I agree and ... I wouldnt trust Tesla to build anything but small EV cars.
(just having fun here)
Media Is Lying About Chinese EVs—And Here's the Proof
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(just having fun here)
Elon would be more than happy to shut down Tesla Fremont and Giga Nevada/Austin to build all in China(or Mexico) to take advantage of cheaper labor(or AI and robots). He’s taking advantage of American workers for brownie points - they aren’t union jobs, the tech workers at Tesla/SpaceX get paid well but the factories are sweatshops. After all, it’s the MBAs in the c-suite that Jack Welch empowered that gave rise to the maquiladora in Tijuana/Nogales/Ciudad Juarez.
16 years ago, Tesla Fremont was NUMMI, and it was oddly Toyota’s only unionized plant. No strikes, it was one of the best auto plants for quality and productivity. It paid a wage for one to be able to afford the Bay Area. Now, it’s a sweatshop, I see tired Tesla workers on BART dozing off. They bus in workers from Vallejo/Fairfield and Stockton/Modesto/Fresno.
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Didn't China recently pass a new law requiring companies to disclose passwords to sensitive tech to the CCP on demand?
We also saw the USA stop the sale of Chinese Routers (I believe) in the USA.
There is a Cold War of sorts brewing between the USA and China.
China will not permit USA entities to have administrative offices in their Universities, yet they have them here. They will not permit free access to their media to spread Western ideology, yet Chinese media dominates in the USA. China probably has more distribution middle men and warewhouses in America now than Americans do. Western government has done a very poor job of protecting Western interests imo. There's a big difference between having a free market where freedom exists on BOTH sides vs what we have which is a free market open to China but not open to the USA.
1. I have no clue
2. NO USA did not stop sale of Chinese routers exclusively- Moving forward any new router models must be manufactured in the USA for FCC approval. This goes for all countries of manufacture, not just China. So everything currently on the market will continue to be imported and sold. You can bet the biggest router maker in the world TP Link will continue to produce and sell new routers in the USA and they are already planning manufacturing here>
American router makers will have to produce their goods here in the USA if they are to bring any new products to the market.
Currently only one router is made in the USA, the new router from Elon Musks company Starlink
3. I agree 100%, China walks all over us here in the USA, people dont care as long as they get their stuff.
Here is some information, with anything government nothing is presented as simple
"a router will be considered foreign-made if “any major stage of the process through which the device is made, including manufacturing, assembly, design and development” occurs outside the US. "
Source for all the above information,
https://www.cnet.com/home/internet/...g-you-need-to-know-to-keep-your-network-safe/
So technically, EVERY router currently in the USA would not qualify under the rules (except the new Starlink router) and why current FCC approved devices can continue to be sold here.
... and TP Link new models will be sold here as they are already planning the start up of manufacturing here. Heck they might even beat USA companies.
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The truth is, to compete globally, you must be able to meet or beat your global competitors offerings. Consumers demand low prices and simultaneously good quality which is a paradox and unrealistic. It is unrealistic to think that American manufacturers can continue to compete on the global stage with Union wages. Everyone wants to make $10,000/hr (or more) for their time. But if Country "B" is only paying $2/hr for the same labor then you compete or get out of the game (which is basically what America has done).
I think Mr. Musk is doing what he must to compete, just as GM, Ford and pretty much every other American manufacturer has done before him. All factories are sweat shops. Communism purports to level the field...but it never does. In fact, it just makes the sweat shops compulsory and less humane.
Agreed on that. Tesla flourishes in that department. Outside of that I'd rather spend my money elsewhere.
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The TPLink AX55 is one of the affected routers. A patch has been released for most of the affected routers that is supposed to close this back door. I can understand why it is for all countries, because China could easily have their routers designated as made in some other country and continue the backdoor schemes. The cost of Routers will probably climb astronomically, but overall I think it's a good move and a good start.
You may make $100/hr at your job, but is that a consolation when a loaf of bread is also $100 ?
Agreed. Look at how many use Facebook even though it's a known child predators heaven. I have never used Facebook and won't. Americans generally do not care as long as their fun, entertainment or convenience is first and foremost. I cannot totally exclude myself to some degree.
Corporate profits go to its shareholders wherever they reside. GM profits don’t benefit the average American or America in particular.
We’re not talking about farmland or food but good point. My government thinks it’s fine for the Chinese to own that and for me to buy Chinese food. However I can’t buy a Chinese EV.
The whole thing is a hypocrisy. We’re all on our own.
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I REALLY like Elon Musk. He's a GREAT man !!! Great human being too.
Elon Musk is the worlds only rocket booster stage recycler. No one else can do that. That alone makes me a Tesla and Elon fan. NASA on the other hand (and every other entity that launches rockets) is still dumping some of Earths most hazardous compounds directly into our oceans. (As far as I know..correct me if I'm mistaken).
Count me as one who would buy a Tesla before ANY other brand...regardless of cost.
I'm not intelligent enough to ever be chosen to work for him in his tech dept, unfortunately, but I'm intelligent enough to know intelligence that's good for humanity when I see it.
Elon Musk is the worlds only rocket booster stage recycler. No one else can do that. That alone makes me a Tesla and Elon fan. NASA on the other hand (and every other entity that launches rockets) is still dumping some of Earths most hazardous compounds directly into our oceans. (As far as I know..correct me if I'm mistaken).
Count me as one who would buy a Tesla before ANY other brand...regardless of cost.
I'm not intelligent enough to ever be chosen to work for him in his tech dept, unfortunately, but I'm intelligent enough to know intelligence that's good for humanity when I see it.
I knew the shareholders thing would come up.
Im not talking about profits. Im talking about foreign control of the marketplace. We could all work for a Chinese company in the USA and enjoy the profits from it. Just hand over the country to them (or any country) and let us all work for them, however then they are in control of everything and anything, including political decisions governing the people of that country.
At its peak, NUMMI had about 6,000 workers. Before NUMMI, the GM plant had less, I believe. My 442 was built in Fremont. When NUMMI shuttered, the local economy suffered, including the numerous support companies, restaurants, etc. Homes were lost.
Musk put out 2 page adds in the SJ Merc, on TV and radio asking ex-NUMMU workers to apply; he knew Toyota had trained them well. Today over 25,000 people work there. Wages start at $21+ per hour; techs start over $26. With benefits. Tesla is the largest employer in the area. Tesla Fremont compensation.
My Fremont factory cars: 1965 Olds 442, 1993 Toyota 4wd PU, 2 Tesla Model 3
A key reason I bought the 2018 Model 3 was the reopening of the plant and its benefit to the area. Not everyone is gonna be a lowly programmer like me. Supporting local employment was, and is, important to me. My money is where my mouth is.
Not you, but I see so many anti-Tesla, Musk, etc comments while claiming they are anti-CCP, pro-American productts, etc. Which is it?
My 2 Model 3s are the most made in America cars, period.
They are always hiring. Tesla Careers
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4wd
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Think that’s wading off into national security … something few think about in the USA … (take for granted) …I knew the shareholders thing would come up.
Im not talking about profits. Im talking about foreign control of the marketplace. We could all work for a Chinese company in the USA and enjoy the profits from it. Just hand over the country to them (or any country) and let us all work for them, however then they are in control of everything and anything, including political decisions governing the people of that country.
If that were true I would agree. But it’s untrue. Only the chosen few and connected are protected. There is no attempt at all to protect the marketplace in general.I knew the shareholders thing would come up.
Im not talking about profits. Im talking about foreign control of the marketplace. We could all work for a Chinese company in the USA and enjoy the profits from it. Just hand over the country to them (or any country) and let us all work for them, however then they are in control of everything and anything, including political decisions governing the people of that country.
So Tesla includes made in Canada as domestic parts?
It is a fact the lower control arms and other parts on US sold model 3 any Y come from China. Musk is no flag waver, he buys the most rock bottom price he can find regardless of COO. For the European market Tesla uses BYD high voltage batteries and many Chinese made parts, if you believe the tin foil hat wearers they all probably include some sort of tracking chip.
The UAW and legacy 2 pushed to change the monroney sticker to track Canada and U.S. without distinction vs USA only as it used to be. Nothing against Canadian workers but I prefer American workers.
More of the same gas lighting by the protected few.
Gotta wonder why so many “Mericans “ gush over Chinese EVs on social media and go ballistic if you mention reliability, coorsion, etc .
My experience is that mainstream media doesn’t seem to be creaming themselves over Chinese cars, it’s almost all wierd AI slop YouTubers and facebook participants that are just Gaga can do no wrong when it comes to those things.
It’s apparently impossible for the us not to sell Chinese cars under Chinese owned brands.
Not that it’s ideal but Brazil just makes it very expensive to not buy domestically approved vehicles, us isn’t far off.
Yep and in 5 years they will likely discover 1970 Fiat 2.0 doesn’t work well in environments where road treatment and weather occurs that promotes rust and corrodes poorly sealed deutch connectors on externally located electronics that get flakey as water permeates inside. Chinese still put critical stuff on the outside firewall in vertical orientations.
American business has been 100% corporate welfare since the late 80’s, level playing field and all competing with non-market all drug Olympic economies like China .
The last time we could have “onshored” was 1985 , but we would have had to do the opposite of whatever trickle down was and blockcade industry from throwing away billions of dollars of industrial plants into the forests of Michigan all to save what turned out to be less than 5% savings that evaporated as we gave away more of our silicon and heavy industrial base for free to foreign nations.
We were warned this cycle of trade deficits always happened directly after wwii when the inevitable petrodollar world currency was chosen over the shared alternative, short term profits and boom being prioritized over the competing slow growth and stable alternative.
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I thought that was for tracking what % of a car is sourced from North America(not including Mexico) and final point of assembly. Before Tesla came along(albeit with a bit of Chinese parts like suspension and the interior bits(Tesla might make most of the compute in the US, but the HMI has to come from Foxconn/Pegatron/Wistron and glass)), Toyota had more American-made content in the Camry, but buy a truck(or even a car) from the Detroit 3, that North American content was between 60-70%.
Tesla does not sell European made cars in America, only Austin, Fremont, etc. Perhaps you know Tesla does not make up the "made in America" criteria? Anyways, here's a few facts for you:
The Model Y and Model 3 have dominated the top 4 positions on the Cars.com American-Made Index for consecutive years.
Tesla models often contain over 85% domestic content, outperforming traditional US automakers like Ford and GM in the top rankings. All Tesla vehicles sold in the US are assembled in the US (Fremont, CA, and Austin, TX), ensuring high compliance with, "made in America" criteria.
According to CarPro, the index considers five key factors, including engine/motor source and assembly location, where Tesla leads in localizing supply chains.
Can you name a US auto plant that employes more workers or makes more cars than Tesla Fremont?
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As I mentioned before. Xiaomi is a knockoff lying company that even Chinese won't trust. It is VinFast of China.
If you want to compare at least use BYD or NIO. This is like compare an eMachine or Packard Bell against an Apple and say PC sucks, while Thinkpad was doing very well.
I want some sort of reliable, efficient 4-door sedan to get here. The Big 3 gave up on this market. They gave up before BYD even landed here; they aren't even trying. There's a huge hole in the market that "someone" has to fill. My electricity bill favors gas when gas is <$3 gallon in summer, $3.75 in winter, so I'm agnostic if the car runs on gas or electric. It's gotta have 400 mile range though, in case I need to "bug out."
BYD seems to be at the tip of the spear of battery tech. Tesla is close, too. Both companies come with odious (to me) baggage at the present.
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