/SUVs 04/11/12 03:48 PM
Re: new valvoline "next gen" 50% recycled oil Passenger Car Motor Oil (PCMO) - Gasoline Cars/Pickups/Vans/SUVs 04/11/12 02:55 PM
Re: new valvoline "next gen" 50% recycled oil Passenger Car Motor Oil (PCMO) - Gasoline Cars/Pickups/Vans/SUVs 04/11/12 02:43 PM
Re: new valvoline "next gen" 50% recycled oil Passenger Car Motor Oil (PCMO) - Gasoline Cars/Pickups/Vans/SUVs 04/11/12 02:40 PM
Re: new valvoline "next gen" 50% recycled oil Passenger Car Motor Oil (PCMO) - Gasoline Cars/Pickups/Vans/SUVs 04/11/12 02:33 PM
Re: new valvoline "next gen" 50% recycled oil Passenger Car Motor Oil (PCMO) - Gasoline Cars/Pickups/Vans/SUVs 04/11/12 02:25 PM
Re: new valvoline "next gen" 50% recycled oil Passenger Car Motor Oil (PCMO) - Gasoline Cars/Pickups/Vans/SUVs 04/11/12 10:05 AM
Re: new valvoline "next gen" 50% recycled oil Passenger Car Motor Oil (PCMO) - Gasoline Cars/Pickups/Vans/SUVs 04/10/12 11:32 AM




No I dont work for another oil Company

I just dont like misleading advertising from big Companies.

Another example Nexgten claims this is some kind of new breakthough technology in their advertsing as well, the tech used in CEP has been around since the late 90s.



So you could not stand behind your claim that recycled oil is inferior to virgin. Now it is the advertising? We get it you do not like the idea of Nextgen. Fine you may take that stance and good for you. Just do not say it is inferior to other PCMO'S that is competes with because it is not.


How did I not stand by my claim?

Recycled oil is inferior to new oil thats my opinion you have yours.

Even if the refining result of used oil was equivalent to new crude the basestock is from various unknown sources that were dumped in the used oil tanks, its not like a Amsoil that purchased a quality basestock from one source to make their motor oil

 

[ferrari512]

Originally Posted By: Nickdfresh
Originally Posted By: ferrari512
It a proven fact

Check out Noria oil analysis boards on reclaimed oil


Funny, but the U.S. military uses recycled Safety Kleen oil almost exclusively. It's a proven fact! It's science!

The US military does not use Safety Kleen oil exclusively, many Government entities are required to use recycled oil if its available.

The U.S. Military treats their regular vehicles poorly anyway add recycled oil to them they dont care, in expensive turbine engines they do not use recycled oil.

 

[ferrari512]

Valvoline also claims it gets its used oil from its quick lube locations so gives you the impression its recycled Valvoline oil, I had an quick lube/car wash and you didnt have exclusive customers that only used the oil I sold them the last oil change it was various sources of oil from many cars I never saw again,the used oil tanks were a nasty mix of all kinds of junk oil.

 

[dave1251]

Your argument on the matter is becoming more erratic and less based on fact everyday. Valvoline has given you the forum to ask them about Nextgen. Go ahead and ask them how a motor oil is formulated and how Nextgen is equal to VWB and Maxlife respectively. Although I doubt that will do you any good because you have to have a open mind to be filled with knowledge.

 

[Zako2]

Originally Posted By: A_Harman
The only thing that is going to reduce America's dependency on foreign oil is pumping it out of the ground in our own country. (Kind of an obvious statement when it is put that way, but way too many people in this country are ignoring the obvious these days.)


If the costs and benefits are favorable, by all means drill and pump that oil out of ground. However, America imports 60% or more of its oil. There is probably no way this dependence on the imports will be reduced even to 50%. Moreover, this will not make a dent to gas prices at the pump. This is because the oil prices are dictated by the global market. The minuscule increase in oil production in the US will only be a drop relative to the global oil supply and consumption. Prices hardly will change due to domestic drilling, despite what some politicians say.

 

[Zako2]

Originally Posted By: ferrari512
it was various sources of oil from many cars I never saw again,the used oil tanks were a nasty mix of all kinds of junk oil.


However, it has been pointed out already that this nasty mix is much closer to engine oil than the mineral oil coming out of ground. Both contain impurities that need to be removed. Both go through the same refining process. The used motor oil is much easier to refine because it's much closer to the motor oil product that goes into your engine than untreated mineral oil. The sources of the base stock may be different. So what? We're talking about a conventional motor oil for normal, non-extended oil change intervals that's priced accordingly. Amsoil is a boutique synthetic oil brand.

 

[Loobed]

This is what crude oil looks like.

 

[ferrari512]

Originally Posted By: Zako2
Originally Posted By: ferrari512
it was various sources of oil from many cars I never saw again,the used oil tanks were a nasty mix of all kinds of junk oil.


However, it has been pointed out already that this nasty mix is much closer to engine oil than the mineral oil coming out of ground. Both contain impurities that need to be removed. Both go through the same refining process. The used motor oil is much easier to refine because it's much closer to the motor oil product that goes into your engine than untreated mineral oil. The sources of the base stock may be different. So what? We're talking about a conventional motor oil for normal, non-extended oil change intervals that's priced accordingly. Amsoil is a boutique synthetic oil brand.


Used motor oil has nasty contaminants in it from the combustion process that are not in crude,arsenic,metals,lead,carbon, pcbs,halogens,oxidants,ash,sulfer,particulate matter etc.

 

[ferrari512]

Originally Posted By: dave1251
Your argument on the matter is becoming more erratic and less based on fact everyday. Valvoline has given you the forum to ask them about Nextgen. Go ahead and ask them how a motor oil is formulated and how Nextgen is equal to VWB and Maxlife respectively. Although I doubt that will do you any good because you have to have a open mind to be filled with knowledge.


Yeah Valovoline is really concerned and has answered all the questions in a timely manner.

Go ahead put Nextgen in your motor all you want its your engine , you dont have any facts other than the spoon fed propaganda the Nextgen ad firm spouts.

 

[ferrari512]

Originally Posted By: Zako2
Originally Posted By: ferrari512
it was various sources of oil from many cars I never saw again,the used oil tanks were a nasty mix of all kinds of junk oil.


However, it has been pointed out already that this nasty mix is much closer to engine oil than the mineral oil coming out of ground. Both contain impurities that need to be removed. Both go through the same refining process. The used motor oil is much easier to refine because it's much closer to the motor oil product that goes into your engine than untreated mineral oil. The sources of the base stock may be different. So what? We're talking about a conventional motor oil for normal, non-extended oil change intervals that's priced accordingly. Amsoil is a boutique synthetic oil brand.


This is also why the EPA has classified off spec used motor oil as hazardous waste, cant say that about crude oil.

 

[ferrari512]

Some crude looks like that, some crude is amber and you can run a diesel motor on it straight from the ground, depends the well it was pumped from.

 

[GMorg]

From my understanding, crude oil and spent motor oil are both listed as CR02 waste or "Non-RCRA Hazardous Waste".

CR02 waste is defined as,
"Oil or petroleum that is no longer suitable for the services for which it was manufactured due to the presence of impurities or a loss of original properties, and is not miscible in water. These include, but are not limited to, crude oil, fuel oil, lubricating oil, kerosene, diesel fuel, motor oil, non-halogenated oil, and oils that are recovered from oil separators, oil spills or tank bottoms.

Used PCMO and crude are not the same thing. However, I do not see how a rational person can conclude that crude is always a better starting material for refinement and hydrocracking than is used PCMO.

 

[ferrari512]

Originally Posted By: GMorg
From my understanding, crude oil and spent motor oil are both listed as CR02 waste or "Non-RCRA Hazardous Waste".

CR02 waste is defined as,
"Oil or petroleum that is no longer suitable for the services for which it was manufactured due to the presence of impurities or a loss of original properties, and is not miscible in water. These include, but are not limited to, crude oil, fuel oil, lubricating oil, kerosene, diesel fuel, motor oil, non-halogenated oil, and oils that are recovered from oil separators, oil spills or tank bottoms.

Used PCMO and crude are not the same thing. However, I do not see how a rational person can conclude that crude is always a better starting material for refinement and hydrocracking than is used PCMO.


On spec used oil is not hazardous waste

As I mentioned the combustion process in motors and particulate matters make used oil very different than raw crude. This is why it takes many extra steps to re refine used motor oil.

If used motor oil was a better starting point for base oil there would be less processes and steps to re refine it than raw crude.

 

[Nickdfresh]

Originally Posted By: ferrari512
Originally Posted By: Nickdfresh
Originally Posted By: ferrari512
It a proven fact

Check out Noria oil analysis boards on reclaimed oil


Funny, but the U.S. military uses recycled Safety Kleen oil almost exclusively. It's a proven fact! It's science!

The US military does not use Safety Kleen oil exclusively, many Government entities are required to use recycled oil if its available.

The U.S. Military treats their regular vehicles poorly anyway add recycled oil to them they dont care, in expensive turbine engines they do not use recycled oil.


In peacetime, the U.S. military DOES NOT treat their vehicles poorly. Extensive maintenance regimens and even rebuilds are common as weapons platforms like tanks are in service for decades (the M-1 was conceived in 1973 i.e.). And I believe the Army is considering replacing the turbine in the M1A3 with a MTU turbo-diesel eventually.

Secondly, AFAIK Safety Kleen is the exclusive supplier of the three main grades used by the military...

 

[Tros]

Originally Posted By: ferrari512

This is why it takes many extra steps to re refine used motor oil.

If used motor oil was a better starting point for base oil there would be less processes and steps to re refine it than raw crude.

What additional steps are needed to re-refine used motor oil vs refining crude oil?

 

[fdcg27]

Originally Posted By: ferrari512
Originally Posted By: Zako2
Originally Posted By: ferrari512
it was various sources of oil from many cars I never saw again,the used oil tanks were a nasty mix of all kinds of junk oil.


However, it has been pointed out already that this nasty mix is much closer to engine oil than the mineral oil coming out of ground. Both contain impurities that need to be removed. Both go through the same refining process. The used motor oil is much easier to refine because it's much closer to the motor oil product that goes into your engine than untreated mineral oil. The sources of the base stock may be different. So what? We're talking about a conventional motor oil for normal, non-extended oil change intervals that's priced accordingly. Amsoil is a boutique synthetic oil brand.


Used motor oil has nasty contaminants in it from the combustion process that are not in crude,arsenic,metals,lead,carbon, pcbs,halogens,oxidants,ash,sulfer,particulate matter etc.





Well, there are a couple of VOAs of Nextgen in that forum, and PQIA has posted one as well.
Looks pretty similar to any other virgin oil in contaminant levels, and better than many.
Now I know that you're going to tell us that the contaminants you're writing of wouldn't be detected in a typical VOA.
While this may be true, if the observable contaminant levels are low, why would anyone worry about more esoteric ones?
As more UOAs of this oil show up, I think that any fears anyone may have of using this oil should be resolved.

 

[ferrari512]

Originally Posted By: Tros
Originally Posted By: ferrari512

This is why it takes many extra steps to re refine used motor oil.

If used motor oil was a better starting point for base oil there would be less processes and steps to re refine it than raw crude.

What additional steps are needed to re-refine used motor oil vs refining crude oil?




If used motor oil was a better starting point for base oil there would be less processes and steps to re refine it than raw crude. [/quote]
What additional steps are needed to re-refine used motor oil vs refining crude oil?[/quote]

Its a different process, catalysts are used along with high vacuum distillation, dehydrogenation and thermal oxidizers and thin film evaporators.

You cannot heat the used oil over certain temps or the base oil be damaged.

heres a link to some methods used

http://www.usedoilrefining.com/other_process.asp

 

[dave1251]

I give up your thoughts on this matter are as factual as my opinion on who the next great football player will be. Which is to say not based too much on fact but a lot speculation. I will add that for the sake of the argument I gave you is from my knowledge and experience not from anything Valvoline has stated. Other than what percentage that Nextgen is formulated from Recycled basestocks. You have constantly contradicted your statements and have been proven wrong not only by myself but many other member's that have provided you with clear fact and other points of view and have backed that up with articles you can read and verify yourself from more than one source. You have given opinion and few facts that you provided backed up what I and many others have told you. No one here is drinking any kool-aid as you have stated but have tried to teach you were you have error'd.

 

[ferrari512]

Originally Posted By: dave1251
I give up your thoughts on this matter are as factual as my opinion on who the next great football player will be. Which is to say not based too much on fact but a lot speculation. I will add that for the sake of the argument I gave you is from my knowledge and experience not from anything Valvoline has stated. Other than what percentage that Nextgen is formulated from Recycled basestocks. You have constantly contradicted your statements and have been proven wrong not only by myself but many other member's that have provided you with clear fact and other points of view and have backed that up with articles you can read and verify yourself from more than one source. You have given opinion and few facts that you provided backed up what I and many others have told you. No one here is drinking any kool-aid as you have stated but have tried to teach you were you have error'd.


How have i contradicted myself?

I have posted the same facts and information everytime.

In the end result it really doesnt matter my opinion or yours as most people I know will not accept recycled oil at same or similar price as new oil, the only reason Nextgen has lasted this long on shelves is the rebate program of giving away the oil, that cant last.

Walmart has already began dropping Nextgen, after all the giveaways and rebates stop so will other retailers as the few greeenies that would buy this oil will not support it in mass retailers.

 

[ferrari512]

Originally Posted By: dave1251
I give up your thoughts on this matter are as factual as my opinion on who the next great football player will be. Which is to say not based too much on fact but a lot speculation. I will add that for the sake of the argument I gave you is from my knowledge and experience not from anything Valvoline has stated. Other than what percentage that Nextgen is formulated from Recycled basestocks. You have constantly contradicted your statements and have been proven wrong not only by myself but many other member's that have provided you with clear fact and other points of view and have backed that up with articles you can read and verify yourself from more than one source. You have given opinion and few facts that you provided backed up what I and many others have told you. No one here is drinking any kool-aid as you have stated but have tried to teach you were you have error'd.


http://www.noln.net/forum.php

type green oil in forum, the few that responded said it doesnt sell at quick lubes, as you will probably try and tell me I am not incorrect again and Nextgen is selling great.