MITSUBISHI EVOLUTION OIL QUESTION?

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quote:

Originally posted by zmeli:
I am new to this board. I bought a Turbo car and the manual says to use fully synthetic 10w-30wt. I live in the desert and have always used M1 15w-50wt in hondas in the past with good results. I am tempted to use the 15w-15wt in this car after break in. or maybe use another brand of oil. not to sure about M1 10w-30wt. any suggestions?

I'd personally stay within the factory oil specs noted in the manual, if not very close to it.
With regards to using a much thicker oil like a 15W-50
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, I just don't understand the reasoning behind this and why people are so quick to accept putting that in a 1.8t, when I'm sure that the engineers tested which oil viscosity would work best within the engines tolerances and performance specs. They obviosuly want to pass certain standards, but I'm sure they're also concerned about longevity and all the different driving habits among the public. plus, with today's engines and better synths, they want you to use what's best. It's becoming more and more of an issue with European cars and which oil to use (Audi RS6,..etc). And didn't MB just have to pay out $32M in a suit that was about early engine failures, due to which oil was used (people going to Jiffy Lube, and/or not using the correct type of oil (synth) or viscoity?).
Anyways, sure, a thicker oil will have the ability to better protect then a thinner one, but it's not just about thin vs thick oil here. We have other things to consider, like; tolerances, friction, flow, temps,..etc. That oil has to flow inside the engine and increasing the viscosity increases friction. The heavier the oil, the harder time flowing. You'll get a more sluggish engine, increased internal temp/more friction, decreased MPG,..etc. I just don't understand why people are so eager to dump an oil in their engine that is much heavier then what the manufacturer states. Engine oil temps are only going to get so high, even with increased ambient temps. I don't claim to be an oil expert, but it doesn't always make complete sense to just throw a higher viscosity oil into an engine, especially a 1.8t.
I have driven 1.8/t's since '85 and have driven them like public race cars in SoCal 98% of the time (high rev shifts, up and down shifting, high speeds, sitting in 3rd/4th gear w/ high revs,...etc. red line, red line,.. red line), and this for extended times while driving 100's of miles. If that isn't "hard driving" then I don't know what is. You may race/track, but it's for what, a 1/2 hour or less perhaps? I can take my car out for a drive and be just as abusive in most cases.
During my time with these VW/Audi 1.8/t's, I have kept within the recommended oil; 5W-30/40, 10W-30/40, 0W-40). IMO, the 5W-40 seemed to be the best suited for the 1.8t, my climate and driving habits. I ran Red Line oils for 8 years and recently switched to Motul. I run their 300V 5W-40 in my '03 Audi A4 1.8t (29K miles) and their 8100 Ester E-Tech 0W-40 in my '00 VW 1.8t (66K miles). Before this, I had an '85 Gti which was my most street abused car. I had almost 300K miles on that engine and drove it to **** and back. It was never rebuilt in that time. I also have done extended drains for 8 years, averaging 8-12 miles OCI's. ( I should also note that I have used the Mecca Performance filter during this time also).
The 1.8t is a proven little engine and can last, even with more then normal use [abuse]. Stick with the same viscosity recommended for your vehicle, or very close to it. I'd use Motul myself and probably their 5W-40 or 0W-40 as mentioned above.

BTW; don't Honda's have some of the tightest tolerances and specify xW-20 oil viscosity? I can't believe a 15W-50 would be good for it.
 
quote:

Originally posted by A4NCAR:
I have driven 1.8/t's since '85....During my time with these VW/Audi 1.8/t's, I have kept within the recommended oil;

I thought the Audi/VW 1.8T engine made it's debut in 1995?
 
quote:

don't Honda's have some of the tightest tolerances and specify xW-20 oil viscosity? I can't believe a 15W-50 would be good for it.

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Here's an excellent UOA of a 02' Civic SI using Mobil 1 15w-50. UOA Link


I believe auto company engineers have very little to do with what's printed in the owners manual. The optimal recommendation per enginering input is the least of the manufacturers' concerns. It's more like "minimum requirements" for the average Joe-(the Germans ie VW,BMW etc. seem better in this regard).

(I hate to beat a dead horse) But I still maintain my view that many auto companies engine oil recommendations are motivated by the EPA and CAFE standards. And the fact that many times the exact car "requires" a thinner weight oil in the US than in other markets further substantiates my feelings. My Taurus manual doesn't even give a choice and no good old temp/viscosity chart either. How can one weight possibly be OPTIMAL under ALL circumstances?
 
As an engineer of 24 years experience, you'd be amazed at how many layers of management recommendations go through before they end up in the owner’s manual. Engineers have only the first say in most pieces of documentation. After marketing, accounting, and the VPs approve of anything it’s usually quite different than the original recommendations. Want proof? Read up on the Space Shuttle disasters, the Three Mile Island incident and the like.
 
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The Evolution calls for Synthetic 10/30 I agree with Mobil 1 and a qt. of Redline 10/30 they have had good results on the UOA. Engine Type: Inline-4 Inline-4 Inline-4


Engine Block: Cast Iron Cast Iron Cast Iron


Cylinder Head: Aluminum Aluminum Aluminum


Displacement (cc): 1997 1997 1997


Horsepower @ rpm (SAE net): 276@6500 276@6500 276@6500


Torque (lb-ft @ rpm): 286@3500 286@3500 286@3500


Redline (rpm): 7000 7000 7000


Bore and Stroke (mm): 85.0 x 88.0 85.0 x 88.0 85.0 x 88.0


Compression Ratio: 8.8:1 8.8:1 8.8:1


Valvetrain: DOHC 16-Valve DOHC 16-Valve DOHC 16-Valve


Full-time AWD with Active Center Differential, front helical torque-sensing limited slip differential and rear 1.5 limited-slip differential:


Valve Cover: Magnesium Magnesium Magnesium


Ventilated BREMBO® Disc Brakes with Aluminium Caliper Housings, front: 320 mm dia. rotor,
4-piston calipers 320 mm dia. rotor,
4-piston calipers 320 mm dia. rotor,
4-piston calipers


Ventilated BREMBO® Disc Brakes with Aluminium Caliper Housings, rear: 300 mm dia. rotor,
2-piston calipers 300 mm dia. rotor,
2-piston calipers 300 mm dia. rotor,
2-piston calipers


Fuel Delivery: ECI-MULTI Electronic
Fuel Injection ECI-MULTI Electronic
Fuel Injection ECI-MULTI Electronic
Fuel Injection


Engine Oil Type: 100% Synthetic 100% Synthetic 100% Synthetic


Turbocharger Type: TD05HR-16G6-10.5T
(Twin Scroll Turbine)
 
Based on my research Mitsubishi isnt going to pay for this engine if it blows up anyway. They are actually downloading the computers memory to check for full throttle and claiming abuse now.

Run the oil you think best.

Back it up with UOA.

Gene

PS I vote for Mobil 1 T&S (Delvac 1) 5W-40. These engines oxidize and thin oil like a mother. This is the most stable oil in the Mobil 1 Line.

[ January 03, 2005, 10:28 PM: Message edited by: Gene K ]
 
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