Mobil 1 EP 5w30 inferior wear protection?

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AirBull

AirBull

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I've seen a couple of sites now who have tested the wear protection for Mobil 1 5w30 and Mobil 1 5w30 Extended Performance, and the numbers are quite different between the two: 118,000 PSI for the M1 5w30 and just 86,000 PSI for the Extended Performance variety. M1 promotes the EP product as everything the same but better than the standard M1, but if there is this much difference in their wear protection than I don't want to use the EP variant.

I won't even quite go up to 10k miles let alone 15k miles per oil change, but for example the back of the bottle shows the EP offering better protection for high-temperature engines. I asked Mobil about this and they said it was b/c the EP is slightly more resistant to break down and has a higher quantity of additives to allow it to handle the heat a little beter. Okay, great.

If EP is everything the same as the standard M1 but only better, I want to run it in my Dad's Cadillac CTS V-Sport with twin turbos and that big timing chain, as well my wife's Lincoln with the 2.0L turbo four citing the better engine heat protection, (both are GM and Ford spec rated, as well as Honda HTO-06 which specifically speaks to being good for turbochargers.) I'm still on the fence as to whether I want to switch from 5w30 to 0w40 on our Z06 Corvettes, but I definitely do not want to run EP in our LS6 and LS7 motors if it has inferior wear protection!.
 
Originally Posted By: AirBull
I've seen a couple of sites now who have tested the wear protection for Mobil 1 5w30 and Mobil 1 5w30 Extended Performance, and the numbers are quite different between the two: 118,000 PSI for the M1 5w30 and just 86,000 PSI for the Extended Performance variety. M1 promotes the EP product as everything the same but better than the standard M1, but if there is this much difference in their wear protection than I don't want to use the EP variant.

If EP is everything the same as the standard M1 but only better, I want to run it in my Dad's Cadillac CTS V-Sport with twin turbos and that big timing chain, as well my wife's Lincoln with the 2.0L turbo four citing the better engine heat protection, (both are GM and Ford spec rated, as well as Honda HTO-06 which specifically speaks to being good for turbochargers.) I'm still on the fence as to whether I want to switch from 5w30 to 0w40 on our Z06 Corvettes, but I definitely do not want to run EP in our LS6 and LS7 motors if it has inferior wear protection!


What minimum PSI rating does Chevrolet publish for your Z06 Corvette engine?
 
There has never been any evidence that EP has led to higher engine wear. I know those who do 15-20K OCIs on EP, and with 200-300K on engines that were still performing like new.
 
That would not be an absolutely true statement unless you were privy to all the testing....

Originally Posted By: tig1
There has never been any evidence that EP has led to higher engine wear. I know those who do 15-20K OCIs on EP, and with 200-300K on engines that were still performing like new.
 
Originally Posted By: AirgunSavant
What PSI ratings are you running in your vehicles kschachn?


None of my vehicle engines have a PSI requirement for the oils, so I have difficulty understanding how it is relevant. Can you explain the relevancy?
 
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Originally Posted By: AirgunSavant
What PSI ratings are you running in your vehicles kschachn?


None of my vehicle engines have a PSI requirement for the oils, so I have difficulty understanding how it is relevant. Can you explain the relevancy?


Since "wear protection" isn't a formal specification it's pretty tough to guess what (as in which ASTM test) the psi figures refer to. And that's the problem with marketing in general.
 
Originally Posted By: homeyclaus
Since "wear protection" isn't a formal specification it's pretty tough to guess what (as in which ASTM test) the psi figures refer to. And that's the problem with marketing in general.


Have you ever seen an engine oil marketed by PSI rating?
 
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Originally Posted By: homeyclaus
Since "wear protection" isn't a formal specification it's pretty tough to guess what (as in which ASTM test) the psi figures refer to. And that's the problem with marketing in general.


Have you ever seen an engine oil marketed by PSI rating?


Not under the category "wear protection." I did, however, see blinker fluid specified this way.
 
Originally Posted By: A_Harman
Are you quoting wear protection PSI ratings from the 540 Rat blog?
Don't.
People used to quote Dr Haas oil 101 series all the time but not many knew enough to not quote it.Rat explains his writings well.
 
PSI calculated down to 6 figures is not really remotely realistic. It makes for interesting fodder and little else. Mobil 1 extended performance is a great oil like others have stated. If you want a great 0w40 then Castrol or Mobil 1 are great options. I am sure the newest Pennzoil 0w40 is very good as well. So you are all set there sir.
If you like Rat's list.... Then read the 20 plus page discussion about it on here. In fact it was the best discussion I have seen on here about it. The guys like Zee0six, Shannow, Brucluno and others carried on a great discussion. They did a great job on there.
 
I'm inclined to just stick with M1 5w30 for both my ZO6 and Lincoln, as I'm not as certain as I thought I was about the Extended Performance; (still considering the M1 0w40 for the annual Z06 oil change.) I have no aspiration in going even up to 10,000 miles on my oil in any vehicle, let alone out to 15,000 miles, but I was intrigued by the back of the label where M1 claims the EP has slightly better engine heat protection.

When I contacted them to inquire what supports that claim, they replied by saying the EP has a "higher quantity of additives allow it to handle the heat a little better." On my Dad's new Cadillac Vsport with the LF3 V6 that has twin turbochargers and one big timing chain, we wanted a good oil that would protect against engine heat (especially in the Texas heat,) protect the twin-turbos (both oils are rated Honda HTO-06), and protect that big timing chain. Price is not an issue and long drain intervals is not a factor - I just want to go with the one that is the better oil.
 
Originally Posted By: AirBull
I'm inclined to just stick with M1 5w30 for both my ZO6 and Lincoln, as I'm not as certain as I thought I was about the Extended Performance; (still considering the M1 0w40 for the annual Z06 oil change.) I have no aspiration in going even up to 10,000 miles on my oil in any vehicle, let alone out to 15,000 miles, but I was intrigued by the back of the label where M1 claims the EP has slightly better engine heat protection.

When I contacted them to inquire what supports that claim, they replied by saying the EP has a "higher quantity of additives allow it to handle the heat a little better." On my Dad's new Cadillac Vsport with the LF3 V6 that has twin turbochargers and one big timing chain, we wanted a good oil that would protect against engine heat (especially in the Texas heat,) protect the twin-turbos (both oils are rated Honda HTO-06), and protect that big timing chain. Price is not an issue and long drain intervals is not a factor - I just want to go with the one that is the better oil.


If you are really worried about heat protection and want to spend a lot more money on oil, you could look at M1 5W30 ESP. Low NOACK loss and a very high flashpoint, but the downsides are a low TBN that makes it unsuitable for long OCIs with US gas, low availability, and high prices. I generally see it in 1 liter bottles, but I think it is sold in 4 or 5l jugs in Europe. It also does not carry API SN, GF5, or dexos1 certifications, but it is dexos2 certified (diesel).
 
Originally Posted By: AirgunSavant
That would not be an absolutely true statement unless you were privy to all the testing....

Originally Posted By: tig1
There has never been any evidence that EP has led to higher engine wear. I know those who do 15-20K OCIs on EP, and with 200-300K on engines that were still performing like new.


Of course I was referring here, to BITOG.
 
I had more oil burn off in my sister's Cruze with EP. I went back to regular M1 and all was well. If it were my car I would use regular Mobil 1 and change it every 5000 miles. You could probably easily get away with 6-7.5, but why do that? Regular Mobil 1 is cheap enough and you'll know for sure you're in good shape. That was my one experience with EP, never went back. If you look, it's NOACK numbers are worse. That explained my experience.
 
Originally Posted By: CapitalTruck
I had more oil burn off in my sister's Cruze with EP. I went back to regular M1 and all was well. If it were my car I would use regular Mobil 1 and change it every 5000 miles. You could probably easily get away with 6-7.5, but why do that? Regular Mobil 1 is cheap enough and you'll know for sure you're in good shape. That was my one experience with EP, never went back. If you look, it's NOACK numbers are worse. That explained my experience.


I have seen two results for 5W30 EP NOACK loss, the Russian Oil Club at 9% and an Amsoil study showing about 8.5%...regular M1 5W30 is usually shown at about 10%.
It would be nice if XOM would just tell us, but I doubt that's ever going to happen.

M1 5W30 EP does have a slightly lower HTHS (3) than M1 5W30 (3.1), does that possibly have any link to consumption???
 
Originally Posted By: AirBull


When I contacted them to inquire what supports that claim, they replied by saying the EP has a "higher quantity of additives allow it to handle the heat a little better." On my Dad's new Cadillac Vsport with the LF3 V6 that has twin turbochargers and one big timing chain, we wanted a good oil that would protect against engine heat (especially in the Texas heat,) protect the twin-turbos (both oils are rated Honda HTO-06), and protect that big timing chain. Price is not an issue and long drain intervals is not a factor - I just want to go with the one that is the better oil.



I wonder what are those magic additives that handle the heat better?
 
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