Longer/higher capacity filters.

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rphart

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Interested in using longer, or larger diameter, filters to increase the total oil capacity of the system, and also to theoretically increase oil cooling. Is this a good idea? And does anyone have experience with this?

Have an application for an oil filter on a Kawasaki 26HP liquid cooled V-twin mower engine where a Mobil M1-103 is the standard replacement filter for the manufacturer's branded filter. I have plenty of room for a longer filter, but not much larger diameter. Does anyone know of a replacement for the M1-103 that is longer or slightly larger diameter? Prefer Mobil, they seem to be really well made (manufactured by Champion?), but any suggestion will be appreciated.

If this goes well, also interested in same idea for:Toyota Camry V6 and Saturn with M1-102, F150 5.4 Motorcraft FL820S, 1966 Moline 47 HP tractor FL300.
 
For the Kawa - it takes a 3/4-16 thread "Toyota" gasket sized filter.

51396
UPC Number: 765809513969
Principal Application: GM Vehicles (99-05), Geo (89-92), Toyota (88-06), Various Ford-New Holland Tractors, Suzuki (96-05), Suzuki Marine Engines
All Applications
Style: Spin-On Lube Filter
Service: Lube
Type: Full Flow
Media: Paper
Height: 3.402
Outer Diameter Top: 2.685
Outer Diameter Bottom: Closed
Thread Size: 3/4-16
By-Pass Valve Setting-PSI: 8-11
Anti-Drain Back Valve: Yes
Burst Pressure-PSI: 400
Max Flow Rate: 7-9 GPM
Nominal Micro Rating: 19

Gasket Diameters
Number O.D. I.D. Thk.
Attached 2.475 2.173 0.233

I'm uncertain of longer filters in this gasket range ..but if the filter land is big enough (broad enough) there are longer filters ..the FL400S is only .15 bigger in radius (.3 diameter)

51516
UPC Number: 765809515161
Principal Application: Ford/Mercury (81-06), Chrysler/Jeep (02-06), Mazda Trucks (94-05)
All Applications
Style: Spin-On Lube Filter
Service: Lube
Type: Full Flow
Media: Paper
Height: 4.828
Outer Diameter Top: 2.921
Outer Diameter Bottom: Closed
Thread Size: 3/4-16
By-Pass Valve Setting-PSI: 8-11
Anti-Drain Back Valve: Yes
Beta Ratio: 2/20=14/31
Burst Pressure-PSI: 275
Max Flow Rate: 7-9 GPM
Nominal Micro Rating: 20

Gasket Diameters
Number O.D. I.D. Thk.
Attached 2.734 2.430 0.226

There may be others ..but I haven't kept up on the Asian engine stuff.
dunno.gif


The FL300 filter is the same as the FL1A/51515 can in diameter/gasket

UPC Number: 765809510685
Principal Application: Chrysler (70-91), Ford/Mercury (83-97), Land Rover (95-04), Toyota (68-90)
All Applications
Style: Spin-On Lube Filter
Service: Lube
Type: Full Flow
Media: Paper
Height: 4.338
Outer Diameter Top: 3.660
Outer Diameter Bottom: Closed
Thread Size: 3/4-16
By-Pass Valve Setting-PSI: 8-11
Anti-Drain Back Valve: Yes
Beta Ratio: 2/20=10/26
Burst Pressure-PSI: 275
Max Flow Rate: 7-9 GPM
Nominal Micro Rating: 19

Gasket Diameters
Number O.D. I.D. Thk.
Attached 2.834 2.462 0.200

51515
UPC Number: 765809515154
Principal Application: Chrysler Family of Cars/Trucks (57-70), Ford Family of Cars/Trucks (57-00), Mazda Trucks (94-00), Toyota Landcruiser (71-96) - (Two Quart version is 51773)
All Applications
Style: Spin-On Lube Filter
Service: Lube
Type: Full Flow
Media: Paper
Height: 5.178
Outer Diameter: 3.660
Thread Size: 3/4-16
By-Pass Valve Setting-PSI: 8-11
Anti-Drain Back Valve: Yes
Beta Ratio: 2/20=19/41
Burst Pressure-PSI: 270
Max Flow Rate: 7-9 GPM
Nominal Micro Rating: 19

Gasket Diameters
Number O.D. I.D. Thk.
Attached 2.834 2.462 0.200

51773
UPC Number: 765809517738
Principal Application: Ford Trucks, Massey-Ferguson Tractors, Oliver Tractors, VW Eurovan (93-95)
All Applications
Style: Spin-On Lube Filter
Service: Lube
Type: Full Flow
Media: Paper
Height: 6.982
Outer Diameter Top: 3.663
Outer Diameter Bottom: Closed
Thread Size: 3/4-16
By-Pass Valve Setting-PSI: 8-11
Anti-Drain Back Valve: Yes
Burst Pressure-PSI: 225
Max Flow Rate: 7-9 GPM
Nominal Micro Rating: 30

Gasket Diameters
Number O.D. I.D. Thk.
Attached 1 2.834 2.462 0.200


The difference, dimensionally, is limited to length. Note the differences in spec's though before you go hog wild on bigger. There may be some variations in beta numbers or bypass valve settings.
 
Looks like the FL400S would fit OK on the gasket flange, I will check at next oil change. Use Motorcraft filters on my Fords, and especially like the S series with the silicone drainback. Keep the 400S on hand now for V6 Aerostar.

What about clearance between the filter and the muffler? With the Kawasaki OEM filter the muffler is approx 2 and 1/4 inches diagonal measurement away from the end of the filter. With the FL400S the muffler will be approx 1 inch below the end of the filter. Will there be significant heating of the filter/oil from the muffler? And would this heading outweigh the advantages of the larger capacity filter?
 
I doubt that there will be any significant heating as long as there is some airflow over there besides the wind.
If you're worried, just wrap, paint, or insulate the exhaust.
 
I'm with undummy. That type of clearance of the exhaust is just fine for all kinds of stuff under the hood.

Stick a "sticker" to the filter on the exhaust side. It will probably look the same when you change the filter
dunno.gif
 
I know in my Mazda Protege and my Mazda 626 the 2 available filters are interchangable. One is the "V6" filter (ST7317) and one is the 4 cyl filter (ST6606) (I think??). Anyway, many 4 cyl protege folks prefer to use the longer 6 cyl engine filter for added capacity and filter area. Some charts cross-reference between the two filters as well. The only difference between filters though is length, not width, so fitment is not an issue.

Having said that, i would be sure the "non-OEM" filter you want to use for larger capacity is indeed truly a fit for your car. Incorrect threads, burst point, bypass point, etc. can all create lots of funky problems, not to mention messey clean-ups.
 
I have a 27hp Kohlers (stock 51348)and a 27hp Kawasaki (stock 51394). The Kohler is very hard on oil. The Kawasaki is liquid cooled and easy on oil. I was thinking of running an oversized in my Kohlers. The Kholer filter is larger, while the Kawasaki filter is much smaller, but seems to do better.
 
This is serendipitously (sp?) just what I was wondering about.

I have a Mazda Mx-3 with the 1.8L V6 which is the same block as the older 626 6cyl. The spec for the filter is the 7317 which is what I have been using.

I have seen other posts in which people discussed 3593A and 2808 as alternatives to the 7317 (i guess as an underized and oversized choice respectively. BTW Sorry to be all FRAM-y with the part numbers.)

I bought a 3593A for my GF's Honda. The local store that is most convenient for me carries more stock of 2808 than practically any filter under the sun.

What I am wondering is can i standardize on one of these filters for the two cars? What things ther than clearance shoould i worry about if i go oversize? Are diameter and threading really the only techinical limitations with fitment? Any guide to those two features across filter models?

Sorry for the dumb questions. I spend a lot of time obsessing about oil, and not much on filters. Except for my Porsche which gets Mahles.


quote:
Originally posted by hominid7:
I know in my Mazda Protege and my Mazda 626 the 2 available filters are interchangable. One is the "V6" filter (ST7317) and one is the 4 cyl filter (ST6606) (I think??). Anyway, many 4 cyl protege folks prefer to use the longer 6 cyl engine filter for added capacity and filter area. Some charts cross-reference between the two filters as well. The only difference between filters though is length, not width, so fitment is not an issue.

Having said that, i would be sure the "non-OEM" filter you want to use for larger capacity is indeed truly a fit for your car. Incorrect threads, burst point, bypass point, etc. can all create lots of funky problems, not to mention messey clean-ups.
Click to expand...
 
I am looking for a larger capacity filter for my 2001 Honda Odyssey . What is available - in Pure-One, Wix, Baldwin ? - Thanks
 
rkpatt - just hit the search and put in Honda and oversize in the word field.

but look here photo

The take the two numbers and plug them into Wix Use the same utility to compare it to your stock size.
 
Just remember...
The physical size of an oil filter does not necessarily mean it will hold more contamination. Check the dirt holding capacities before making your choices.
 
quote:
Originally posted by Pete C.:
Just remember...
The physical size of an oil filter does not necessarily mean it will hold more contamination. Check the dirt holding capacities before making your choices.
Click to expand...
Who publishes such info?
dunno.gif
 
Nobody that I know of. I have an old Greshen that has the beta and holding capacity ..as well as flow potential @ visc printed on it. I believe, IIRC, that it had a 10gram holding cap. It was like a FL1A size filter (I'll try and find it)
dunno.gif
 
quote:
Originally posted by scotlykins:
I have a 27hp Kohlers (stock 51348)and a 27hp Kawasaki (stock 51394). The Kohler is very hard on oil. The Kawasaki is liquid cooled and easy on oil. I was thinking of running an oversized in my Kohlers. The Kholer filter is larger, while the Kawasaki filter is much smaller, but seems to do better.
Click to expand...
The Kohler OEM filters made by Champion labs are rated 28.5 or 32 microns depending on model. The Wix standard size replacements are rated 19. That seems like an easy choice to me. Kohler makes OEM oil coolers for their engines for a little over $100. I put one on my new 23HP engine and it's incredible how much heat it sheds even on a cool day.
 
quote:
Originally posted by jayno20:
what exactly is the benefit of a larger oil filter?
Click to expand...
Typically (not always - but it's not always necessary) more media ..which means more holding capacity (not a big issue to most). The larger surface area will have a lower PSID under most conditions with all other things being equal. The added bonus is that the oil will be at a lower velocity ..which means that its filtering ability will be higher (stuff that would get pushed through at a given velocity will get snagged at a lower velocity). Pulsing and its effects will be reduced in severity.

You also get a few oz. more oil in your system
dunno.gif
 
Larger filter also theoretically helps cool the oil better than standard filter because the filter acts somewhat like a radiator to allow some cooling of the oil.
 
Anyone know a best price source for Fleetguard filters? Phoenix area, or by mail??
Also who makes the STP filters? They seem to get good rating on this site?
 
quote:
Originally posted by rphart:
Looks like the FL400S would fit OK on the gasket flange, I will check at next oil change. Use Motorcraft filters on my Fords, and especially like the S series with the silicone drainback. Keep the 400S on hand now for V6 Aerostar.

What about clearance between the filter and the muffler? With the Kawasaki OEM filter the muffler is approx 2 and 1/4 inches diagonal measurement away from the end of the filter. With the FL400S the muffler will be approx 1 inch below the end of the filter. Will there be significant heating of the filter/oil from the muffler? And would this heading outweigh the advantages of the larger capacity filter?
Click to expand...
Here you go...
ST numbers...
ST3614,short
ST3600,long
ST16 short and fat
ST8 long and fat.
All have same thread size, bypass pressure (generally) and anti-drain back valves.
 
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