I advocate viewing the owners manual as a recommendation knowing that certain circumstances do require deviating from it. This includes earlier or extended services depending on the products used and service conditions. When I was a tech I was 100% honest with my customers and never pressured them. If they asked I told them the truth. Needless to say I was requested often in a large 40 bay dealer.
LSJR Boutique vs OTS shootout
- Thread starter rstsco
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OVERKILL
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I wouldn't have figured it to be true in 1995, considering API restrictions on phosphorous really didn't come into play until API SM (there was a cap in SL, but it was quite high), which was 2004. The Driven oil in this test, despite Lake noting that it was based on API SN chemistry, had almost 1,200ppm of phosphorous, so clearly nowhere near being compliant as an xW-30.
I inquired about the TEOST. I've posted a lot on it before and the questionable aspects of it. I am curious why some still think it's valuable.
This is what Lake said:
"TEOST is really about plain journal bearing deposits in turbos. While not 100% accurate to the real world, it is directionally correct. High levels of MoTDC will cause more deposits in turbo applications, which is why the euro spec oils are lower in MoTDC."
This is what Lake said:
"TEOST is really about plain journal bearing deposits in turbos. While not 100% accurate to the real world, it is directionally correct. High levels of MoTDC will cause more deposits in turbo applications, which is why the euro spec oils are lower in MoTDC."
Thank you!!
My question to those much smarter than I.
Does high levels of MoTDC also contribute to piston deposits?
And, despite testing poorly, in real world is HPL formulated to resist deposits in turbo applications?
My friend has a 2017 Camry LE non-turbo. Their torque converted was replaced at 115k miles; still on the factory fluid.
It’s misleading and shady sales tactics to pander to “low maintenance requirements”, but if your transmission has a problem outside of warranty? Oh well. The fluid covered it for the warranty period. Despite selling it as though it doesn’t need maintenance. It sets the average person up for failures.
Blindly trust if you want. As you said, that’s between you and your wallet; though possibly facing replacements out of warranty.
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There are also countless examples of high-mileage Toyotas with the original fluid running just fine. My son's '08 Lexus RX350 was this way, ~15 years old when we got rid of it/~140K miles on OE fluid, transmission shifted fine.My friend has a 2017 Camry LE non-turbo. Their torque converted was replaced at 115k miles; still on the factory fluid.
It’s misleading and shady sales tactics to pander to “low maintenance requirements”, but if your transmissionmission has a problem outside of warranty? Oh well. The fluid covered it for the warranty period. Despite selling it as though it doesn’t need maintenance. It sets the average person up for failures.
Blindly trust. That’s you and your wallet.
I don't know of any modern era OEM turbos that are journal bearing. That aside though, I've seen inside the housing of an OEM BW turbo that had 280k miles on a boutique oil high in moly, and the guts looked immaculate. Not even a hint of deposit or wear. (Turbo was removed due to unrelated compressor wheel damage)
I wasn’t particularly picking on Toyota as all OEM’s are doing the same. Balancing cost of ownership, fuel economy, and longevity. Just pointing out some crazy recommendations.
I don't disagree - I couldn't believe it when I saw that it had never been changed. I think folks should substitute "100K miles" for "lifetime". I know on our Atlas it's 80K but I was having some strange shifting behavior after 60K so did a multi-drain-fill with Maxlife red bottle and boom, no more issues. Transmissions get hammered and really should have regular service but it's typically expensive and folks don't like that w/r to ownership costs. The dual-clutch auto in my Sportwagen/son's S3 is the same, 40K is the service interval in the manual but I do it sooner.
I believe it. I've read posts over the years that suggests RL keeps engines/pistons clean too. Beats me.
If my little 1.8 ever blows and I need engine work or have to replace the turbo, I'll be sure to post up pics.I believe it. I've read posts over the years that suggests RL keeps engines/pistons clean too. Beats me.
If you took an existing oil and cranked up the MoTDC without any other changes, yes. Nothing exists in a vacuum though.
Most modern OEM turbos I'm familiar with are journal bearing. At least on VW, Audi, BMW, Subaru, Honda. Including performance engines like in the RS/M trims. The only modern OEM ball bearing that comes to mind is the one on the Toyota G16E-GTS in the GR corolla/yaris. I assume ball bearing is more common when you get into the 100k+ range, Porsche is using variable geometry turbos for example, but the margin is there. Journal bearing designs are much cheaper.
That's what keeps this board alive. Otherwise, it would just be a Wikipedia page.
Same seen a OE Turbo from a 1994 Supra with like 157k on the clock run on redline 5w30 for a 100k and it looked perfect...
RL has been using their PAO/ester blend with a lot of moly for years so you'd think if there were some issues with turbo deposits it would have been detected by now. 
As usual just speculating. RL's results were extremely bad though. 126mg LOL. 30mg is the limit. 
As usual just speculating. RL's results were extremely bad though. 126mg LOL. 30mg is the limit.
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I’m not opposed to going longer but I always change the oil on these cars yearly and don’t do more than 3k miles each.
At the same time, are we really wanting to wait to roll the dice on if neglected transmissionmissions will fail earlier on; if at all, even later in its life? Properly maintained A/Ts should easily last 300k or more. It may not matter to the first owner or on relatively lower mileage (most would consider 100k just broken in on a Toyota or a Honda)…but it could, or it be the next owner’s problem. I think there is some aspect of considering who may wind up with that vehicle; perhaps even another family member or friend, that I can help by maintaining it well.
Just my .02
Maybe certain year models have service less requirements; unless towing etc? The thing is, how do you know if that is your vehicle until you’ve already chosen the maintenance approach and it has unfolded? The car care nut on YT; who specializes in Toyota/Lexus, says they often refuse to work on transmissionmissions that haven’t been serviced before; if the customer is having issues and trusted “lifetime fluid” because they’ve seen failures and don’t want to be the last ones to work on it before it implodes. So, maybe older models were ironclad or indestructible, but why not just change the fluid a few times and avoid playing the lottery on newer vehicles with their unknown failure rate or reliability ratings?
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Which again I think underscores the lack of solid correlation between real world and TEOST.RL has been using their PAO/ester blend with a lot of moly for years so you'd think if there were some issues with turbo deposits it would have been detected by now.
Well there you have itRL has been using their PAO/ester blend with a lot of moly for years so you'd think if there were some issues with turbo deposits it would have been detected by now.
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