Japan taking over the motorcycle industry
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Originally Posted By: alarmguy
No, he can't prove it, there are no facts and figures, sure, sooner or later a tensioner will have to be replaced. It's a wearable part but not anywhere near the required maintenance of doing valve checks on a metric.
The valve checks are provable one just needs to look in the service manuals of the bikes. Again a maintainance item that will cost more time and/or money over the life of the bike then replacing a tensioner every 50,75 or 100 k miles.
I'm sure many more bikes have been damaged by burnt valves then tensioner failures, but, not prove able either.
For the most part, valve adjustments on metrics aren't even necessary...I've owned at least a dozen metric bikes over several decades (including a '79 CBX) and have never done a valve adjustment on any of them and I've never had a problem with any of them...
No, he can't prove it, there are no facts and figures, sure, sooner or later a tensioner will have to be replaced. It's a wearable part but not anywhere near the required maintenance of doing valve checks on a metric.
The valve checks are provable one just needs to look in the service manuals of the bikes. Again a maintainance item that will cost more time and/or money over the life of the bike then replacing a tensioner every 50,75 or 100 k miles.
I'm sure many more bikes have been damaged by burnt valves then tensioner failures, but, not prove able either.
For the most part, valve adjustments on metrics aren't even necessary...I've owned at least a dozen metric bikes over several decades (including a '79 CBX) and have never done a valve adjustment on any of them and I've never had a problem with any of them...
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Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: dr2152
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: dr2152
You pick Harley so called facts that are 10-15 years old. (Cam tensioner) I wrote about a bike I own. My CBR would have to be adjusted every year vs the Harley. Those are facts. The new CB1100 is every 8000 miles. So in 46 years Honda has went from 4000 to 8000 miles on valve adjustment on the straight four. I love the new CB1100. But it is high maintenance. No one can dispute your Harley facts because they are not real.
Sorry, but you're wrong again. These problems exist even with the newer Harleys.
Got something to prove this? It was 1999 to 2006. My 04 was fine at 60k. They was still good last year when the new owner checked them.
Sure, just keep riding your Harley without doing anything to the chain tensioner and when the engine grenades, you'll know what we're talking about...
Translation: No I made it up.
Originally Posted By: dr2152
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: dr2152
You pick Harley so called facts that are 10-15 years old. (Cam tensioner) I wrote about a bike I own. My CBR would have to be adjusted every year vs the Harley. Those are facts. The new CB1100 is every 8000 miles. So in 46 years Honda has went from 4000 to 8000 miles on valve adjustment on the straight four. I love the new CB1100. But it is high maintenance. No one can dispute your Harley facts because they are not real.
Sorry, but you're wrong again. These problems exist even with the newer Harleys.
Got something to prove this? It was 1999 to 2006. My 04 was fine at 60k. They was still good last year when the new owner checked them.
Sure, just keep riding your Harley without doing anything to the chain tensioner and when the engine grenades, you'll know what we're talking about...
Translation: No I made it up.
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: alarmguy
No, he can't prove it, there are no facts and figures, sure, sooner or later a tensioner will have to be replaced. It's a wearable part but not anywhere near the required maintenance of doing valve checks on a metric.
The valve checks are provable one just needs to look in the service manuals of the bikes. Again a maintainance item that will cost more time and/or money over the life of the bike then replacing a tensioner every 50,75 or 100 k miles.
I'm sure many more bikes have been damaged by burnt valves then tensioner failures, but, not prove able either.
For the most part, valve adjustments on metrics aren't even necessary...I've owned at least a dozen metric bikes over several decades (including a '79 CBX) and have never done a valve adjustment on any of them and I've never had a problem with any of them...
I bet people line up to buy your bikes once they find out you don't believe in doing the maintenance. I replaced 4 shims last fall on the CBX. You would have just ridden until a valve burnt?
Originally Posted By: alarmguy
No, he can't prove it, there are no facts and figures, sure, sooner or later a tensioner will have to be replaced. It's a wearable part but not anywhere near the required maintenance of doing valve checks on a metric.
The valve checks are provable one just needs to look in the service manuals of the bikes. Again a maintainance item that will cost more time and/or money over the life of the bike then replacing a tensioner every 50,75 or 100 k miles.
I'm sure many more bikes have been damaged by burnt valves then tensioner failures, but, not prove able either.
For the most part, valve adjustments on metrics aren't even necessary...I've owned at least a dozen metric bikes over several decades (including a '79 CBX) and have never done a valve adjustment on any of them and I've never had a problem with any of them...
I bet people line up to buy your bikes once they find out you don't believe in doing the maintenance. I replaced 4 shims last fall on the CBX. You would have just ridden until a valve burnt?
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Originally Posted By: dr2152
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: alarmguy
No, he can't prove it, there are no facts and figures, sure, sooner or later a tensioner will have to be replaced. It's a wearable part but not anywhere near the required maintenance of doing valve checks on a metric.
The valve checks are provable one just needs to look in the service manuals of the bikes. Again a maintainance item that will cost more time and/or money over the life of the bike then replacing a tensioner every 50,75 or 100 k miles.
I'm sure many more bikes have been damaged by burnt valves then tensioner failures, but, not prove able either.
For the most part, valve adjustments on metrics aren't even necessary...I've owned at least a dozen metric bikes over several decades (including a '79 CBX) and have never done a valve adjustment on any of them and I've never had a problem with any of them...
I bet people line up to buy your bikes once they find out you don't believe in doing the maintenance. I replaced 4 shims last fall on the CBX. You would have just ridden until a valve burnt?
Actually, I can't say I'd be surprised if he was fine ...many bikes hold valve clearance for vastly longer than the check interval. A 650 Burgman needing no adjustment at 35-40,000 miles is normal. In 15,000 miles, my wife's old Suzuki never needed adjustment.
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: alarmguy
No, he can't prove it, there are no facts and figures, sure, sooner or later a tensioner will have to be replaced. It's a wearable part but not anywhere near the required maintenance of doing valve checks on a metric.
The valve checks are provable one just needs to look in the service manuals of the bikes. Again a maintainance item that will cost more time and/or money over the life of the bike then replacing a tensioner every 50,75 or 100 k miles.
I'm sure many more bikes have been damaged by burnt valves then tensioner failures, but, not prove able either.
For the most part, valve adjustments on metrics aren't even necessary...I've owned at least a dozen metric bikes over several decades (including a '79 CBX) and have never done a valve adjustment on any of them and I've never had a problem with any of them...
I bet people line up to buy your bikes once they find out you don't believe in doing the maintenance. I replaced 4 shims last fall on the CBX. You would have just ridden until a valve burnt?
Actually, I can't say I'd be surprised if he was fine ...many bikes hold valve clearance for vastly longer than the check interval. A 650 Burgman needing no adjustment at 35-40,000 miles is normal. In 15,000 miles, my wife's old Suzuki never needed adjustment.
Originally Posted By: dr2152
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: alarmguy
No, he can't prove it, there are no facts and figures, sure, sooner or later a tensioner will have to be replaced. It's a wearable part but not anywhere near the required maintenance of doing valve checks on a metric.
The valve checks are provable one just needs to look in the service manuals of the bikes. Again a maintainance item that will cost more time and/or money over the life of the bike then replacing a tensioner every 50,75 or 100 k miles.
I'm sure many more bikes have been damaged by burnt valves then tensioner failures, but, not prove able either.
For the most part, valve adjustments on metrics aren't even necessary...I've owned at least a dozen metric bikes over several decades (including a '79 CBX) and have never done a valve adjustment on any of them and I've never had a problem with any of them...
I bet people line up to buy your bikes once they find out you don't believe in doing the maintenance. I replaced 4 shims last fall on the CBX. You would have just ridden until a valve burnt?
I didn't say they were never checked, I said I never had to adjust them, big difference...
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: alarmguy
No, he can't prove it, there are no facts and figures, sure, sooner or later a tensioner will have to be replaced. It's a wearable part but not anywhere near the required maintenance of doing valve checks on a metric.
The valve checks are provable one just needs to look in the service manuals of the bikes. Again a maintainance item that will cost more time and/or money over the life of the bike then replacing a tensioner every 50,75 or 100 k miles.
I'm sure many more bikes have been damaged by burnt valves then tensioner failures, but, not prove able either.
For the most part, valve adjustments on metrics aren't even necessary...I've owned at least a dozen metric bikes over several decades (including a '79 CBX) and have never done a valve adjustment on any of them and I've never had a problem with any of them...
I bet people line up to buy your bikes once they find out you don't believe in doing the maintenance. I replaced 4 shims last fall on the CBX. You would have just ridden until a valve burnt?
I didn't say they were never checked, I said I never had to adjust them, big difference...
Originally Posted By: alarmguy
Originally Posted By: 02SE
Originally Posted By: dr2152
Originally Posted By: 02SE
Originally Posted By: dr2152
02SE said:
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: alarmguy
No, he can't prove it, there are no facts and figures, sure, sooner or later a tensioner will have to be replaced. It's a wearable part but not anywhere near the required maintenance of doing valve checks on a metric.
The valve checks are provable one just needs to look in the service manuals of the bikes. Again a maintainance item that will cost more time and/or money over the life of the bike then replacing a tensioner every 50,75 or 100 k miles.
I'm sure many more bikes have been damaged by burnt valves then tensioner failures, but, not prove able either.
For the most part, valve adjustments on metrics aren't even necessary...I've owned at least a dozen metric bikes over several decades (including a '79 CBX) and have never done a valve adjustment on any of them and I've never had a problem with any of them...
EXACTLY, you choose to not do required maintainance. That's fine, some others choose not to and have problems, not to,mention if under warranty. Hey you know what?. Tens of thousands of Harley's never had a engine blow up because of a chain tensioner failure.
Originally Posted By: alarmguy
No, he can't prove it, there are no facts and figures, sure, sooner or later a tensioner will have to be replaced. It's a wearable part but not anywhere near the required maintenance of doing valve checks on a metric.
The valve checks are provable one just needs to look in the service manuals of the bikes. Again a maintainance item that will cost more time and/or money over the life of the bike then replacing a tensioner every 50,75 or 100 k miles.
I'm sure many more bikes have been damaged by burnt valves then tensioner failures, but, not prove able either.
For the most part, valve adjustments on metrics aren't even necessary...I've owned at least a dozen metric bikes over several decades (including a '79 CBX) and have never done a valve adjustment on any of them and I've never had a problem with any of them...
EXACTLY, you choose to not do required maintainance. That's fine, some others choose not to and have problems, not to,mention if under warranty. Hey you know what?. Tens of thousands of Harley's never had a engine blow up because of a chain tensioner failure.
My 07 Suzuki c50 definitely needed an adjustment at 4000 miles required check. Exhaust was real tight.
Again, I don't disagree with you that new models have been greatly extended but I think a lot still call for that 600 mile check, then from there many call for 8000 to 16000. Still some less.
I also agree many get away with not doing it, I and many people in this forum on oils
) do try to what is best for the bike, so it bothers me if I am ignoring something like a valve check and its a PITA to do but I did them.
Again, I don't disagree with you that new models have been greatly extended but I think a lot still call for that 600 mile check, then from there many call for 8000 to 16000. Still some less.
I also agree many get away with not doing it, I and many people in this forum on oils
) do try to what is best for the bike, so it bothers me if I am ignoring something like a valve check and its a PITA to do but I did them.Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: dr2152
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: dr2152
You pick Harley so called facts that are 10-15 years old. (Cam tensioner) I wrote about a bike I own. My CBR would have to be adjusted every year vs the Harley. Those are facts. The new CB1100 is every 8000 miles. So in 46 years Honda has went from 4000 to 8000 miles on valve adjustment on the straight four. I love the new CB1100. But it is high maintenance. No one can dispute your Harley facts because they are not real.
Sorry, but you're wrong again. These problems exist even with the newer Harleys.
Got something to prove this? It was 1999 to 2006. My 04 was fine at 60k. They was still good last year when the new owner checked them.
Sure, just keep riding your Harley without doing anything to the chain tensioner and when the engine grenades, you'll know what we're talking about...
Ok, I'll let you know when my tensioner fails and my engine blows up on my modern 14 road king with a hydraulic tensioner. It would be nice to know what percentage of bikes have this issue in relation to bikes that need valve checks and don't get them and have valves burn up.
Gosh these conversations are unreal....
Originally Posted By: dr2152
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: dr2152
You pick Harley so called facts that are 10-15 years old. (Cam tensioner) I wrote about a bike I own. My CBR would have to be adjusted every year vs the Harley. Those are facts. The new CB1100 is every 8000 miles. So in 46 years Honda has went from 4000 to 8000 miles on valve adjustment on the straight four. I love the new CB1100. But it is high maintenance. No one can dispute your Harley facts because they are not real.
Sorry, but you're wrong again. These problems exist even with the newer Harleys.
Got something to prove this? It was 1999 to 2006. My 04 was fine at 60k. They was still good last year when the new owner checked them.
Sure, just keep riding your Harley without doing anything to the chain tensioner and when the engine grenades, you'll know what we're talking about...
Ok, I'll let you know when my tensioner fails and my engine blows up on my modern 14 road king with a hydraulic tensioner. It would be nice to know what percentage of bikes have this issue in relation to bikes that need valve checks and don't get them and have valves burn up.
Gosh these conversations are unreal....
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Originally Posted By: alarmguy
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: alarmguy
No, he can't prove it, there are no facts and figures, sure, sooner or later a tensioner will have to be replaced. It's a wearable part but not anywhere near the required maintenance of doing valve checks on a metric.
The valve checks are provable one just needs to look in the service manuals of the bikes. Again a maintainance item that will cost more time and/or money over the life of the bike then replacing a tensioner every 50,75 or 100 k miles.
I'm sure many more bikes have been damaged by burnt valves then tensioner failures, but, not prove able either.
For the most part, valve adjustments on metrics aren't even necessary...I've owned at least a dozen metric bikes over several decades (including a '79 CBX) and have never done a valve adjustment on any of them and I've never had a problem with any of them...
EXACTLY, you choose to not do required maintainance. That's fine, some others choose not to and have problems, not to,mention if under warranty. Hey you know what?. Tens of thousands of Harley's never had a engine blow up because of a chain tensioner failure.
Apparently you didn't read my last post....
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: alarmguy
No, he can't prove it, there are no facts and figures, sure, sooner or later a tensioner will have to be replaced. It's a wearable part but not anywhere near the required maintenance of doing valve checks on a metric.
The valve checks are provable one just needs to look in the service manuals of the bikes. Again a maintainance item that will cost more time and/or money over the life of the bike then replacing a tensioner every 50,75 or 100 k miles.
I'm sure many more bikes have been damaged by burnt valves then tensioner failures, but, not prove able either.
For the most part, valve adjustments on metrics aren't even necessary...I've owned at least a dozen metric bikes over several decades (including a '79 CBX) and have never done a valve adjustment on any of them and I've never had a problem with any of them...
EXACTLY, you choose to not do required maintainance. That's fine, some others choose not to and have problems, not to,mention if under warranty. Hey you know what?. Tens of thousands of Harley's never had a engine blow up because of a chain tensioner failure.
Apparently you didn't read my last post....
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Originally Posted By: alarmguy
Ok, I'll let you know when my tensioner fails and my engine blows up on my modern 14 road king with a hydraulic tensioner. It would be nice to know what percentage of bikes have this issue in relation to bikes that need valve checks and don't get them and have valves burn up.
Gosh these conversations are unreal....
Next oil change: remove the cam cover and check the cam chain shoes. If the outer (visible) one is more than 1/4 through, they both need to be replaced! (The inner shoe, not visible, wears faster.) Also, when you do a UOA, look carefully for signs of particles of nylon in the oil. Note that this failure is NOT covered by the warranty!
There are various band-aids for the problem, but no real fix short of replacing the whole thing with cam gears...and even THAT isn't a sure fix, due to the engine layout.
Ok, I'll let you know when my tensioner fails and my engine blows up on my modern 14 road king with a hydraulic tensioner. It would be nice to know what percentage of bikes have this issue in relation to bikes that need valve checks and don't get them and have valves burn up.
Gosh these conversations are unreal....
Next oil change: remove the cam cover and check the cam chain shoes. If the outer (visible) one is more than 1/4 through, they both need to be replaced! (The inner shoe, not visible, wears faster.) Also, when you do a UOA, look carefully for signs of particles of nylon in the oil. Note that this failure is NOT covered by the warranty!
There are various band-aids for the problem, but no real fix short of replacing the whole thing with cam gears...and even THAT isn't a sure fix, due to the engine layout.
Originally Posted By: Jarlaxle
Originally Posted By: alarmguy
Ok, I'll let you know when my tensioner fails and my engine blows up on my modern 14 road king with a hydraulic tensioner. It would be nice to know what percentage of bikes have this issue in relation to bikes that need valve checks and don't get them and have valves burn up.
Gosh these conversations are unreal....
Next oil change: remove the cam cover and check the cam chain shoes. If the outer (visible) one is more than 1/4 through, they both need to be replaced! (The inner shoe, not visible, wears faster.) Also, when you do a UOA, look carefully for signs of particles of nylon in the oil. Note that this failure is NOT covered by the warranty!
There are various band-aids for the problem, but no real fix short of replacing the whole thing with cam gears...and even THAT isn't a sure fix, due to the engine layout.
The inner shoe can be checked. You just need a mirror. A friend's 05 had wear on the out side but the inside was like new. It had 65k when we changed them. Checked a 09 with 90k and they were good. My 04 looked like new at 60k. It had 70k the last time I talked to the new owner. It was the chain that caused the problem of wear on the 99-06. Gears work great as long as you shim them correctly.
Originally Posted By: alarmguy
Ok, I'll let you know when my tensioner fails and my engine blows up on my modern 14 road king with a hydraulic tensioner. It would be nice to know what percentage of bikes have this issue in relation to bikes that need valve checks and don't get them and have valves burn up.
Gosh these conversations are unreal....
Next oil change: remove the cam cover and check the cam chain shoes. If the outer (visible) one is more than 1/4 through, they both need to be replaced! (The inner shoe, not visible, wears faster.) Also, when you do a UOA, look carefully for signs of particles of nylon in the oil. Note that this failure is NOT covered by the warranty!
There are various band-aids for the problem, but no real fix short of replacing the whole thing with cam gears...and even THAT isn't a sure fix, due to the engine layout.
The inner shoe can be checked. You just need a mirror. A friend's 05 had wear on the out side but the inside was like new. It had 65k when we changed them. Checked a 09 with 90k and they were good. My 04 looked like new at 60k. It had 70k the last time I talked to the new owner. It was the chain that caused the problem of wear on the 99-06. Gears work great as long as you shim them correctly.
maybe HD use graphene strenghtened nylon hydraulic tensioner!nha
the guy said 20 000 miles so i suspect it is close to that .if you own a HD and the last hydraulic tensioner check was 20k might want to check it or make it check , but it would be nice to hear it here from HD engineer making the bike whats what or they should debunk those on YouTube
the guy said 20 000 miles so i suspect it is close to that .if you own a HD and the last hydraulic tensioner check was 20k might want to check it or make it check , but it would be nice to hear it here from HD engineer making the bike whats what or they should debunk those on YouTube
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GnqazdpCpJo
ton of video on YouTube about these various issue!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LrsPmx
408 degree! yep it isnt hot at all !hahahahaha
so sorry but i maintain what i said in my previous post! dont get a HD if you drive more then 1000 mile a year
ton of video on YouTube about these various issue!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LrsPmx
408 degree! yep it isnt hot at all !hahahahaha
so sorry but i maintain what i said in my previous post! dont get a HD if you drive more then 1000 mile a year
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lKqlVydNMpY
here is the partial consumer report
key word ,can help keep repair cost down!CAN
here is the partial consumer report
key word ,can help keep repair cost down!CAN
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Have you looked up all the issues with your make bike on utube?
I will not be doing a tensioner inspection for at least 5 more years or 50 to 70,000 miles, not required by HD. If I still own the bike that is and if I do, it will be out of curiosity. Reports over blown or HD would recommend and inspection.
However being I am a maintenance kind of person, when I do get to that 50 to 70,000 miles I will spend the hour it takes to take a look at them and change the primary oil while I am at it.
Its a heck of A LOT easier to take a look at the tensioners then to do ANY valve check, valve checks required, tensioner not required but so easy to do, if you get caught up in forum [censored] and want to, its easy to do.
Me? Not concerned in the slightest and I REALLY mean not concerned in the slightest, only ones who seem to be are the ones who want to bash Harley.
and remarks about "blowing up the engine" another laughable comment when the leading consumer magazine in the United States of America, states major engine failures amount ALL manufacturers of motorcycles seem equally low. But some people, with their "blinders" on only know one thing, trash something they dont own. More so the most popular motorcycle company in the United States.
Make up ANY and ALL excuses why they are successful and discredit them and the reasons by saying the people who own them are brainwashed, I say, ignorant and if not ignorant, jealous..
Ps, I much rather have the chain then gears.
I will not be doing a tensioner inspection for at least 5 more years or 50 to 70,000 miles, not required by HD. If I still own the bike that is and if I do, it will be out of curiosity. Reports over blown or HD would recommend and inspection.
However being I am a maintenance kind of person, when I do get to that 50 to 70,000 miles I will spend the hour it takes to take a look at them and change the primary oil while I am at it.
Its a heck of A LOT easier to take a look at the tensioners then to do ANY valve check, valve checks required, tensioner not required but so easy to do, if you get caught up in forum [censored] and want to, its easy to do.
Me? Not concerned in the slightest and I REALLY mean not concerned in the slightest, only ones who seem to be are the ones who want to bash Harley.
and remarks about "blowing up the engine" another laughable comment when the leading consumer magazine in the United States of America, states major engine failures amount ALL manufacturers of motorcycles seem equally low. But some people, with their "blinders" on only know one thing, trash something they dont own. More so the most popular motorcycle company in the United States.
Make up ANY and ALL excuses why they are successful and discredit them and the reasons by saying the people who own them are brainwashed, I say, ignorant and if not ignorant, jealous..
Ps, I much rather have the chain then gears.
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