motul 8100 vs castrol new edge M

[alex1212]

because castrol almost never says the HTHS , i send an email for 5-30 M and HTHS..here is their answer ..

lubricants_uk <[email protected]>
Monday 16/8/2021 2:18 p.m


Good day,

The HTHS value at 150 ° C for the Castrol EDGE 5W-30 M is 3.5 cP.

Kind regards,

Charles Abbey

Castrol Technical Service Team – AUTO

mailto: [email protected]
https://www.castrol.com/en_gb
Phone: 0049 234 539 7082

 

[kschachn]

The HTHS value at 150 ° C for the Castrol EDGE 5W-30 M is 3.5 cP.

Which in true Castrol fashion probably is a reporting of the minimum HT/HS we already knew was required by the approvals.

 

[alex1212]

true,i feel the same with castrol,Charles technisian probably wanted to get rid of me and send me the limit...do you think that could be below the limit of 3.5 and castrol lies? i don't know if they can cheat .getting the approval , from the organisation ,does the organisation checks the HTHS or they are just based from what they get from castrol? i mean what is the procedure you guys know?

 

[alex1212]

my only concern with kind of oil to use is because DI engines are very sensitive with carbon build up,valve deposits,e.t.c. if the oil choice is a great factor to cause these i want to know..an then make a good choice..i don't fully trust the dealership..
what i have learned is tha if i want to choose a wright oil for my engine then it has to be from the manual,meaning 5-30 or 5-40 ,don't see a reason fro 0, to have SN spec and a high HTHS. a3/b4 or c3? a3/b4 is better for wear and c3 better for catalytic converters..some say also that for DI engines to have more magnesium is better than more calcium which is hard to find sometimes..

 

[DuckRyder]

OK.

To further put this in perspective an E87 BMW would be a 1 series 5 door hatch? This is a car not sold in the States in 2010.

a 1600 is either an N43 or N45. Do you know which? The small displacement engine was never sold in the states as far as I know, however one or both may have been sold here in larger displacements.

To try to answer your questions in no particular order.

Flashpoint: Flashpoint is frequently discussed in UOAs as a point of reference to indicate fuel dilution, I don't believe it is a factor for consideration in oil choice.

"Flush": Different oils should be compatible so a flush should not be necessary, the vast majority of people would not even consider it. Certainly a flush with the oil to be used would make for a clearer UOA and I have done it for that purpose, I see no other purpose in this scenario.

Viscosity: Consider the ambient temperature, the engine temperature should be controlled. The only caveat being if you have the capability to accurately monitor the OIL temperature, do so and report it.

Most if not all of the oils you mention are unfamiliar in the US, so you might place greater weight on persons who answer from a region in which those oils are familiar, however.

Were it me, I would chose the oil which carried the official approval (not "Recommended for") which I liked and which I believed I would be able to source a reliable supply of.

I should disclose that I do not believe all the BITOG hand wringing about this stuff makes a bit of difference in the real world, but I do understand the intrest.

 

[kschachn]

my only concern with kind of oil to use is because DI engines are very sensitive with carbon build up,valve deposits,e.t.c. if the oil choice is a great factor to cause these i want to know..an then make a good choice..i don't fully trust the dealership..
what i have learned is tha if i want to choose a wright oil for my engine then it has to be from the manual,meaning 5-30 or 5-40 ,don't see a reason fro 0, to have SN spec and a high HTHS. a3/b4 or c3? a3/b4 is better for wear and c3 better for catalytic converters..some say also that for DI engines to have more magnesium is better than more calcium which is hard to find sometimes..

I'd just as soon shoot myself over all that hand wringing and flapping about rather than merely going out and getting an oil that carries the required approval for the vehicle. Your dealership doesn't (or shouldn't) be making the choice, instead the manufacturer should be doing that. And if you get an oil with the proper approval that will dictate the required HT/HS which would eliminate lost sleep over the grade. Grade and "weight" are irrelevant at that point and likely the winter rating is as well depending on your location.

 

[alex1212]

I'd just as soon shoot myself over all that hand wringing and flapping about rather than merely going out and getting an oil that carries the required approval for the vehicle. Your dealership doesn't (or shouldn't) be making the choice, instead the manufacturer should be doing that. And if you get an oil with the proper approval that will dictate the required HT/HS which would eliminate lost sleep over the grade. Grade and "weight" are irrelevant at that point and likely the winter rating is as well depending on your location.

well here is the thing.... the manual / manufacturer, says a3/b4 oil is the one .so when i bought the car ,the engine had a3/b4 oil..which means higher HTHS than 3.5.

but several years after i bought the car and went for an oil change at the dealership for the first time ,i was informed that the dealership and bmw for europe changed the norm to c3 oils.. and they both suggest c3 5-30 for Greece..and the official oil is coming from shell as you all know.i dont't know its HTHS.
so what i am asking here is which is the required HTHS? is the limit 3.5 for mid/low saps enough or is better to choose one with higher? a a3/b4 oil with about 3.8?
for my DI ENGINE, should i stay with the initial norm ,a3/b4 oil with higher from 3.5 HTHS or should i keep on with the c3 oils ? which is better for the engine? simple question..

 

[edyvw]

now we are talking!! yeah, that is what i was referring too, if its true..i think thats the majority of people who have engine oil as a hobby.in all the forums i have read so far. a big example of this is in all forums is the mobil esp formula 5-30 and the new esp 5-30 with almost 20 points down flash point..old 254 ,new 235 i think...the explanation they gine is the turn of mobil to a less pao/ester at base oil and no more full synthetic from these elements but more hc synhtesis with stronger additives .i hope my english are good enough in technical terms speaking.

...and then you say ''What is relevant to me is the approvals, specifications or licenses the oil holds (or does not hold).'' but thats so simple.. is like you equal your level of understanding with me

No it is not BIG example.
Old ESP Formula 5W30 while having a really low Noack (5.6%) and flash point of 254c, it had horrid oxidation. Also, it was not even the majority "true synthetics." It was VISOM base stock.
New ESP 5W30 has GTL, PAO and Esters. Bit higher Noack (7.1% still extremely good result) and lower flash point. But oxidation is kept in check. There is much more to this than just Naock or flash point.

 

[alex1212]

OK.

To further put this in perspective an E87 BMW would be a 1 series 5 door hatch? This is a car not sold in the States in 2010.

a 1600 is either an N43 or N45. Do you know which? The small displacement engine was never sold in the states as far as I know, however one or both may have been sold here in larger displacements.

yes thats exactly is the engine and its the N43 one.i am aware that it was not sold there in us,larger ones only did.thank you for your answer..To try to answer your questions in no particular order.
the thing with this DI engine is that had a lot of problems with the fuel system,from fuel pumps ,to injectors and NOX. and timing chain. most of them had to replaced most of the these parts my self too.what is the problem? we never learned...some say crap parts from bosch..some say bad engine design .some say it was the longlife oil service..which i did't follow so it could be all, the others.. some accused the fuel quality which is low.

but as far as the oil weight selection was a discussion if a 40 should be better for our country..but problems like these happen also in England and Germany ,they are using 5-30 too, so it could be the all the other factors i mention earlier..

and bmw did't anounced a recall for their fault and owners had to pay the costs..that's why most of bmw owners from that period ,2004 to 2012,e 8x,e9x models are pissed off with bmw..

do you know what is the official info the official service department they give to these owners? once a week at least drive an 1 hour without stopping ,over 3000 rpm steady ,so carbon build up disappears..what the ..i bought a 1600 cc not a supercar..

Flashpoint: Flashpoint is frequently discussed in UOAs as a point of reference to indicate fuel dilution, I don't believe it is a factor for consideration in oil choice.

"Flush": Different oils should be compatible so a flush should not be necessary, the vast majority of people would not even consider it. Certainly a flush with the oil to be used would make for a clearer UOA and I have done it for that purpose, I see no other purpose in this scenario.

Viscosity: Consider the ambient temperature, the engine temperature should be controlled. The only caveat being if you have the capability to accurately monitor the OIL temperature, do so and report it.

Most if not all of the oils you mention are unfamiliar in the US, so you might place greater weight on persons who answer from a region in which those oils are familiar, however.

unfortunately most of them stopped discussing it ,they are bored ..i read many forums mostly from England and when a question with oil begins they only say the same thing..choose what you like from the approved ones.end of discusion.

Were it me, I would chose the oil which carried the official approval (not "Recommended for") which I liked and which I believed I would be able to source a reliable supply of.

I should disclose that I do not believe all the BITOG hand wringing about this stuff makes a bit of difference in the real world, but I do understand the intrest.

but this is an oil forum, must split hairs thats why it was created ,wright?

 

[alex1212]

No it is not BIG example.
Old ESP Formula 5W30 while having a really low Noack (5.6%) and flash point of 254c, it had horrid oxidation. Also, it was not even the majority "true synthetics." It was VISOM base stock.
New ESP 5W30 has GTL, PAO and Esters. Bit higher Noack (7.1% still extremely good result) and lower flash point. But oxidation is kept in check. There is much more to this than just Naock or flash point.

edyvw thanks for your answer..from your posts here in this forum ,i respect your knowledge.
wow, even i read so much about olls and read so many from tech sites, this VISOM base stock ,is a term first time i see. and didn't know about the oxidation from this oil..one of my friends use it for years..he is going to replace it next year with motul because the new formula from the new mobil 1 esp 5-30 doesn't have a bmw approval anymore.he is going by the book!

so how do you learn about the oxidation of an oil? you say its still kept in check.

i see you have a bimmer too. and 2 german made.and we share the same weather more or less.
so,how do you choose an oil ? from what i have seen from your posts HTHS thought it was the most important ..
you run a castrol 0-40..why not 5-30? from weather point of view its closer to your ambient temp.because 0-40 is the german made which is truly synthetic as we called them and 5-30 is not?

 

[edyvw]

edyvw thanks for your answer..from your posts here in this forum ,i respect your knowledge.
wow, even i read so much about olls and read so many from tech sites, this VISOM base stock ,is a term first time i see. and didn't know about the oxidation from this oil..one of my friends use it for years..he is going to replace it next year with motul because the new formula from the new mobil 1 esp 5-30 doesn't have a bmw approval anymore.he is going by the book!

so how do you learn about the oxidation of an oil? you say its still kept in check.

i see you have a bimmer too. and 2 german made.and we share the same weather more or less.
so,how do you choose an oil ? from what i have seen from your posts HTHS thought it was the most important ..
you run a castrol 0-40..why not 5-30? from weather point of view its closer to your ambient temp.because 0-40 is the german made which is truly synthetic as we called them and 5-30 is not?

I am not sure I follow you.
VISOM is old M1 base stock before M1 started to use GTL around 2015.
The reason why M1 ESP 5W30 does not have LL04 is still higher oxidation than what BMW wants. Keep in mind BMW has ridiculous oxidation standards mostly catered to extended OCI.
As for the choice for BMW, there are numerous topics on that. BMW in 2018 had another update of specifications increasing oxidation requirements and specific timing chain test for N20 engines.
Older engines like mine can run pretty much on anything having MB229.5 approval.
Ambient temperature is not an issue. 0W or 5W is irrelevant pretty much in US or EU unless Alaska, north Sweden, Norway or Russia. Altitude is what matters when it comes to cooling. That is what you should worry about. In Greece, any W30 or W40 oil of appropriate approvals will do good.
I choose Castrol 0W40 bcs. I track car, and I track it at a very high altitude. I used M1 0W40, and Pennzoil Platinum (Shell Helix) 5W40. In winter I use Castrol Edge 0W30 or will use M1 0W40, will see in which position the Moon is before I make a decision.

 

[alex1212]

No it is not BIG example.
Old ESP Formula 5W30 while having a really low Noack (5.6%) and flash point of 254c, it had horrid oxidation. Also, it was not even the majority "true synthetics." It was VISOM base stock.
New ESP 5W30 has GTL, PAO and Esters. Bit higher Noack (7.1% still extremely good result) and lower flash point. But oxidation is kept in check. There is much more to this than just Naock or flash point.

in most forums i have read when they are trying to infer base stock composition they do it by reading flash point or pour point specs.and most of them use older mobil 1 esp formula 5-30 and its current reformation , the new one mobil esp 5-30.and they are many because that oil had a lot of fans,thats why i used the ''big example''.
they just thought that older one had same base stock with new one only with less esters.

I am not sure I follow you.
VISOM is old M1 base stock before M1 started to use GTL around 2015.
The reason why M1 ESP 5W30 does not have LL04 is still higher oxidation than what BMW wants. Keep in mind BMW has ridiculous oxidation standards mostly catered to extended OCI.
As for the choice for BMW, there are numerous topics on that. BMW in 2018 had another update of specifications increasing oxidation requirements and specific timing chain test for N20 engines.
Older engines like mine can run pretty much on anything having MB229.5 approval.
Ambient temperature is not an issue. 0W or 5W is irrelevant pretty much in US or EU unless Alaska, north Sweden, Norway or Russia. Altitude is what matters when it comes to cooling. That is what you should worry about. In Greece, any W30 or W40 oil of appropriate approvals will do good.
I choose Castrol 0W40 bcs. I track car, and I track it at a very high altitude. I used M1 0W40, and Pennzoil Platinum (Shell Helix) 5W40. In winter I use Castrol Edge 0W30 or will use M1 0W40, will see in which position the Moon is before I make a decision.

how for me to know that? mobil does not mention it anywhere.in all the other bmw forums i follow nobody mention anything about that. perhaps nobody got that deep as much as you do. we know that shell is gtl based bcs there was an announcement but for mobil no reference..

anyway first time i hear about altitude and oil.
ok, then why oil companies and some very legit sites post that ambient temps relate with engine oils?

Synthetic Oil Explained | Synthetic vs. Conventional Oil |Machinery Lubrication

Synthetic oil is a lubricant made up of artificially made chemical compounds. Read about how synthetic oil compares with conventional oil and more.

www.machinerylubrication.com

When Synthetics Always Makes Sense
Towing and high loads. Slow speed, high load (e.g. towing), long hills, high-mileage engine, long oil service-interval, and high ambient
temperatures are the worst-case scenarios. It's in these cases that oil films get extremely thin and high wear rates can ensue. This can be offset using premium synthetics with the best additive packages.

5W-30 Oil : Is it right for your car?

www.totalparco.com.pk

When should I use 5w30 oil?​

You should always use the oil recommended by your vehicle’s manufacturer. However, 5w30 oil can function in temperatures as low as -30ºC and as high as 40ºC, making it an ideal choice if you drive your car in a place with relatively high seasonal temperature variations.

What does hot weather do to your car? | Prestone

In this guide, we look at the impact heat can have on cars, and what can be done about it.

www.holtsauto.com

Cooling systems rely on coolant/antifreeze to keep all parts of the engine cool. On a hot day, this liquid runs around the engine at a higher temperature, causing some parts of the engine to overheat and fail.

in first page on my post #18 i have a map like many you can find online that relate ambient temps to engine oil temp.why ?

 

[edyvw]

in most forums i have read when they are trying to infer base stock composition they do it by reading flash point or pour point specs.and most of them use older mobil 1 esp formula 5-30 and its current reformation , the new one mobil esp 5-30.and they are many because that oil had a lot of fans,thats why i used the ''big example''.
they just thought that older one had same base stock with new one only with less esters.

how for me to know that? mobil does not mention it anywhere.in all the other bmw forums i follow nobody mention anything about that. perhaps nobody got that deep as much as you do. we know that shell is gtl based bcs there was an announcement but for mobil no reference..

anyway first time i hear about altitude and oil.
ok, then why oil companies and some very legit sites post that ambient temps relate with engine oils?

Synthetic Oil Explained | Synthetic vs. Conventional Oil |Machinery Lubrication

Synthetic oil is a lubricant made up of artificially made chemical compounds. Read about how synthetic oil compares with conventional oil and more.

www.machinerylubrication.com

When Synthetics Always Makes Sense
Towing and high loads. Slow speed, high load (e.g. towing), long hills, high-mileage engine, long oil service-interval, and high ambient
temperatures are the worst-case scenarios. It's in these cases that oil films get extremely thin and high wear rates can ensue. This can be offset using premium synthetics with the best additive packages.

5W-30 Oil : Is it right for your car?

www.totalparco.com.pk

When should I use 5w30 oil?​

You should always use the oil recommended by your vehicle’s manufacturer. However, 5w30 oil can function in temperatures as low as -30ºC and as high as 40ºC, making it an ideal choice if you drive your car in a place with relatively high seasonal temperature variations.

What does hot weather do to your car? | Prestone

In this guide, we look at the impact heat can have on cars, and what can be done about it.

www.holtsauto.com

Cooling systems rely on coolant/antifreeze to keep all parts of the engine cool. On a hot day, this liquid runs around the engine at a higher temperature, causing some parts of the engine to overheat and fail.

in first page on my post #18 i have a map like many you can find online that relate ambient temps to engine oil temp.why ?

You really need to spend more time researching this topic before coming and asking questions to be explained to you.
1. As high as 40c? So how do millions of vehicles using 0W20 oil run in the American Southwest where temperature can go as high as 53c in some areas? My inlaws have Honda Pilot in Las Vegas that runs on 5W20 and the temperature there never drops below 40c from June until September, mostly staying around 46-47c. You think Greece is hot? Go visit Phoenix in July. Your cooling system will maintain oil temperature! Period! My BMW runs in normal regime 113c oil temperature in 40c ambient temperature or -20c.
2. Altitude? I really do not have time to talk about that. You have plenty of sources available on the internet! Why do you think cars overheat on mountain passes? Do you think it is the grade? No, you have steep grades in cities too. Why do you think the coolant system is pressurized?
3. There are numerous discussions about oils, and oil in BMW, here in particular. Just search more.

 

[alex1212]

You really need to spend more time researching this topic before coming and asking questions to be explained to you.
1. As high as 40c? So how do millions of vehicles using 0W20 oil run in the American Southwest where temperature can go as high as 53c in some areas? My inlaws have Honda Pilot in Las Vegas that runs on 5W20 and the temperature there never drops below 40c from June until September, mostly staying around 46-47c. You think Greece is hot? Go visit Phoenix in July. Your cooling system will maintain oil temperature! Period! My BMW runs in normal regime 113c oil temperature in 40c ambient temperature or -20c.
2. Altitude? I really do not have time to talk about that. You have plenty of sources available on the internet! Why do you think cars overheat on mountain passes? Do you think it is the grade? No, you have steep grades in cities too. Why do you think the coolant system is pressurized?
3. There are numerous discussions about oils, and oil in BMW, here in particular. Just search more.

first of all i dont understand why you coming at me! i dont write with attidude,i am just one of these new members who have read numerous things on the internet and wants to hear your opinions.what's wrong with that? i am just quote some things that i have seen on other sites and forums concerning oils.these bold are not my words,its from these sites written by experts like you..i dont aggree or disaggree i just read and quote to have a sivilised conversation.to sort things out in my mind because i learn new things ,which dont aggree with i have learnt so far.

as for bitog ,i told you, i read many ,many topics but its a big forum with hundreds of topics and cant read them all.. and for those i have read i have questions...there are new guys that are new to the forum and get decent treatment like this guy..

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/castrol-0w-30-5w-30-euro-formula-differences.305377/

who also believes that a 20 is weak..i didn't see anyone coming at him.see, people need to open their minds.for them the oil knowledge is not hobby, like you guys do, and depend on experts like you to explain things to them.so they google and search things and sometimes, like always, they find different opinions.there is where they ask questions.

to answer your questions, even when i did searsh and read many topics in bitog to answer my questions ,opinions vary..so i have to ask..just like many new guys do..is it wrong? ..at least i come with some knowledge, wright or wrong which means that in contrast with other new guys i have read things, as you advise me to..so you are wrong about not reading things, i came prepared at some point..maybe with wrong knowledge but not empty like the other new guys and get that treatment?

why so aggresive to me? because i quote things from other tech sites? i did googled what you told me about altitude and you are wright..i didnt mean to cancel your knowledge ,just to quote with what the mass knows and believes..not many sites talking about altitude and oils..so its not that common knowledge.

p.s a tourist from Phoenix in July said its actually hotter here in summer..just to light things up

 

[edyvw]

first of all i dont understand why you coming at me! i dont write with attidude,i am just one of these new members who have read numerous things on the internet and wants to hear your opinions.what's wrong with that? i am just quote some things that i have seen on other sites and forums concerning oils.these bold are not my words,its from these sites written by experts like you..i dont aggree or disaggree i just read and quote to have a sivilised conversation.to sort things out in my mind because i learn new things ,which dont aggree with i have learnt so far.

as for bitog ,i told you, i read many ,many topics but its a big forum with hundreds of topics and cant read them all.. and for those i have read i have questions...there are new guys that are new to the forum and get decent treatment like this guy..

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/castrol-0w-30-5w-30-euro-formula-differences.305377/

who also believes that a 20 is weak..i didn't see anyone coming at him.see, people need to open their minds.for them the oil knowledge is not hobby, like you guys do, and depend on experts like you to explain things to them.so they google and search things and sometimes, like always, they find different opinions.there is where they ask questions.

to answer your questions, even when i did searsh and read many topics in bitog to answer my questions ,opinions vary..so i have to ask..just like many new guys do..is it wrong? ..at least i come with some knowledge, wright or wrong which means that in contrast with other new guys i have read things, as you advise me to..so you are wrong about not reading things, i came prepared at some point..maybe with wrong knowledge but not empty like the other new guys and get that treatment?

why so aggresive to me? because i quote things from other tech sites? i did googled what you told me about altitude and you are wright..i didnt mean to cancel your knowledge ,just to quote with what the mass knows and believes..not many sites talking about altitude and oils..so its not that common knowledge.

p.s a tourist from Phoenix in July said its actually hotter here in summer..just to light things up

You want a definite answer here. No one is going to give you 100% assurance that xyz oil is best for your engine.
The problem is that you constantly coming back with questions that stem from misunderstanding the basics of how engines work.
That is why people are not engaging in your discussion as it became pointless.
Altitude, cooling, oil temperature. Those are basics.

 

[DuckRyder]

...

why so aggresive to me? because i quote things from other tech sites? ....

Perhaps you don't intend so, but your post come across as slightly argumentative. Understanding there is some language barrier, but it comes across as some one who ask a question and then argues with you about it when you answer.

I realize you are trying to select the "best" oil for your use, but understand the available oils, the car, the engine and the locale are unfamiliar to the majority of posters here.

Yes it is an oil forum and yes is a OCD oil forum, but but your question is inherently rooted in opinion. So you're getting widely varried opinion.

In order to find the best you must first define best.

That said returning to your original question, I would do the Specific LL04 if LL04 what your owners manual calls for, just import enough of it to last you a good while and store it properly.

 

[alex1212]

Perhaps you don't intend so, but your post come across as slightly argumentative. Understanding there is some language barrier, but it comes across as some one who ask a question and then argues with you about it when you answer.

you might be right but i wasn't intend to. maybe my mistake was that i tried to write all my questions, wrong or wright ,in one post.but i did it so that i wont make many new topics, useless or not. i explained from the very first posts that there is a language thing and i said i respect all of you. i don't understand how could i be misunderstood after that explanation. i didn't argue, not in a impolite way ,at least i wasn't intend to, writing spirit might be misunderstood sometimes, just quote many opinions from other experts, wrong ok, but opinions.i know you guys maybe are tired of repeating the same things all those years but i am not the only one who posts such wrong info.

I realize you are trying to select the "best" oil for your use, but understand the available oils, the car, the engine and the locale are unfamiliar to the majority of posters here.

so its a domestic, US forum only. i thought ,reading post and from other European members that this was a topic which says European and import oils. thats why i posted there.if thats not the wright topic then please which one is it? i gave you the info ,you need. the engine is familiar but in larger CC in US ,maybe old now ,yes, and not so popular there ,but at bimmerfest( i think eddy posted there too ,if not i apologise for the misunderstanding) bimmerworld,1addicts ,is popular and they are mostly US citizens.so i thought its familiar here too. some of the US members at these sites ,maybe are members here too. and if not ,then i gave you all the technical info, temperatures, problems of the engine and of course specs ,approvals and norm from bmw which happen to be both US and european suitable, A3/B4,LL01 a US norm and C3 BMW LL04 . so i don't see a reason why these are unfamiliar to you . the first norm is what you use and second norm ,there so many topics and posts about it ...and i am not like other guys here who write a question which is the best oil..i want to know about oils and how they work in my engine.i will be the one who will decide which is the most suitable, not the best, but with the help from you.i mean if i wanted a general opinion which is the best and so on ,i would probably stick to my region bmw forums, who all speak and talk about the same things.they dont go deeper like you guys.they dont know that a 0-30 is more sofisticated oil than the 5-30 they all use.if you read european forums of any car brand, there is constantly an argument between ambient temperature and engine temperature, which one counts most for selecting the wright viscosity. so i got tired and they all talked about bitog ,so i came here to clear myself things out.and nobody ,i mean nobody ever mention an info about altitude, which is a good and legit info.i googled it myself. so blame me for my wrong knowledge ,but don't blame for coming here to clear things. and if you are tired to do so ,then give links where i can find the info you are tired to give yourself where to find it in this forum. as i said and proved to you from my links ,i read the forum ,but its impossible to read the whole one .

Yes it is an oil forum and yes is a OCD oil forum, but but your question is inherently rooted in opinion. So you're getting widely varried opinion.

thats not bad, varied opinion.just with civilised and polite way.i am a very kind and polite person and thats what i expect from the others. well a very known ancient Greek philosopher, maybe you have heard of him socrates, said..'' asking is the way to learn the truth and to seek knowledge''..

In order to find the best you must first define best.

as i said i want the most suitable, the best for my engine which has some weird operation problems and i want to make sure that don't come from wrong oil choice. i explained that from the very first begging. now, if i come to the conclusion that its not the oil or the viscosity that may play a part to my engine problems then any approved viscosity or brand is welcomed. i thought that this forum splits hairs.eddy said that he will decide about which oil he will use according to the position to the moon. so thats not complicated and my simple questions is what the forums has a problem with?

That said returning to your original question, I would do the Specific LL04 if LL04 what your owners manual calls for, just import enough of it to last you a good while and store it properly.

if you mean the motul one, this one is very expansive to order from abroad.things were quite affordable when england was in the european union but now after the brexit all the other european countries sell in higher prices and shipping costs.so its not worth it.thats why i am trying to compromise with domestic market.besides i think that specific might be deleted as an oil code. motul x clean 5-40 has the same specs more or less.thanks for your help anyway.

 

[alex1212]

You want a definite answer here. No one is going to give you 100% assurance that xyz oil is best for your engine.
The problem is that you constantly coming back with questions that stem from misunderstanding the basics of how engines work.

That is why people are not engaging in your discussion as it became pointless.

am i the only one? i send you a link from another ember and there are so many others who repeat the same things..that bothers me.don't be unfair eddy, please

Altitude, cooling, oil temperature. Those are basics.

thank you very much for your knowledge, once again.

 

[DuckRyder]

so its a domestic, US forum only.

I didn't say that at all.

But North America, specifically USA and Canada are where the majority of the membership lies.

So, playing around with Motuls recommendation tool (you have to tell it BMW (EU) and 116i 2.0 to get an N43 engine.) their #1 recommendation is

MOTUL 8100 X-MAX 0W-40​

Is that one available?

If you hit other compatible products it gives you the oils on your list and then some.

I'd be tempted to go with the MOTUL 8100 X-CLEAN 5W-40 because it carries both LL04 and Dexos 2 - Which i think is the one you were considering.

With that, i guess I'm out.

 

[alex1212]

MOTUL 8100 X-MAX 0W-40​

Is that one available?

nope its not..ive done that from motul site too. you see, motul has a terrible customer service, zero i would say..they never answer to customers not even for availability. domestic dealer is bad too. they only bring to my country what they want and whenever they want and don't care about the customers.i hear that happens to most countries as well.
well according to my aprovals from bmw ,they give 3 choices.. x clean 5-40, x clean+ 5-30 and x clean efe 5-30. i read here from eddy again,he likes x clean+ 5-30 because of 3,6 HTHS. see i read your forum enough eddy. but in other sites HTHS is 3.5..and i dont trust motul.
but i can run a bmw ll01 oil too...now motul doesnt have outside the bottle an aproval for bmw on x cess 5-40..but there is one in x cess 5-40 gen 2.which didnt came out yet.
motul also lies about many specs.they advertise as 100% synthetic but they are not anymore not since 2014.well they can use the term because they can after castrols trial.they also lie about their hths and tbn.

motul has a hype here in europe as much as LM. mobil 1 and castrol are always classic brands with a lot of customers.but i am not a fan boy.

I'd be tempted to go with the MOTUL 8100 X-CLEAN 5W-40 because it carries both LL04 and Dexos 2 - Which i think is the one you were considering.

With that, i guess I'm out.

so lets say that from what i learnt here..i want an oil..

which is better for my engine a bmw ll04 or bmw ll01?

bmw approval ll04 or bmw ll01 choosing according the manual from 0-30 -0-40 5-30 5-40

mb 229.5 or 229.51
porsche a40 or porsche c30
vw 502/507

synthetic based oil , part of it pao or and some esters
HTHS above 3.5
tbn around 8
viscosity ,a heavy 30 , over 12
noack around 6-8%
low oxidation

not so expensive like the US oils ,redline,torco,amsoil

any suggestions?