M1-108 holes - louvers barely open in new filter

[daman]

Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: KGMtech
Louvers are a much better design and easier to manufacture at the stamping stage.

There I said it. Again.

BTW, I work in the Automotive Metal Stamping and assemblies industry. I think I know enough about how pierced holes and lanced louvers are done.


If it's so easy, why can't these filter manufactures put out louvered center tubes with consistent louvers that are opened up a good amount.


I was thinking the same thing.

 

[slybunda]

Hmm if i have a car with an engine on its way out i wonder if i can pick a filter with closed louvers and let engine die of oil starvation and raise a case to get engine replaced by the filter manufacturer? Hmmm....

 

[goodtimes]

Originally Posted By: LeakySeals
Originally Posted By: goodtimes
Champ is in bankruptcy and it a fairly small staff left to make these. From news in 2015 their jobs are being sent to other countries. The machines need to be adjusted and maintained by employees who are diligent and care about it. I don't know what Purolator's excuse is for their louver problems. I chalk it up to bad QC and supervision on the factory floor.

Has nothing to do with Fram.


I didn't see the word Fram in what I said.

 

[goodtimes]

Originally Posted By: slybunda
Hmm if i have a car with an engine on its way out i wonder if i can pick a filter with closed louvers and let engine die of oil starvation and raise a case to get engine replaced by the filter manufacturer? Hmmm....


Pick a filter company that isn't in bankruptcy.

 

[rubberchicken]

I am not sure why you are fixated on Champ Labs being in bankruptcy: According to the WSJ its Chapter 11 so they fully plan on being around for the long haul. Reading about the guy from New Zealand who lead the leveraged buyout- it seems he had been betting wrong lately. It appears Graeme Hart also owns the company that makes Fram.

 

[goodtimes]

I
Originally Posted By: rubberchicken
I am not sure why you are fixated on Champ Labs being in bankruptcy: According to the WSJ its Chapter 11 so they fully plan on being around for the long haul. Reading about the guy from New Zealand who lead the leveraged buyout- it seems he had been betting wrong lately. It appears Graeme Hart also owns the company that makes Fram.

Not fixated on anything. They are in bankruptcy and it does affect quality more than likely with a smaller crew who apparently are losing their jobs according to the article. The above response to getting a free engine was a joke, pick someone not in bankruptcy to sue.

 

[slacktide_bitog]

Can't an M1-110 fit where you're installing it?

Hastings seems to be the only company that actually knows how to make a slotted center tube.

 

[Vern_in_IL]

Originally Posted By: goodtimes
I
Originally Posted By: rubberchicken
I am not sure why you are fixated on Champ Labs being in bankruptcy: According to the WSJ its Chapter 11 so they fully plan on being around for the long haul. Reading about the guy from New Zealand who lead the leveraged buyout- it seems he had been betting wrong lately. It appears Graeme Hart also owns the company that makes Fram.

Not fixated on anything. They are in bankruptcy and it does affect quality more than likely with a smaller crew who apparently are losing their jobs according to the article. The above response to getting a free engine was a joke, pick someone not in bankruptcy to sue.


I agree! What happens when a company looses money.... things change BIG TIME. Benefits are cut, the "fat" is cut, material cost is pressured to lower prices, new cheaper materials are used, then the product just barely passes the Warranty period. Aftermarket warranties are blamed on installer error, or denied. Employees are not treated well, pressured to retire, more temps are hired with no experience, plants close and consolidate, you start to loose customer contracts, now you only have one or two major contracts and if they leave, it's bust, they own you now, want price cuts, now you are deep in red making product and loosing money... BOOM.

American companies that get into trouble, tend not to think of the "long term", instead they will do things for short term gains(lower quality) and get killed.

 

[rubberchicken]

Originally Posted By: goodtimes
I
Originally Posted By: rubberchicken
I am not sure why you are fixated on Champ Labs being in bankruptcy: According to the WSJ its Chapter 11 so they fully plan on being around for the long haul. Reading about the guy from New Zealand who lead the leveraged buyout- it seems he had been betting wrong lately. It appears Graeme Hart also owns the company that makes Fram.

Not fixated on anything. They are in bankruptcy and it does affect quality more than likely with a smaller crew who apparently are losing their jobs according to the article. The above response to getting a free engine was a joke, pick someone not in bankruptcy to sue.


My mistake, I misinterpreted what you said about a warranty claim due to a bad filter re: bankruptcy - that is actually a good point.

 

[THafeez]

I had called Champ Labs a few days ago to complain about the Royal Purple and M1 filters I got about closed louvers. After 2 calls someone picked up and suggested that I take the loss and send it to them for testing and inspection or just return to point of purchase. I understand their plight, but a 14-18 dollar filter and this type of service is not nice. I did tell the customer service rep to speak to whoever manages the floor to check for anomalies, but we all know how customer suggestions/complaints sometimes get "lost".

Very grateful for Motorking in times like these where top brand filters are getting a bad rep because of their manufacturers. FRAM really gets it and builds a killer filter for every category.

 

[rubberchicken]

Originally Posted By: THafeez
I had called Champ Labs a few days ago to complain about the Royal Purple and M1 filters I got about closed louvers. After 2 calls someone picked up and suggested that I take the loss and send it to them for testing and inspection or just return to point of purchase. I understand their plight, but a 14-18 dollar filter and this type of service is not nice. I did tell the customer service rep to speak to whoever manages the floor to check for anomalies, but we all know how customer suggestions/complaints sometimes get "lost".

Very grateful for Motorking in times like these where top brand filters are getting a bad rep because of their manufacturers. FRAM really gets it and builds a killer filter for every category.

That is quite interesting: I looked up Champ Labs tech support and was going to call them tomorrow and complain about the same thing. Do you recall who you spoke with ? I might try to contact them as well. Recently I bought a filter opener, and some filters for my cars and motorcycle with the intention of posting pics. The other size M1 filters seemed to be quality units- it was only the M1-108 that appeared defective. The Motorcraft FL-910S seemed very good for the price, and the old Fram was poor quality.

 

[rubberchicken]

Originally Posted By: slacktide_bitog
Can't an M1-110 fit where you're installing it?

Hastings seems to be the only company that actually knows how to make a slotted center tube.



It probably could, but in this case it is for a Yamaha motorcycle so space is a concern.

 

[THafeez]

I don't remember who it was but I dialed the number on the box and pressed 2# for technical support. First time around went to voicemail. 2nd time a man picked up. Told me he would let them know.

 

[sir1900]

I think you guys are wasting your time calling Champ. Your time is worth a lot more than the response you will receive from those working the phones.

There are better options out there for less money.

 

[rubberchicken]

I do not doubt that it is probably a waste of time, but if these 2 filters got past inspection, there could be hundreds or thousands of defective filters that also got past.

 

[crazyoildude]

Fram builds one great filter and that is the ultra.. I hope they don't "fix It" and change the way they build them because if they do i will stop using them again for another 25 years lol

 

[sir1900]

Originally Posted By: rubberchicken
I do not doubt that it is probably a waste of time, but if these 2 filters got past inspection, there could be hundreds or thousands of defective filters that also got past.


I have no doubt there are thousands out there that are defective. I made a mistake of not inspecting a CQ black prior to installation this spring as it never occurred to me the louvers were a problem. Upon removal, most of the louvers weren't opened and I wonder how much (or little) the filter was actually filtering as a result. I examined the remaining 5 in my stash and tossed 3 of them into the recycling bin. I examined a M1-108 -- same thing -- closed louvers and tossed that into the recycling as well.

99.99% of users aren't going to cut open or inspect the filter upon removal so unless Champ's phone is ringing off the hook, it's likely nothing will be done (much like Purolator).

 

[THafeez]

Originally Posted By: sir1900
so unless Champ's phone is ringing off the hook, it's likely nothing will be done (much like Purolator).


+1
That's a shame

 

[oil_film_movies]

I hadn't thought louvers could be a problem, but they are. I just checked the MicroGreens in a small stash, and all louvers look open. This will be a standard inspection of mine from now on.

 

[Vern_in_IL]

Originally Posted By: crazyoildude
Fram builds one great filter and that is the ultra.. I hope they don't "fix It" and change the way they build them because if they do i will stop using them again for another 25 years lol


I agree, mess with the ultra and they will be [censored]!