M1 0W40 in both BMW 330i and Volvo S60 2.5T?

[nathancarter]

Good morning,

This is a multi-part question.

I'm considering switching from dino to synthetic in my wife's 2005 Volvo 2.5T at the next oil change, which will be at 67500 miles, following Volvo's recommended schedule. We bought it at 40k miles and I have used Castrol dino since then; the manual says that the dealer only uses synthetic on special request, so I assumed it has used dino all its life. Excerpt from the owner's manual is posted below*. Too late to switch to synthetic at 67k?

I also have a 2002 BMW 330i with 101k; I have been doing 7.5k OCI (half the recommended 15k) using BMW-branded 5W30, which to my understanding is simply repackaged GC.

For simplicity's sake, I'm considering switching both to Mobil1 0W40, which (to my knowledge) is the only readily-available, off-the-shelf oil that meets BMW LL-01 specification. I've searched a bit, but haven't found any specific pros or cons for M1 0W40 in the Volvo 2.5T. The manual recommends 5W30 dino Castrol.

Also of note, we life in Florida so it stays pretty warm, only one or two days out of the year does it dip below freezing, and much of the summer it's 90+ outside. Neither of these are race cars: The BMW is driven primarily on the interstate, about 25k per year; the Volvo is much more about-town, and she usually drives pretty gently. It IS a turbo, but to tell the truth she rarely revs it high enough that the turbo sees any action.

Primary goal is motor & accessory longevity; secondary goals are fuel economy, keeping only a single oil type in my garage, and being able to drive to Wal-Mart or Autozone and pick up oil when I need it.

Comments?

Thanks,
- Nathan


From the Volvo S60 owner's manual:
Oil quality
Engine oil must meet the minimum ILSAC specification GF-2, including ACEA A1, API SJ, SJ/CF and SJ/ Energy Conserving.

Your Volvo has been certified to standards using ILSAC oil specification GF-2 5W-30. Volvo recommends use of oil with a quality rating equal to or higher than ILSAC GF-2. Equivalent and better oils include ACEA A1, API SJ, SJ/CF, and SJ/Energy conserving. Lower quality oils may not offer the same fuel economy, engine performance, or engine protection.
Volvo Cars recommends Castrol.
Depending on your driving habits, premium or synthetic oils may provide superior fuel economy and engine protection. Consult your Volvo retailer for recommendations on premium or synthetic oils.

Oil additives must not be used.

NOTE: Synthetic oil is not used when the oil is changed at normal maintenance services. This oil is only used at customer request, at additional charge. Please consult your Volvo retailer.

 

[wavinwayne]

My 3-part answer
1) M1 0w40 will work like a champ in both engines.
2) It's never too late to switch to synthetic.
3) Synthetics are a waste of money where not required.

 

[Touring5]

The M1 0w40 would be a good choice for both cars. GC, too would be good - just not as easily found if you don't have an Autozone nearby (that stocks it). The BMW oil is considered a very capable oil - but is, to my knowledge, not the same as GC. All three meet LL-01 specification and being synthetic would be good in a turbo motor.

 

[d00df00d]

Your BMW will love the Mobil 1 0w-40.

Your Volvo will tolerate it. If the owner's manual only says 5w-30, that's a pretty good sign that they don't want you to use thicker oils. You can certainly run it, but it won't be the best; fuel economy and turbo response might suffer slightly. Whether that's worth the simplicity is up to you. If you're really interested in protecting the engine, though, use a good 5w-30 or 0w-30 like Mobil 1 or GC.

By the way, BMW 5w-30 is very different from GC, but it performs at about the same level.

Don't worry about switching to synthetic. If you want to do it, take the plunge and enjoy.

I agree that you'll be better off saving money and using a good dino in the Volvo.

 

[jesbo]

I ran Mobil-1 5W30 in my '98 Volvo S70 T5 for over 100K miles and the engine ran as smooth and powerful at 100K as it did with 5K. I did oil changes at about 7500 miles. And looking at the valve train through the oil fill, the engine looked like new - no discoloration, sludge, or other buildup. The 5-cyl turbo engines just loved mobil-1. My main reason for using synthetic in the Volvo was because of the turbo... Turbos can cook dino oil - which is used to both lubricate and cool the volvo turbos.

That said, I'm using GC (0w30) in my '08 BMW and in my '08 Volvo XC/70 (3.2L inline 6) I'm using Castrol Edge 5w30. Both BMW and Volvo are recommending castrol synthetic oils in their current engines.

I do not believe BMW 5w30 oil is repackaged GC. The GC is is speced as 0w30. There has been some discussion that the BMW labeled oil is really a synthetic blend (I can't confirm though), while the GC uses a fully synthetic base stock.

 

[shanneba]

The BMW 5w-30 is not the same as GC but does have some similar properties. You can compare them directly on my OUAs from my 330 Ci in the Gulf coast Texas climate.

GC is also BMW-LL01 approved, I have never had a problem finding it at Autozone either in Indiana or Texas.

A couple of other oils are recommended by BMW for the US market,
Penziol Platinum European Formula 5w-30 (I have only seen listings for 55 gal drums) and Valvoline SynPower 5w-30.

The Mobil 1 0w-40 will likely end up at about the same viscosity as GC after a 5-7000 mile run. It seems to shear in most applications based on UOAs listed on this site.

 

[mva]

Valvoline Synpower MST 5W30 is also a good choice if you can find it:

http://www.valvoline.com/products/Synpower.pdf

 

[Doug Hillary]

Hi,
nathancarter - M1 0W-40 will do an excellent job in both of your engines. It is a particularly good product for use in "charged" engines where it meets the specification's of the engine manufacturer

It is the only product used by AMG (Daimler AG) and Porsche

Porsche mandate this product in the twin-turbo Cayenne engines for all round use and they use it in many of their late series race engines

Use it with confidence!

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: jesbo
There has been some discussion that the BMW labeled oil is really a synthetic blend (I can't confirm though)

No. People thought it might have been Group III (Shell XHVI), but I'm pretty sure it turned out to be PAO.


Originally Posted By: shanneba
The Mobil 1 0w-40 will likely end up at about the same viscosity as GC after a 5-7000 mile run. It seems to shear in most applications based on UOAs listed on this site.

I thought that was an old phenomenon that isn't seen to happen any more...

 

[sprintman]

To save more money see if your Mobil distributor has the equivalent of the 20-litre drums sold here. It saves a lot of money.

 

[nathancarter]

All,
Thanks for the comments.
I'm (almost?) definitely switching to the Mobil 1 0w-40 for the BMW - it's just easier to obtain - unless there is a specific reason that BMW or GC 5w-30 is better for extended highway driving and religious 7500 mile OCI.

Thanks also for the clarification on the difference between BMW-branded versus GC...

Any more comments on this? --

Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Your Volvo will tolerate it... If you're really interested in protecting the engine, though, use a good 5w-30 or 0w-30 like Mobil 1 or GC.


Again, my primary goal is engine longevity, so if the Mobil 1 0w-40 is not optimal for the Volvo 2.5T, then I'll just keep two different oils on hand.

3000 mile OCI with a good 5w-30 dino?
7500 mile OCI with a good 5w-30 dino? (manual recommends)
7500 mile OCI with a good 5w-30 synthetic?

(I guess I should just send off a sample to find out)

I know I can get M1 easily, not sure if GC is usually available at my local Autozone or not - I haven't checked. I haven't even really researched what dino is best; I've just been using Castrol GTX 5w-30.

And, since it never really gets cold here, is 5w-30 more appropriate than 0w-30?

Thanks again,

 

[d00df00d]

Castrol GTX is good. 5,000 miles on that would be great IMO.

7500 miles on Mobil 1 would be good, too. GC could likely go a little longer.

 

[jesbo]

Originally Posted By: nathancarter

I'm (almost?) definitely switching to the Mobil 1 0w-40 for the BMW - it's just easier to obtain - unless there is a specific reason that BMW or GC 5w-30 is better for extended highway driving and religious 7500 mile OCI.


I find GC easy to obtain (It seems to be stocked at all Autozone stores in my area). It's about the same price as M1 0w40 and since BMW recommends Castrol products, I'm going to stick with GC. If I was out of warranty on my 2 cars, I'd have no concerns running the M1 0w40, though.

As far as whether a 5wXX is better than a 0wXX in your climate, all I can say is a 0w is a little thinner at startup and thus flows more quickly to all moving parts where its needed (not a bad thing). Once the engine warms up, the oil will transistion to the higher rated viscosity. So in my mind a 0w40 is fine for all-season use in your climate, but the 0w aspect is much more imporatant the farther north you go during winter months.

 

[sprintman]

Mobil Australia web site says M1 0W40 for 2005 2.5T engine.

 

[KLowD9x]

Holy [censored]! You have been going 7500 miles between services with conventional in the sump!?

I wouldn't recommend that at all. 7500 miles on the semisyn we pump at my Volvo dealer is still far too long of an OCI.

0w40 is great in the I5. I run M1 0w40 in the 93 and GC 0w30 in the 04. Both get changed every 7.5K and they love it!

I recommend you switch to M1 in the Volvo ASAP. Your oil pan seals will thank you.

 

[nathancarter]

Originally Posted By: KLowD9x
Holy [censored]! You have been going 7500 miles between services with conventional in the sump!?


Yes; that's what the Volvo manual recommends.
The Volvo manual also recommends 5w-30 conventional, except for "Extreme engine operation" for which it recommends 10w-30 synthetic.
And the BMW manual recommends 15,000 mile intervals on BMW 5w-30 synthetic, which apparently performs similarly to GC 5w-30 and M1 0w-40. (I do 7500 mile OCI)
And they both say that the transmission & differential fluids are "lifetime fill." (I've already changed 'em in both)

So, what do I believe?
People say "Use 5w-30 because that's what the manual recommends" then in the next breath say "The manual says 7500 miles? Don't believe everything you read!"

It smelled pretty burnt at the last change, but can you really tell anything by the smell coming out of the drain hole? I thought nothing of it, but for 12 years I drove an old diesel M-B 240D, so maybe the nose doesn't knows.

sigh.

This leads back to the question:
Fuel economy and turbo response notwithstanding, would M1 0w-30 really offer better protection than M1 0w-40?


The BMW, at 101k, is well out of warranty, but the Volvo still has CPO warranty to 100k... if I can find a legitimate dealer to do the CPO work, but that's a different rant.

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: nathancarter
So, what do I believe?
People say "Use 5w-30 because that's what the manual recommends" then in the next breath say "The manual says 7500 miles? Don't believe everything you read!"

Excellent point.

People adhere more strongly to the grade requirement ostensibly because it is based on a lot of aspects of how the engine is engineered. You can do it differently, but that's rolling the dice.

Shortening your OCI, on the other hand, is not rolling the dice. Worst-case scenario, it's just wasteful.


Originally Posted By: nathancarter
Fuel economy and turbo response notwithstanding, would M1 0w-30 really offer better protection than M1 0w-40?

Possibly, but not by much I suspect.

 

[jesbo]

M-1 0w40 is the "European Formula" which meets ACEA A3 and BMW LL-01 requirements for extended drain intervals (Since BMW says OCI of 15K miles). I don't think the M-1 0w30 "Advanced Fuel Economy" meets those specs. For the Volvo, I suspect either oil will do just fine if you are sticking to the recommended 7500 mile OCI. The 0w30 would likely perform well in the Bimmer with a reduced OCI of 7500. I would probably run the 0w40 though if it was my choice because of the turbo (And AFAIK the 0w40 is a true synthetic base; I'm not sure the 0w30 or other US formulations of M-1 are full synthetic base - even though the bottles say "synthetic").

 

[d00df00d]

I wouldn't use Mobil 1 0w-30 in a BMW. Its HTHS viscosity is 2.99, and BMWs need at least 3.5.

 

[Jim 5]

FWIW, my UOA's on my 330ci, as interpreted (for a fee) by a very well respected and no longer contributing member of BITOG showed best results on GC (green).

I was advised that it was "the" oil for my car. The BMW 5w-30 did very well also. The BMW stuff is not GC, it is Castrol Softec TXT 5w-30 as sold in Europe.