Manual Transmission is Obsolete?

[kr_bitog]

Originally Posted By: xxch4osxx
I always thought you could get better fuel milage with a manual transmission. I always wondered why there is such a push for automatic transmissions. I prefer a manual transmission for a car, but not a pick-up truck.


Because people will complain on operating 7 or 8 speed manual gearbox, where in auto the shifting can be automated, including the engine shut-off and this will give better mpg on start-stop traffic.

 

[m37charlie]

I have an 8 spd "manual" but it shifts electropneumatically. It shifts with a paddle. A computer controls the clutch but if something gets messed up you can pull a lever and the clutch pedal pops out. There is a switch (A/M) for manual mode (stays in the selected gear, driver only shifts); automatic mode (driver can shift but it will up and downshift automatically according to need). No torque converter (although it's optional on European versions - for switching railroad cars and pulling 747s, I guess).
It is in between the two extremes.

Charlie

 

[Nick R]

I wonder how many people who diss automatics have ever driven one everyday.

 

[sangyup81]

Originally Posted By: rudolphna
I wonder how many people who diss automatics have ever driven one everyday.


Probably most if not all. It's hard to get away from them.

As someone who's used both, autos aren't so bad when used in 6 cylinders or above because less shifting is required anyways.

 

[silverrat]

Originally Posted By: rudolphna
I wonder how many people who diss automatics have ever driven one everyday.


My first 3 cars were automatic (86 Olds, 95 Chevy, 91 Honda) and I never thought I could learn how to comfortably drive a manual. Then I got a 1988 Civic 5 speed and I never looked back. So much more fun to drive.

 

[silverrat]

Originally Posted By: SLCraig
I will completely write off owning certain cars due to lack of manual trans being offered. I hate the fact that I really like some cars but they're not ever gonna be in my driveway if they're automatic.

I wish Europe could lead by example here.. Automatics are so rare over there in most every-day level cars. I love that!


I hate the fact the old GM midsize cars I like cant be had with a manual. I would take a Regal GS or Monte Carlo SS supercharged with a manual in a heartbeat. What choices do I have in the midsize domestic segment really? I dont think any of the big 3 have offered anything in that segment for a really long time. For that kind of car to be found in manual one has to look to Accord/Altima/Camry.

 

[SteveSRT8]

none of you guys have driven an auto integrated into the vehicle properly.

The moment you corner hard or use the throttle aggressively my slushbox 'awakens' into play mode, transforming into a downshifting wonder if you brake hard enough and holding gears through corners even if you lift the throttle!

Plus, with infinitely variable lockup you can have a hi stall converter that drives stock until you punch it.

Not all automatics suck.

 

[MrHorspwer]

I think too many people, especially on internet forums, have the "I'm a three pedal pro and don't need no automatic! I'm smarter than any computer and can control my own transmission, thankyouverymuch." This is typically followed by some reference to Europe.

Maybe you should look at what Europe is actually producing these days: DSGs, lots of them. Anymore, if you want to be considered a serious contender in a given high-volume market, you need a DSG offering. The only reason regular manual transmissions are offered is to give a low(er) cost option. By the next model cycle, I predict that VW will not have a single manual transmission and every car will have gone to a DSG.

Believe it or not, people in Europe want automation in their gear selections. Thing is, when all they can afford is a Ford Ka or Renault Clio, be it because of initial purchase cost or fuel costs, they get stuck with an manual. Take fuel cost or purchase cost out of the equation and nearly everything in Europe has an automatic. The exception are a couple performance cars, but as torque capacity on DSGs increase and costs are offset, expect to see more of those manual transmission performance cars make the switch too. As mentioned above, Ferrari already has. Even Jeremy Clarkson has stopped mocking "flappy-paddle" gearboxes.

When John Heinricy logged a sub-8 minute Nurburgring lap in a CTS-V, he did it, by his own choice, with an automatic transmission. Not only was it an automatic, he left it in auto mode, choosing to not use paddles.

 

[silverrat]

A lot of us cant afford to drive a performance car everyday. The manual transmission lets us have fun driving to work in a normal car that would otherwise be slow, but by having a manual makes life tolerable.

 

[sangyup81]

Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
none of you guys have driven an auto integrated into the vehicle properly.

The moment you corner hard or use the throttle aggressively my slushbox 'awakens' into play mode, transforming into a downshifting wonder if you brake hard enough and holding gears through corners even if you lift the throttle!

Plus, with infinitely variable lockup you can have a hi stall converter that drives stock until you punch it.

Not all automatics suck.


Where can we find a list of these superior automatics? Which car are you driving?

 

[Nick R]

Originally Posted By: sangyup81
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
none of you guys have driven an auto integrated into the vehicle properly.

The moment you corner hard or use the throttle aggressively my slushbox 'awakens' into play mode, transforming into a downshifting wonder if you brake hard enough and holding gears through corners even if you lift the throttle!

Plus, with infinitely variable lockup you can have a hi stall converter that drives stock until you punch it.

Not all automatics suck.


Where can we find a list of these superior automatics? Which car are you driving?


The 5 speed auto in my mom's mustang V6 is exceptional. The 3 speed auto in my cavalier while it is fairly slow as a whole, downshifts very nicely when I ask it to.

 

[Bill in Utah]

Originally Posted By: sangyup81
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
none of you guys have driven an auto integrated into the vehicle properly.

The moment you corner hard or use the throttle aggressively my slushbox 'awakens' into play mode, transforming into a downshifting wonder if you brake hard enough and holding gears through corners even if you lift the throttle!

Plus, with infinitely variable lockup you can have a hi stall converter that drives stock until you punch it.

Not all automatics suck.


Where can we find a list of these superior automatics? Which car are you driving?


The autostick on our Subaru is VERY nice. The sports mode is impressive.

But it is NOT a manual. It revs less on the freeway than the Subaru manual and that was the major reason why we picked it over the manual Outback.

I do like that it can be shifted and left in any gear.

Bill

 

[brianl703]

Originally Posted By: silverrat
I dont think any of the big 3 have offered anything in that segment for a really long time. For that kind of car to be found in manual one has to look to Accord/Altima/Camry.


Ford Fusion has a manual. It's predecessor, the Contour, also had a manual. You may not consider these "mid size" but neither is the Altima.

 

[Smokescreen]

To me drive by wire throttle kills any fun a manual trans offered as it did in days of yore. Instead of wave-like pattern throttle up while clutch pressing down and vise-versa you got robotic like motions that take all the fun out of it. I went with auto because in my commute I have 95% highway, and I loathed bumper-to-bumper 10 foot creeping that is found in all cities these days in a manual, clutch in/clutch out every few seconds.

Longevity in a properly cared for auto is not an issue. It can withstand the rigors of multiple drivers with different skills better than a manual can. With de-acceleration fuel cut and other goodies, it can get better economy.

Newer sports cars are all going DSG. Rally, Formula 1, Touring cars...its the future. Maybe not for Nascar...but the rest of the racing world...and eventually it will be found in all cars.

Don't get me wrong, I grew up on a manual, and on a good sporty/ muscle car makes it totally fun, but the autos these days are excellent and still give you 95%+ the fun a manual did.

 

[Kiwi_ME]

Originally Posted By: Smokescreen
To me drive by wire throttle kills any fun a manual trans offered
Well, apparently not all electronically-controlled throttles are the same as the one in my car is brilliant with a manual transmission.

Originally Posted By: MrHorspwer
By the next model cycle, I predict that VW will not have a single manual transmission and every car will have gone to a DSG
VW only sell DSGs and autos in this country as of 2010. Even the low-end Polo has a 7-speed DSG as standard.
However, living in a remote country with limited technical resources manual transmissions are still prized for their long-term maintainability.

 

[dailydriver]

Originally Posted By: MrHorspwer
When John Heinricy logged a sub-8 minute Nurburgring lap in a CTS-V, he did it, by his own choice, with an automatic transmission. Not only was it an automatic, he left it in auto mode, choosing to not use paddles.


Since when are CTS-Vs available with 6L80Es?? (Or is it some other slushbox???)

 

[JHZR2]

Originally Posted By: Smokescreen
I went with auto because in my commute I have 95% highway, and I loathed bumper-to-bumper 10 foot creeping that is found in all cities these days in a manual, clutch in/clutch out every few seconds.

Longevity in a properly cared for auto is not an issue. It can withstand the rigors of multiple drivers with different skills better than a manual can. With de-acceleration fuel cut and other goodies, it can get better economy.


I drive in traffic a lot, and in my BMW, it is a breeze. In my wife's integra, it was a major pain. It is all in the design.

AT longevity? LOL. Don't HD trucks use MTs? I wonder if there is a reason behind that...

And all our MT cars have the fuel cutout too.

 

[MrHorspwer]

Quote:
Since when are CTS-Vs available with 6L80Es?? (Or is it some other slushbox???


Since the 2009 introduction of the new style CTS. It's also a 6L90... not a 6L80.

 

[sdan27]

Seems it would be cheaper/easier for a manufacturer to only offer one type of trans for a vehicle. Could definately see how it'd be beneficial for them. I drive a pick-up with a 5-speed manual. Don't think I'd like an auto that much in this app. I love downshifting on my way to a stop light and get away without using any brakes.

 

[crinkles]

does a traditional auto like 2000's camry have a physical connection between neutral and the gear stick? if i throw it into neutral, i want there to be no option but for the [censored] thing to go into neutral. i don't want a computer overriding me. until it can be shown that this isn't the case i will buy manuals.