MB 236.1 Spec ATF in a 4R70W?

[Falcon_LS]

I'm going to be replacing the ATF on my Grand Marquis in another 10,000 km, and I have a pint of MMO that's been there for experimental purposes.

Yesterday, I decided I would use the suction method to extract fluid through the dipstick tube and replace it with fresh Mercon V. Unfortunately, I only had 2 quarts of Mercon V when I had extracted 3 liters.

The only ATF the shop had was Fuchs Titan ATF 4000, which is basically Dexron III (H):

Quote:
Approvals:

- ALLISON C-4
- ALLISON TES 389
- DEXRON III (H)
- MAN 339 TYPE V1
- MAN 339 TYPE Z1
- MB-APPROVAL 236.1
- VOITH H55.6335.3X (G 607)
- VOLVO 97341
- ZF TE-ML 04D, 14A, 17C


I didn't want to mix 2 quarts of Mercon V and 1 liter of the Fuchs ATF, so I went ahead and refilled with 3 liters of Fuchs. This is basically 23% of the total fluid capacity (13.1 L), and I will be draining it (torque converter included) in 10,000 km.

There was a noticeable difference in shifting, and it was smoother. But is there anything to worry about? How does MB 236.1 compare to Mercon V? Thanks!

 

[JHZR2]

236.1 is really old spec-wise. Something between a Dex II and III.

http://bevo.mercedes-benz.com/bevolisten/236.1_en.html

Mercedes sheet 231.0, which is the parent sheet for all gear oil specs states the following about 236.1:

Quote:
Automatic transmission fluids (ATF), sheet 236.1
The approved ATF correspond to the currently no longer valid GM specification Dexron II-D or the currently valid GM specification Dexron III.
The field of application of these ATF includes MB automatic transmissions without controlled torque converter lockup clutch in passenger cars, ZF Ecomat transmissions, Allison automatic transmissions, Voith-Diwa transmissions and MB automatic transmissions in commercial vehicles and busses except W4B035.


http://bevo.mercedes-benz.com/d/d/en/Spec_231_0.pdf

I dont see any Mercon specs anywhere.

 

[Rand]

I'm not sure how 3 liters in a large sump is better than mixing 1 liter in?

 

[tig1]

I doubt if it is a good as Mercon V for your Ford transmission. Can you find Mercon V there? If so, I would draw out all you can get and re-fill.

 

[Y_K]

No worries for a short period of time, I would say up to 10-15k kilometers. As long as you replenish with the proper Mercon V after that.
I have a buddy with an Acura MDX which has a rather infamous and sensitive AT. He has over 300k miles on that transmission. he uses whatever ATF he has at hand, mostly DexIII. His secret: he replaces the sump at every oil change.

 

[Mud]

I think that you basically added Dex III? The smoother shifts may be indicative of some slippage in the clutch packs.

I suggest to get that stuff out of there and use spec Merc V. Also not sure why you're using the MMO.

 

[RF Overlord]

Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Quote:

The field of application of these ATF includes MB automatic transmissions without controlled torque converter lockup clutch
The 4R70W DOES have a controlled torque converter lockup clutch, so I would get that fluid out as soon as possbile, although 3 litres out of a total of 13 or so should not be a real problem.

 

[Falcon_LS]

Thanks for all the input! You guys got me paranoid last night, and I ended up draining the torque converter for 2 hours before putting in about 9 quarts of Motorcraft Mercon V.

Anyhow, I put in the MMO for experimental purposes. I have a flare issue when shifting into overdrive, which I initially reckoned was a dirty valve body. A couple of thousand kilometers later, with the MMO in, now the flaring only happens at light throttle. Otherwise, shifts into overdrive and nice and firm, so I suppose the MMO has done something.

Anyhow, Mercon V is not a product available in every store. The only places you can get them are at the Ford dealer or stores specializing in US car parts. Nevertheless it is easy to get hold of, but when 3 liters were sucked out, I thought I'd rather put in 3 liters of one product than to add 2 quarts of one and a liter of the other.

The unit was shifting smoother after the 3 liters, as the shifts were a bit hard before. Now after replacing 9 quarts of fluid, the shifts are even better and I'm noticing a shorter flare when shifting into overdrive at light throttle, if that makes sense. Having said that, I will still replace the fluid after 10,000 km with Liqui-Moly Top Tec ATF 1200, which is a Group III product officially meeting Ford's Mercon V spec.

That said, before I got the car, the previous owner used nothing but ACDelco Type III ATF in the transmission. Better than not changing the fluid at all I suppose.

 

[tig1]

With ATF hard to find where you are, I would stick with the MC ATF that you are now using and do 30K OCs.

 

[Falcon_LS]

Actually I replace all the fluid (13.1L) and the filter every 25,000 miles.