Lets talk water softeners

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volk06

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We have decided its time to start looking into a water softener. Our water is not terribly hard but the scale, dry skin and normal hard water symptoms have us wanting to look into this further. The thing is I know nothing about plumbing. Is this something you should just call the ecowater, rain soft, culligan or kinetico for? Or are those just "Cadillacs" and not necessary? I see home depot, lowes, menards all have 40,000 grain water softeners for around $500. What so special about the others and what makes the store ones so cheap?

I appreciate any advice or help on the topic.
 
It depends on "grain" or really hardness of water if a $500 one will work or you require a $1600 one we got.

We have an assembled version of off the shelf quality parts by installer($1600). Culligan quoted us $2500 for equivalent system in terms of hardness removal etc. The issue with Culligan, Kinetico, and potentially rain soft and eco water is you have to go to specific maker for service and parts.

Have your water tested is step one for hardness if not already. There are entire forums of this kinds of stuff and folks building their own.
 
When my Culligan one taps out, I'm going to call our local regular plumber for repairs or replacement.
I guess ours has worked fine for 12 years now, but the culligan sales guy was an excellent liar and we overpaid by quite a bit once their financing plan trickery was revealed.
 
I have lived in this home for 30 years and have hard water. The area is known for hard water.

I had Culligan. The system they serviced could not handle the job. The "Culligan Man" was making a good living.

I finally called a local business. He installed a new water-softening system at a lower cost than Culligan and was rated for restaurant service. It worked much better. I have since replaced the mechanical-timed system and bed to an on-demand system.

I recommend you call a local service. They will be familiar with your plumbing needs, the hardness of your water compared to the area and when the system needs to be recycled to obtain the soft water you want. It may cost a bit more but I found it lasted longer especially without a service person needing to show up constantly. Less money spent in the long run.
 
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I built my system around a Fleck 7000 SXT valve. You can get a complete system for about $600. Installation is easy if you have done plumbing work before.

If you haven't done plumbing work before, this might not be the best learning project because it includes water connection (the water softener is the first thing on the water supply after the water enters your house) and drainage for the brine (mine uses the same drain as the washing machine discharge).

It's not very complex if you plan the location ahead, watch some videos and practice soldering.
 
Culligan and similar are way overpriced.

Get your water tested by a testing lab, with no skin in the game.

Then figure your water usage and determine how large of a machine you need. Any plumber can install one. Some people have outside faucets plumbed so they are on hard water. To not use up softened water watering the lawn.

The best automatic softeners figure out how much capacity is left and if it will not get you through another day, then they do the recharge. The recharge is normally done at night.

If you are on a salt restricted diet, remember the softened water contains sodium, but not sodium chloride (table salt).
 
Somewhat related but I bought a ZeroWater pitcher for my parents recently. Water tastes much better and only $20 at Walmart and on sale at Target for $17. Includes a pass/fail indicator for water quality. The nicer ones have a digital readout with the amount of dissolved solids in the water. Here's the nicer one that has a spigot in the handle and $35 at WM.

http://www.amazon.com/ZeroWater-ZP-010-1...o+water+pitcher

They also have tumblers with a smaller filter that I will probably get soon.
 
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I've used Sears water softeners for years; they typically last for a dozen years or more in my application.

If your house isn't plumbed for a softener you may want to have this done professionally, but make sure the installer sets it up with simple screw-on water inflow/outflow attachments: this makes it very easy to self-install the softener itself and any replacements.

One other thing to consider. If you have a septic system and well water it's worth wondering where the water softener salt will wind up when the system is flushed. It's easy to go through several hundred pounds of salt per year and it would be unfortunate if it found its way into your drinking water supply.
 
I have a 33yr old RainSoft system. Wayyy overpaid. Got taken advantage of being young and inexperienced. Installation was good, (in garage), but the system was designed for a family of four and there were only two of us in the house. The mechanical clock timer will recycle once a week at a minimum, which is far too often given the low water use.

FF a few decades on. Multiple local RS "distributers" went Tango Uniform. So I started working on it myself. Why pay some dude $100 + $65/hr. after the first hr to do work I can do myself?

Due to RS's lifetime warranty (anything that touches water), I decided to take it all apart, clean, relube, and replace all the seals. Cost me zero $. Then tried to fix a crack in the salt tank. No joy. Turns out RS warranted that as well. Got a new modern one. All because I still had my original receipt! Which was required. Of course, no one else had any record of my purchase, including RS.

I replumbed it using unions and ball valves, so I can remove it from the system and bypass it without cutting any PVC. I can also bypass it when watering from assorted hose spigots around the yard.

Due to my low water usage, and being sold a large unit, I now turn off the timer, set a reminder to myself every 6 weeks to manually 'regenerate' it. Works like a charm, saves salt and no dangerously slippery water.

Look at your monthly water bills (minus sprinklers) to determine how much water you use. Then have your water tested by a reputable lab so you have your own, independent test data. Now you know what size unit you have and how much water will go through it every month.

When you get it plumbed, be sure to use unions and ball-valves to ease maintainence and allow bypassing. If it's all solvent-glued in, you'll need a hacksaw to remove it.

As far as results, it's great! Water heater, dishwasher, clothes washer, ice maker, etc. all last & last. Clothes don't need fabric softener. They are already soft and last longer because there's no dried minerals in the threads. I wash the sled with soft water, then blow dry. It's taken me more than a decade to use a gallon of car wash....

Makes your hair and skin feel very clean. Shampoo & soap last a long time because so little is needed. You have to be careful in the shower & tub & also hand-washing dishes: they get really, really slippery. You'll get used to it over time.

So I'd get one again, but I'd shop around, cast a critical eye towards any salesman and probably assemble my own from quality parts via the web. Lots of info out there on how to roll your own if so inclined.

Beware of paying extra $$$$$ for softwater 24/7....
 
First step is determining how hard your water is. If you are on a municipal source, they can usually tell you without the need to run a test.

Second, whatever unit you get, make sure its an on demand unit. Units that run on set timers generally run way too often and just use a lot of salt. Adds up over the years.

Currently running a 20 year old Sears Kenmore unit with on demand regeneration. It's needed a few very minor repairs - a valve/flap has broken twice, and the meter got stuck once. Run a conditioner through it about once a year. I suspect most people just replace their units when repairs are needed, but the three repairs I've had cost less than $50.

At least for now, parts are easy to get on the Kenmore units (and have been in stock at sears locally when I've needed them). Not been thrilled with sears on other things, but thus had been good.
 
There are 2 types of softener resin, and while there are supposedly higher quality "beads" of each type, they perform a simple task. To exchange sodium ions for calcium or other contaminate.

1) Cation
2) Anion

Each bead has a different function. It's that simple.
 
Originally Posted By: Recalculating
I recommend you call a local service.

Yes, that always seems best. The system has to be tailored to the local water and one's usage pattern, and hopefully not to maximize service calls for the supplier.
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i threw my water softener out early last year and never looked back. its just a money sink with little benefit.
 
Originally Posted By: cptbarkey
i threw my water softener out early last year and never looked back. its just a money sink with little benefit.

I guess you don't really have hard water then? Our water would clog up almost everything in a year or two I think.
 
Agreed. One town I lived in, a small town, even with a water softener, the two plumbers in town were kept busy full time just dealing with hard water issues. Home construction was maybe one house per year, usually zero per year. He'd have to come once every couple months to reopen drains. Drano and the ilk accomplished nothing. Saniflush (or one of the other toilet cleaner companies) had a special product in that town I've never seen anywhere else, either, for hard water stains.
 
On my third one in 35 years. Current one is a Morton and I bought it at Menards for just over $400. It has the identical head and tank as the Sears it replaced. This one does measure the gallons used and then you can set it for the grains of hardness.

I let the salt go down to nothing every couple years and clean the salt tank out. Every year run some Iron Out or CLR through it.

Would not be without one here.
 
Originally Posted By: IndyIan
Originally Posted By: cptbarkey
i threw my water softener out early last year and never looked back. its just a money sink with little benefit.

I guess you don't really have hard water then? Our water would clog up almost everything in a year or two I think.


Agreed or could care less is soap is actually working.

Our $1600 system installed 7 years ago has only cost us in salt. 10 bags/year so $50ish/year
 
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