New brake pad and rotor installation questions

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Whew, I don't even know what to contribute here. Car care is akin to health care challenges. It is extremely difficult to find a competent, trustful mechanic. Word-of-mouth is maybe the best way? I almost can not believe that any mechanic does what we DIYers do regarding cleaning everything up prior to reassembly.

Kudos for educating yourself and self advocating about brake work. Many/most of us here probably forget what it is was like when we just "drove cars" and didn't have knowledge about the mechanical workings. Keep up the learning so you can communicate with the mechanics and avoid being taken advantage of. I'm not sure that a brakes-only shop is any better than Firestone, etc.. Good luck finding a good shop - sorry I can't help more (as you found out, YouTube is priceless).
 

rcs

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Whew, I don't even know what to contribute here. Car care is akin to health care challenges. It is extremely difficult to find a competent, trustful mechanic. Word-of-mouth is maybe the best way? I almost can not believe that any mechanic does what we DIYers do regarding cleaning everything up prior to reassembly.

Kudos for educating yourself and self advocating about brake work. Many/most of us here probably forget what it is was like when we just "drove cars" and didn't have knowledge about the mechanical workings. Keep up the learning so you can communicate with the mechanics and avoid being taken advantage of. I'm not sure that a brakes-only shop is any better than Firestone, etc.. Good luck finding a good shop - sorry I can't help more (as you found out, YouTube is priceless).
Thanks so much and very true regarding care maintenance and health maintenance! Where are you located in MI. I am in the southeast area.
 

rcs

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Another fan of Akebono Pro Act ceramic pads.
RitcheyRch,...I had these on the last time. And I liked the Akebono's initially. But I don't know what happened after a couple of years. They became loose in the clips. so either my mechanic did not use the new clips, and used the original OEM ones and perhaps they did not fit correctly, or something else occurred? But I have never had that happen before on any other vehicle. I do mostly city driving, but not necessarily stop and go traffic, I only have a 15-20 minute drive to work, thankfully. But it was almost like the pads shrunk down? Again I cannot be technical here, I am just reporting what I saw. But the pads getting loose in the clips was a pretty scary scenario for me. I had no idea what that metal clanking sound was, but it was awful every time I went over a bump.
So I am trying the Dynamic Friction ones now, and will see how they work out.
 
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Now if you could talk mechanic lingo well enough to convince the mechanic you knew what you were doing with respect to brakes and were really trying to get tips to maybe do it yourself in the future, then you might have more success.
Actually shops that are welcome to questions are good indies. These tend to be old school and let customers provide parts and walk under the car with the tech. I was not able to get an 02 sensor out last weekend so I had to call the indie and I actually told them what I found and saw. I get it--do this with a dealer or chain store? No way.

With brakes, I did learn that with Toyota products they have quite pricey shims (16 per car or 4 per wheel--these are usually discarded by someone along the way and can translate into a thud when breaking as the pads shift), also, on my car that has fixed calipers front and rear, to my surprise 8 caliper bolts are supposed to be replaced as well (confession--I didn't when I did my brakes but I do have them on hand as well as the shims).

I'd ask if there's anything out of the ordinary with the brakes--I didn't read through all the threads so not sure if we know the make/model.

p.s. I use Akebono ProActs too on my wife's GM and my Toyota product. BMW I've only used OE pads and rotors, in the interest of noise, and wanting semi-metallic.
 
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IMO bedding is less critical for "normal" pads.
100% agree. I did 4 rotors and pads on my BMW maybe 6 years ago, and I listened to the forum and bedded the brakes. First of all, a guy behind me wanted to get out of his car and kill me lol

Secondly, when I got home, my rotors were glowing orang'ish. I was thinking oh s*** that doesn't look right.

A senior member on the forum who has a lot of experience said hey geniuses, when you buy a brand new BMW, there's a hang tag on the rearview mirror telling you to go easy on the brakes for the first x km. That hang tag should also be in the box of pads for the tech to place in a customer's car. So why would you want to do the opposite? DOH!!!!

There was no harm thank goodness, but never again, not on OE brakes. On a track setup? Sure.
 

rcs

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Thanks guys, I will keep this in mind. I am going to check their website and see what the procedure is, if any, after installation.
 
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Honda Pilot has crappy rotors, as most Asian vehicles do. It is undersized for that weight and material is not appropriate. So, that is actually what you want to pay attention to. Get better rotors like EBC, Hawk etc.
Akebono from performance stand point is typical ceramic pad. It will do its job and it is made well.
Dynamic Friction is IMO only when you don’t have other options. I have some experience with them and quality is really not something, nowhere near Akebono (there is a reason why Akebono is OE supplier).
If you want more aggressive pad, go EBC GreenStuff or Pagid if available (it was for my Toyota Sienna). But, expect lot more dust.
 

rcs

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Honda Pilot has crappy rotors, as most Asian vehicles do. It is undersized for that weight and material is not appropriate. So, that is actually what you want to pay attention to. Get better rotors like EBC, Hawk etc.
Akebono from performance stand point is typical ceramic pad. It will do its job and it is made well.
Dynamic Friction is IMO only when you don’t have other options. I have some experience with them and quality is really not something, nowhere near Akebono (there is a reason why Akebono is OE supplier).
If you want more aggressive pad, go EBC GreenStuff or Pagid if available (it was for my Toyota Sienna). But, expect lot more dust.
Oh No,..I am sorry to hear about the Dynamic Friction!!! I guess I can always send them back to Rock Auto. BUT does Akebono make rotors anymore???!!! I could not find them on line! I am not crazy about the dust issue, as I detail my own vehicle. So where do you guys get Akebono pads and rotors from?
 
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Oh great to know!
Breaking-in, if you read the StopTech article only applies to high-performance brake pads and semi-metallic pads, neither of which Honda uses nor is recommended for a “normal” car. Semi-metallic pads have their place on heavier trucks and most European cars, and can be used in “severe” service - like police cars.

Drive normally but avoid emergency or panic stops unless you need to for the first 100 miles of getting new brakes. Honda, as do many automakers use a “ceramic” non-asbestos organic brake pad that work via the “cohesive” friction effect. What that means is the pad applies a microscopically thin layer of its material onto your brake rotors. When you hit the brakes, that thin transfer layer works with the pads like an adhesive to produce friction to slow you down. The contrast to that is “abrasive” friction, which uses harder, metallic pads to literally grab the rotor for friction.
 

rcs

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Breaking-in, if you read the StopTech article only applies to high-performance brake pads and semi-metallic pads, neither of which Honda uses nor is recommended for a “normal” car. Semi-metallic pads have their place on heavier trucks and most European cars, and can be used in “severe” service - like police cars.

Drive normally but avoid emergency or panic stops unless you need to for the first 100 miles of getting new brakes. Honda, as do many automakers use a “ceramic” non-asbestos organic brake pad that work via the “cohesive” friction effect. What that means is the pad applies a microscopically thin layer of its material onto your brake rotors. When you hit the brakes, that thin transfer layer works with the pads like an adhesive to produce friction to slow you down. The contrast to that is “abrasive” friction, which uses harder, metallic pads to literally grab the rotor for friction.
Thanks so much for that information. I love learning new things. I just spoke with a rep from Dynamic Friction company and he stated there is no break in period with their pads or rotors. Akebono stated there is no break in period with their pads either.

NOW my biggest problem is finding Akebono rotors,...I honestly don't think they make them anymore...anyone know if this is true??
 
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Oh No,..I am sorry to hear about the Dynamic Friction!!! I guess I can always send them back to Rock Auto. BUT does Akebono make rotors anymore???!!! I could not find them on line! I am not crazy about the dust issue, as I detail my own vehicle. So where do you guys get Akebono pads and rotors from?
Akebono does sell their branded rotors but only from a wholesaler like WorldPac, who is owned by CarQuest/Advance Auto Parts. They are a high-quality Chinese rotor, I would put them next to the “premium” offerings from Centric and Raybestos for quality. RockAuto has Akebono pads, and Advance/CarQuest can get them for you.

Honda and Toyota tend to have their rotors made in-house by an affiliated company or a formerly-owned division they have a stake in. In Honda’s case, they sold their long-time brake supplier, Nissin to Hitachi. Toyota owns a majority of Aisin/Advics.
 

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Akebono does sell their branded rotors but only from a wholesaler like WorldPac, who is owned by CarQuest/Advance Auto Parts. They are a high-quality Chinese rotor, I would put them next to the “premium” offerings from Centric and Raybestos for quality. RockAuto has Akebono pads, and Advance/CarQuest can get them for you.

Honda and Toyota tend to have their rotors made in-house by an affiliated company or a formerly-owned division they have a stake in. In Honda’s case, they sold their long-time brake supplier, Nissin to Hitachi. Toyota owns a majority of Aisin/Advics.
Thanks so much nthach! I just spoke with a rep from Akebono who sent me to WorldPAc, and indeed WorldPac makes the rotors to Akebono's specs. My mechanic has an account with WorldPAc, but I don't want him to put them on, I am going to have another shop or the dealership do it.
So you are saying I can purchase the Akebono rotors from Advance/CarQuest? I will look on their website. I am also hoping that the Akebono rotors are coated as I live in MI rust belt. I know the Dynamic Friction ones are coated. I also know the coating does wear off over time like 400 miles or so, that is what the rep from Dynamic Friction stated to me directly.
Thanks for the tips and info! I am on to more searching!
 
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One more thing if you are in a dry hot place like southern California you have little to worry about as far as proper cleaning as there will be little rust. On the other hand if you live in the rust belt where they dump on salt on the roads in the winter then brakes may need to be cleaned and lub'ed yearly.
It does snow in Southern California. But they don't use salt (or mag chloride) like the East Coast, they, like PA, throw cinders after plowing. Unlike the NorthEast, CA has chain control laws, so when it snows, CA local police may make you put on chains/cables, or you cannot proceed.
 

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It does snow in Southern California. But they don't use salt (or mag chloride) like the East Coast, they, like PA, throw cinders after plowing. Unlike the NorthEast, CA has chain control laws, so when it snows, CA local police may make you put on chains/cables, or you cannot proceed.
interesting...
 
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Thank you for the clarification. I purchased the Dynamic Friction Geo 5000. The reason why I went with those instead of the Akebono ProAct, is because the Dynamic Friction are bigger pads. "The Critic" on this website has used them also, with no issues.
The bedding is not something I would do. I have read about it.
I would hope the mechanic/tech doing the job would do that. I thought perhaps I read somewhere if not done correctly it can really mess up your rotors and or pads. Not sure if i have that correct either, but I know it is an important procedure.
You will have to read the included instructions with the brake pads to see how you break in the pads after installation, or you contact Dynamic Friction for advice.

Akebono Euro Ceramics (which I have a love-hate relationship with), just requires gentle to medium braking for the first 1000 miles.... the more local driving, the better (ie more stops).
Centric Posi-Quiet Ceramic, while Centric claims no bedding necessary, I hated them until I bedded them on a empty highway in the middle of the night.

EBC pads, have a "Brake-in" coating, that has a very abrasive layer, meant to condition a new rotor before you bed the pads, and transfer a pad layer over to the rotors. So you have to drive and brake until the layer wears out (and the pads will be less grabby when it does), then you can bed it in, if you choose to
 
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I did not know that the brakes needed to be cleaned and lubed yearly. My regular mechanic never mentioned that to me.
"Clean and lube" what? Clean the rotors? Lube the pins? Does anyone actually do that yearly?

Asking a professional mechanic how they do the install procedure, especially when you don't know if what they do is actually good or not, doesn't sound very useful, and probably would annoy the mechanic. Also, it's brakes. They're only so complicated.
 
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Oh No,..I am sorry to hear about the Dynamic Friction!!! I guess I can always send them back to Rock Auto. BUT does Akebono make rotors anymore???!!! I could not find them on line! I am not crazy about the dust issue, as I detail my own vehicle. So where do you guys get Akebono pads and rotors from?
Nah, I needed track pads only for one day and got theirs for rear. To be honest, I would never put their pads for daily stuff. Rotors, yeah.
 
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