MMO in BMW
- Thread starter Rtstrider
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Originally Posted By: Rtstrider
So looks like I'm going to be selling this car now
. Live and learn, Toyota here I come!
Two things:
Apparently a car is more of an appliance to you. If so the great driving feel of a BMW is not for you. I would stick to a Toyota as well. Great cars. We had two Camrys.
Also, it seems as if you did not do a good job of pre-inspecting the BMW before purchase. A good pre-purchase of any car is critical so you do not get a lemon. However, on any German car a pre-purchase inspection is critical as repairs can be expensive. Also records are critical to ensure it has been taken care of. An extended warrenty is also a good idea on late model German cars.
So looks like I'm going to be selling this car now
Two things:
Apparently a car is more of an appliance to you. If so the great driving feel of a BMW is not for you. I would stick to a Toyota as well. Great cars. We had two Camrys.
Also, it seems as if you did not do a good job of pre-inspecting the BMW before purchase. A good pre-purchase of any car is critical so you do not get a lemon. However, on any German car a pre-purchase inspection is critical as repairs can be expensive. Also records are critical to ensure it has been taken care of. An extended warrenty is also a good idea on late model German cars.
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Originally Posted By: Rtstrider
So looks like I'm going to be selling this car now
. Live and learn, Toyota here I come!
So interesting to hear from the other side of the field. I'm not particularly attached to BMW, but even given my current financial stresses I can't wrap my head around the idea of buying a dull car to save on maintenance.
I agree with Russell's comments about pre-purchase inspection, and how much more important that is for BMWs -- especially given that the VAST majority of BMW owners don't drive or maintain them as they're supposed to. However, if you like to be reactive rather than proactive with maintenance, you're right to suspect that a Toyota will be easier to own.
I suspect you've learned more about yourself (your preferences, tendencies, etc.) than you've learned about cars in this instance.
So looks like I'm going to be selling this car now
So interesting to hear from the other side of the field. I'm not particularly attached to BMW, but even given my current financial stresses I can't wrap my head around the idea of buying a dull car to save on maintenance.
I agree with Russell's comments about pre-purchase inspection, and how much more important that is for BMWs -- especially given that the VAST majority of BMW owners don't drive or maintain them as they're supposed to. However, if you like to be reactive rather than proactive with maintenance, you're right to suspect that a Toyota will be easier to own.
I suspect you've learned more about yourself (your preferences, tendencies, etc.) than you've learned about cars in this instance.
Well actually I'm a preacher of PM, but, I should have done the pre inspection like you guys/gals stated so that is on me. Cars are not an appliance, as when I buy them I plan to have them till they rust to the ground
. I'm very particular on my oil changes, what oil, and what filter goes in/on my car as well. My gf always tells me I change my fluids WAY too much lol.
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Originally Posted By: Rtstrider
Cars are not an appliance, as when I buy them I plan to have them till they rust to the ground
.
The "appliance" comment was more about how you use it. In other words, he was guessing that you consider a car to be more of a means to an end (the end being transportation) rather than as an end in itself.
Toyotas tend to be "appliances" in the sense that they are all about getting from A to B. BMWs are for people who want to enjoy every minute of the drive (based on one interpretation of what enjoyment means). Different strokes for different folks.
I'm not saying any of this is true of your own preferences, by the way. I just wanted to explain the language.
Cars are not an appliance, as when I buy them I plan to have them till they rust to the ground
The "appliance" comment was more about how you use it. In other words, he was guessing that you consider a car to be more of a means to an end (the end being transportation) rather than as an end in itself.
Toyotas tend to be "appliances" in the sense that they are all about getting from A to B. BMWs are for people who want to enjoy every minute of the drive (based on one interpretation of what enjoyment means). Different strokes for different folks.
I'm not saying any of this is true of your own preferences, by the way. I just wanted to explain the language.
Originally Posted By: Rtstrider
Cars are not an appliance, as when I buy them I plan to have them till they rust to the ground
.
I don't think that's what was meant by the term 'appliance'. When we say 'appliance' in regards to vehicles, we mean a car that takes you from A to B very reliably, at low maintenance cost, for a very long time, but typically does not offer any driving pleasure/excitement. Another words, it's a basic transportation tool and nothing else. Both an appliance and a non-appliance can be kept "till they rust to the ground."
Cars are not an appliance, as when I buy them I plan to have them till they rust to the ground
I don't think that's what was meant by the term 'appliance'. When we say 'appliance' in regards to vehicles, we mean a car that takes you from A to B very reliably, at low maintenance cost, for a very long time, but typically does not offer any driving pleasure/excitement. Another words, it's a basic transportation tool and nothing else. Both an appliance and a non-appliance can be kept "till they rust to the ground."
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
In other words, he was guessing that you consider a car to be more of a means to an end (the end being transportation) rather than as an end in itself.
Bah!
In other words, he was guessing that you consider a car to be more of a means to an end (the end being transportation) rather than as an end in itself.
Bah!
I sympathize with OP. When I purchase a used vehicle, unless I have done extensive research on the specific model *and* thoroughly checked out the actual car, it is going to be very difficult to prevent these kind of surprises.
For example, I could find a great Subaru in excellent condition and check it out and buy it only to lose the head gasket within the first month of my ownership (or a V6 Honda and have the transmission go within two months).
Now we all agree that head gasket / transmission / disintegrating cooling systems / hidden rust etc are NOT the norm for an average used vehicle. However, when you are in the market for a used vehicle, your pickings are slim and it is rare for somebody to do apriori research unless they are looking to buy a specific make and model. In most cases, you come across a clean used car and you have to make a snap decision.
- Vikas
For example, I could find a great Subaru in excellent condition and check it out and buy it only to lose the head gasket within the first month of my ownership (or a V6 Honda and have the transmission go within two months).
Now we all agree that head gasket / transmission / disintegrating cooling systems / hidden rust etc are NOT the norm for an average used vehicle. However, when you are in the market for a used vehicle, your pickings are slim and it is rare for somebody to do apriori research unless they are looking to buy a specific make and model. In most cases, you come across a clean used car and you have to make a snap decision.
- Vikas
Originally Posted By: Vikas
I sympathize with OP. When I purchase a used vehicle, unless I have done extensive research on the specific model *and* thoroughly checked out the actual car, it is going to be very difficult to prevent these kind of surprises.
For example, I could find a great Subaru in excellent condition and check it out and buy it only to lose the head gasket within the first month of my ownership (or a V6 Honda and have the transmission go within two months).
Now we all agree that head gasket / transmission / disintegrating cooling systems / hidden rust etc are NOT the norm for an average used vehicle. However, when you are in the market for a used vehicle, your pickings are slim and it is rare for somebody to do apriori research unless they are looking to buy a specific make and model. In most cases, you come across a clean used car and you have to make a snap decision.
- Vikas
IMO, you should not have to make a snap decision. Ask for the owners name and phone number. If it is not available, as is often the case with cars purchased at an auction, I would consider walking away. Especially if the seller will not allow a pre-purhase inspection. Walk.
I sympathize with OP. When I purchase a used vehicle, unless I have done extensive research on the specific model *and* thoroughly checked out the actual car, it is going to be very difficult to prevent these kind of surprises.
For example, I could find a great Subaru in excellent condition and check it out and buy it only to lose the head gasket within the first month of my ownership (or a V6 Honda and have the transmission go within two months).
Now we all agree that head gasket / transmission / disintegrating cooling systems / hidden rust etc are NOT the norm for an average used vehicle. However, when you are in the market for a used vehicle, your pickings are slim and it is rare for somebody to do apriori research unless they are looking to buy a specific make and model. In most cases, you come across a clean used car and you have to make a snap decision.
- Vikas
IMO, you should not have to make a snap decision. Ask for the owners name and phone number. If it is not available, as is often the case with cars purchased at an auction, I would consider walking away. Especially if the seller will not allow a pre-purhase inspection. Walk.
My point was that sometimes even pre-purchase inspection done by your own mechanic would not be enough if that model has known pattern failures which neither you nor your mechanic were aware off. Those would have been apparent if you were visiting the appropriate internet resource.
On the other hand, if you were specifically looking for say a second generation Miata, you better visit the internet resource(s) and try to find the probable weak spots before your shopping.
I want to buy a previous generation (before they "bangled" it all up!) Acura TL but knowing their transmissions, I really do not feel safe in pursuing it. The failure would be sudden and catastrophic and there is nothing that I can do in pre-inspection to catch it.
On the other hand, if you were specifically looking for say a second generation Miata, you better visit the internet resource(s) and try to find the probable weak spots before your shopping.
I want to buy a previous generation (before they "bangled" it all up!) Acura TL but knowing their transmissions, I really do not feel safe in pursuing it. The failure would be sudden and catastrophic and there is nothing that I can do in pre-inspection to catch it.
Originally Posted By: Vikas
My point was that sometimes even pre-purchase inspection done by your own mechanic would not be enough if that model has known pattern failures which neither you nor your mechanic were aware off. Those would have been apparent if you were visiting the appropriate internet resource.
And then there is another category: a whole slew of electrical issues that can and will pop up at any given point in time. Everything will be fine at the time of inspection, then a month later your FSU will die, or you'll get dead pixels in the dashboard or radio display, or your electrical seat controls or window regulators will stop working. These are not issues that will leave you stranded at the side of the road, but annoying and not cheap to fix either. It all adds up.
Speaking from experience, by the way. My E39 was 4 years old and had 30K miles when I bought it. Within a year, all the above and more went south. It's fairly common on these cars, and none of that would have been detected during a PPI.
Do I wish I invested in an extended warranty? Yes. It would have paid for itself twice over by now. However, most of these aftermarket warranties don't cover everything, so who knows...
My point was that sometimes even pre-purchase inspection done by your own mechanic would not be enough if that model has known pattern failures which neither you nor your mechanic were aware off. Those would have been apparent if you were visiting the appropriate internet resource.
And then there is another category: a whole slew of electrical issues that can and will pop up at any given point in time. Everything will be fine at the time of inspection, then a month later your FSU will die, or you'll get dead pixels in the dashboard or radio display, or your electrical seat controls or window regulators will stop working. These are not issues that will leave you stranded at the side of the road, but annoying and not cheap to fix either. It all adds up.
Speaking from experience, by the way. My E39 was 4 years old and had 30K miles when I bought it. Within a year, all the above and more went south. It's fairly common on these cars, and none of that would have been detected during a PPI.
Do I wish I invested in an extended warranty? Yes. It would have paid for itself twice over by now. However, most of these aftermarket warranties don't cover everything, so who knows...
The only problem with the Z4 was the "Let's design the drain holes so the top motor will get soaked and die." one.
But I cheated and pulled the handle in the trunk to bypass the hydraulics. Went up and down much faster in manual.
Really didn't want to get rid of it, but when the last three repairs each cost a month's disability income.......
But the Mustang has it's own charms.
But I cheated and pulled the handle in the trunk to bypass the hydraulics. Went up and down much faster in manual.
Really didn't want to get rid of it, but when the last three repairs each cost a month's disability income.......
But the Mustang has it's own charms.
OVERKILL
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Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: Vikas
My point was that sometimes even pre-purchase inspection done by your own mechanic would not be enough if that model has known pattern failures which neither you nor your mechanic were aware off. Those would have been apparent if you were visiting the appropriate internet resource.
And then there is another category: a whole slew of electrical issues that can and will pop up at any given point in time. Everything will be fine at the time of inspection, then a month later your FSU will die, or you'll get dead pixels in the dashboard or radio display, or your electrical seat controls or window regulators will stop working. These are not issues that will leave you stranded at the side of the road, but annoying and not cheap to fix either. It all adds up.
Speaking from experience, by the way. My E39 was 4 years old and had 30K miles when I bought it. Within a year, all the above and more went south. It's fairly common on these cars, and none of that would have been detected during a PPI.
Do I wish I invested in an extended warranty? Yes. It would have paid for itself twice over by now. However, most of these aftermarket warranties don't cover everything, so who knows...
Oh yes, the joys of E39 ownership
Guys on the M5 board tell you to budget AT MINIMUM 2K for repairs you are going to have to do after buying the car. And this is WITH a PPI.
My safety alone was 1K because of the tie-rod end.
I have some dead pixels in the display (may fix those someday).
Have had to change:
-Oil separator hoses
-Blower Resistor Module
-Bank A Intake CPS (it is on order now)
-Exhaust mounts (the middle ones collapse)
it still needs:
-A clutch. We know that isn't cheap.
-Valve cover gaskets from the looks of things (oil leak)
-Oil bypass solenoid oil leak fixed (o-ring)
-Differential oil leak fixed (drivers-side CV shaft is leaking at the diff)
-Evap solenoid (have to pull the entire plenum to change)
And it will need brakes.......
Not cheap cars to own. But boy are they fun
Originally Posted By: Vikas
My point was that sometimes even pre-purchase inspection done by your own mechanic would not be enough if that model has known pattern failures which neither you nor your mechanic were aware off. Those would have been apparent if you were visiting the appropriate internet resource.
And then there is another category: a whole slew of electrical issues that can and will pop up at any given point in time. Everything will be fine at the time of inspection, then a month later your FSU will die, or you'll get dead pixels in the dashboard or radio display, or your electrical seat controls or window regulators will stop working. These are not issues that will leave you stranded at the side of the road, but annoying and not cheap to fix either. It all adds up.
Speaking from experience, by the way. My E39 was 4 years old and had 30K miles when I bought it. Within a year, all the above and more went south. It's fairly common on these cars, and none of that would have been detected during a PPI.
Do I wish I invested in an extended warranty? Yes. It would have paid for itself twice over by now. However, most of these aftermarket warranties don't cover everything, so who knows...
Oh yes, the joys of E39 ownership
Guys on the M5 board tell you to budget AT MINIMUM 2K for repairs you are going to have to do after buying the car. And this is WITH a PPI.
My safety alone was 1K because of the tie-rod end.
I have some dead pixels in the display (may fix those someday).
Have had to change:
-Oil separator hoses
-Blower Resistor Module
-Bank A Intake CPS (it is on order now)
-Exhaust mounts (the middle ones collapse)
it still needs:
-A clutch. We know that isn't cheap.
-Valve cover gaskets from the looks of things (oil leak)
-Oil bypass solenoid oil leak fixed (o-ring)
-Differential oil leak fixed (drivers-side CV shaft is leaking at the diff)
-Evap solenoid (have to pull the entire plenum to change)
And it will need brakes.......
Not cheap cars to own. But boy are they fun
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: Vikas
My point was that sometimes even pre-purchase inspection done by your own mechanic would not be enough if that model has known pattern failures which neither you nor your mechanic were aware off. Those would have been apparent if you were visiting the appropriate internet resource.
And then there is another category: a whole slew of electrical issues that can and will pop up at any given point in time. Everything will be fine at the time of inspection, then a month later your FSU will die, or you'll get dead pixels in the dashboard or radio display, or your electrical seat controls or window regulators will stop working. These are not issues that will leave you stranded at the side of the road, but annoying and not cheap to fix either. It all adds up.
Speaking from experience, by the way. My E39 was 4 years old and had 30K miles when I bought it. Within a year, all the above and more went south. It's fairly common on these cars, and none of that would have been detected during a PPI.
Do I wish I invested in an extended warranty? Yes. It would have paid for itself twice over by now. However, most of these aftermarket warranties don't cover everything, so who knows...
Oh yes, the joys of E39 ownership
Guys on the M5 board tell you to budget AT MINIMUM 2K for repairs you are going to have to do after buying the car. And this is WITH a PPI.
My safety alone was 1K because of the tie-rod end.
I have some dead pixels in the display (may fix those someday).
Have had to change:
-Oil separator hoses
-Blower Resistor Module
-Bank A Intake CPS (it is on order now)
-Exhaust mounts (the middle ones collapse)
it still needs:
-A clutch. We know that isn't cheap.
-Valve cover gaskets from the looks of things (oil leak)
-Oil bypass solenoid oil leak fixed (o-ring)
-Differential oil leak fixed (drivers-side CV shaft is leaking at the diff)
-Evap solenoid (have to pull the entire plenum to change)
And it will need brakes.......
Not cheap cars to own. But boy are they fun
Older e-34s cost about the same each year even if you can do some of the wrenching.
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: Vikas
My point was that sometimes even pre-purchase inspection done by your own mechanic would not be enough if that model has known pattern failures which neither you nor your mechanic were aware off. Those would have been apparent if you were visiting the appropriate internet resource.
And then there is another category: a whole slew of electrical issues that can and will pop up at any given point in time. Everything will be fine at the time of inspection, then a month later your FSU will die, or you'll get dead pixels in the dashboard or radio display, or your electrical seat controls or window regulators will stop working. These are not issues that will leave you stranded at the side of the road, but annoying and not cheap to fix either. It all adds up.
Speaking from experience, by the way. My E39 was 4 years old and had 30K miles when I bought it. Within a year, all the above and more went south. It's fairly common on these cars, and none of that would have been detected during a PPI.
Do I wish I invested in an extended warranty? Yes. It would have paid for itself twice over by now. However, most of these aftermarket warranties don't cover everything, so who knows...
Oh yes, the joys of E39 ownership
Guys on the M5 board tell you to budget AT MINIMUM 2K for repairs you are going to have to do after buying the car. And this is WITH a PPI.
My safety alone was 1K because of the tie-rod end.
I have some dead pixels in the display (may fix those someday).
Have had to change:
-Oil separator hoses
-Blower Resistor Module
-Bank A Intake CPS (it is on order now)
-Exhaust mounts (the middle ones collapse)
it still needs:
-A clutch. We know that isn't cheap.
-Valve cover gaskets from the looks of things (oil leak)
-Oil bypass solenoid oil leak fixed (o-ring)
-Differential oil leak fixed (drivers-side CV shaft is leaking at the diff)
-Evap solenoid (have to pull the entire plenum to change)
And it will need brakes.......
Not cheap cars to own. But boy are they fun
Older e-34s cost about the same each year even if you can do some of the wrenching.
Originally Posted By: Vikas
Can a mod move this to maintenance section? This topic one has very little to do with MMO but lot to do with BMW cooling issues.
Most of discussion is on MMO and can still be about MMO. Bet it will be on track now.
I found MMO to be of little use in the oil on my BMW and may have been of slight benefit in the fuel. Hard to tell.
Can a mod move this to maintenance section? This topic one has very little to do with MMO but lot to do with BMW cooling issues.
Most of discussion is on MMO and can still be about MMO. Bet it will be on track now.
I found MMO to be of little use in the oil on my BMW and may have been of slight benefit in the fuel. Hard to tell.
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