MTF for 02Q transmission.

[Henrik]

Hi guys.

I have a question for you; my 02Q transmission (6 speed) is requiring a G052171A2 Fluid from VW OEM, but im having trouble shifting into 2 gear when cold (about 0 degress celsius or about 30 degress Fahrenheit for you US guys) The gear actually crunch for the first couple of kilometers i drive before the oil starts to warm up. I have heard there was alot of other good oil alternatives to solve this problem, but the person stating that said i should ask in here, when my eyes started spinning around when he talked about AW/EP and so on. Im a oil noob, so take it easy on me

I have heard that the OEM fluid Is about 6.3-6.7 sct at 100 degress.
I have tried a couple of different fluids; Redline MTL, Castrol syntrans multivehicle 75-90, castrol syntrans V FE 75-80, Castrol syntrans B 75W and the OEM oil.
Nothing have really changed the shifting in cold.
But i have read alot about synchromesh fluids, but i can´t seem to make up my mind if it good enough for my gearbox? I find a couple of things quite confusing so i was hoping you guys could solve it?

1; It don´t seems that any synchromesh oil is carrying a GL rating? Hows that? I thought that was the bare minimum for a transaxle fluid?

2; Is the synchromesh fluid, as opposed to G052171A2 Fluid a suitable alternative?

Hope you can help

 

[aquariuscsm]

Use only what your fsm specs. Manual transmissions just shift like that when they're cold. Shift it easy till the fluid warms up,then you'll be good to go.

 

[MolaKule]

Hi Henrik and Welcome.

I respectfully suggest you read this white paper as I am confident it will answer some of your questions:

Manual Transmission and Fluid Technology

 

[Henrik]

Originally Posted By: MolaKule
Hi Henrik and Welcome.

I respectfully suggest you read this white paper as I am confident it will answer some of your questions:

Manual Transmission and Fluid Technology


Thanks alot

I have actually read the thread, problem is, it raised alot more questions than i had before Reading it

My oem fluid is in the same range 6.3-6.9 and synchromesh is around 7, so that should be clear?
My concern is that i cant figure if those (specially amsoil mtf and pennzoil synchromesh) carry a gl dating and if those fluids is good enough for the gearbox? Your link list them as a gl fluid, but the manufacturs does not? Is there a reason for that?
Im hoping to use these fluids, cause as far as i have read, they contain some special friction modifer to improved synchro action? Or am i wrong? Hope you Can answer my questions

Long live Danish iphone texting...

 

[UrS4]

Hej Henrik!

Hvilken bil og motor snakker vi om, hvor mange km har den koert?

 

[Henrik]

Originally Posted By: UrS4
Hej Henrik!

Hvilken bil og motor snakker vi om, hvor mange km har den koert?


Det er en seat Leon fr 2.0 TSI fra 2010. Den har kørt nogle af 67.000km og er et problem som den har haft længe.

 

[MolaKule]

Quote:
My oem fluid is in the same range 6.3-6.9 and synchromesh is around 7, so that should be clear?
My concern is that i cant figure if those (specially amsoil mtf and pennzoil synchromesh) carry a gl dating and if those fluids is good enough for the gearbox? Your link list them as a gl fluid, but the manufacturs does not? Is there a reason for that?
Im hoping to use these fluids, cause as far as i have read, they contain some special friction modifer to improved synchro action? Or am i wrong? Hope you Can answer my questions smile


First of all, most manual transmissions for cars and light trucks are synchronized transmissions and the fluids I listed are ALL synchromesh fluids with the appropriate friction modifiers.

All have at least a GL-4 protection rating because of the additive signatures, regardless of labeling.

So for your viscosity range and climate, I would think the "A." list would be preferable:

Quote:


A. The four MTL fluids closest to a Kinematic Viscosity of 6.1 (About the same viscosity as a DexronVI) or so are:

1. Castrol Syntrans FE 75W,

2. BMW (Pentosin) MTF-LT-3,

3. Honda MTII or MTF 2.

4. Ford FML-XT-11-QDC

B. The next higher viscosity MTL would be the 7.5 cSt versions (About the same viscosity as a DexronIII)

1. Royal Purple's Synchromax

2. Ravenol MTF-2

3. Honda MTF

4. VW part number G052512A2

5. GM Manual Transmission and Transfer Case Fluid

6. BMW (Pentosin MTF 2) MTF-LT-1, 2

 

[Henrik]

Originally Posted By: MolaKule
Quote:
My oem fluid is in the same range 6.3-6.9 and synchromesh is around 7, so that should be clear?
My concern is that i cant figure if those (specially amsoil mtf and pennzoil synchromesh) carry a gl dating and if those fluids is good enough for the gearbox? Your link list them as a gl fluid, but the manufacturs does not? Is there a reason for that?
Im hoping to use these fluids, cause as far as i have read, they contain some special friction modifer to improved synchro action? Or am i wrong? Hope you Can answer my questions smile


First of all, most manual transmissions for cars and light trucks are synchronized transmissions and the fluids I listed are ALL synchromesh fluids with the appropriate friction modifiers.

All have at least a GL-4 protection rating because of the additive signatures, regardless of labeling.

So for your viscosity range and climate, I would think the "A." list would be preferable:

Quote:


A. The four MTL fluids closest to a Kinematic Viscosity of 6.1 (About the same viscosity as a DexronVI) or so are:

1. Castrol Syntrans FE 75W,

2. BMW (Pentosin) MTF-LT-3,

3. Honda MTII or MTF 2.

4. Ford FML-XT-11-QDC

B. The next higher viscosity MTL would be the 7.5 cSt versions (About the same viscosity as a DexronIII)

1. Royal Purple's Synchromax

2. Ravenol MTF-2

3. Honda MTF

4. VW part number G052512A2

5. GM Manual Transmission and Transfer Case Fluid

6. BMW (Pentosin MTF 2) MTF-LT-1, 2



Okay i see

It just seems confusing not to use the GL rating, cause that would be what the typical buyer is looking for? :S hmm, their choise i guess.

But then comes the question, i have already tried the Castrol Syntrans FE 75W, without much succes, is there any fluid there is better suited for synchro performance than others? Because, it was best when i tried the redline MTL but still not 100%, and that is a thicker fluid?

The other thing, the fluids you are listing are measured at 100 degress, but how often are a transmission fluid going to reach those temps?
Cause i see alot of them are pretty close in viscosity at 100 degress, but when you look at 40 degress they vary alot more, that got me thinking that my problem around the 0 degress celsius, maybe be because the fluids im using is just to thick at that point?

 

[MolaKule]

I don't know what you mean by 100%.

This IS an MT after all and sometimes you have to experiment with various MTL's to find the sweet spot.

If MTL 70W80 performed better than theCastrol, then go back to it.

Fluids are tested at 40C and 100C to arrive at a VI.


I can guarantee that here in the US's southwest temps can way over that on a typical summer day.

The 40C Kinetic Viscosity test number or the Brookfield number will give an indication of fluidity at low temps. In your climate I would think you would want fluids of around 6 to 7 cST at 100C but find one with lower numbers for the 40C and Brookfield viscosities.

Quote:
Okay i see. It just seems confusing not to use the GL rating, cause that would be what the typical buyer is looking for? :S hmm, their choise i guess.


Yep, I don't control marketing for any of these companies.

 

[Henrik]

Think i follow you. So just to catch up again, i have found some acdelco synchromesh friction modified.
Would that be a safe oil to use for my transmission?
All sorts of different Info going about its not good for a transaxle cause its to thin and others say its a GOD fluid?

As far as i Can tell, its actually a little thicker at 100 degress (around 8 cst vs 6-7 cst for my oem) but alot lower at 40 degress compared to others (no Info on oem)

Is the "friction modified" in any Way bad for the transaxle? Im thinking compared to the "normal" version without the friction modified?

I dont want a liquid that is ruining my transmission far to quickly

Sorry if this a bit dragging out, but im sure its also good Info for the rest of the World looking this up on google

 

[aquariuscsm]

I experimented alot to find the best mtf for my car. Amsoil MTG is the best,hands down.

Does your car require a 75W90 GL4?

 

[Henrik]

It takes G052171a2 fluid from the factory, its supposed to be 75w90, but in reality its thinner than some ATF. Most manufacturs recommend 75-80 gl4 for it.

 

[MolaKule]

It is not unusual for the Manf. to change specs when they get shifting complaints from customers.