JHZR2
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They took out a loan including wrapping a prior loan on property they no longer own, to continue paying for 7 years. Sounds like a financial product, no?
They owe a loan on a car they no longer own…. In a new loan…
I helped my daughter with a bad vehicle situation
- Thread starter grampi
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They owe a loan on a car they no longer own…. In a new loan…
Yeah, but that's separate from the purchase. Usually you can't rewind a purchase. Maybe they can back out of the financial product but they'd still be on the hook for the purchase so you'd need to have alternative financing available.
This is primarily a financial discussion: was it a good idea to get a seven year loan on a seven year old used car that’s replacing a used car? No. It was not.
However, Grampi is muddying the waters with this topic: parental financial help.
To be very open about it…. Yes. We help our kids financially. There are six of them. We try and keep it fair across the whole gang, but fair doesn’t mean exactly the same cash or equivalent.
Our kids range in age from 33 (married, with 3 kids of their own) to 21 (senior in college). Their places in life, and so, needs, are different.
We help because we choose to, not because it’s a financial imperative or because they’re entitled. They have all, each and every one, balked at financial help* when it’s been offered.
The real help, however, is in helping them with “adulting” - handling the admin of buying houses, or cars, or getting a bank account, or credit card, or loan. Helping them understand the framework; financial, legal, personal, in which those decisions take place and helping (not directing, but guiding) them towards good decisions.
That is real parental help.
*We covered college, and each of them has (or soon will have) graduated college with zero debt. That’s real financial help.
This thread covers car purchasing, financial decisions, and parental help.
To separate them out:
1. Help is OK
2. Seven year loan on a used car is not.
3. Trading a car with one set of issues for a car with the potential for similar issues is questionable.
Burdening them with seven years of payments to accomplish 3 (above) is where the majority of respondents are having a problem.
However, Grampi is muddying the waters with this topic: parental financial help.
To be very open about it…. Yes. We help our kids financially. There are six of them. We try and keep it fair across the whole gang, but fair doesn’t mean exactly the same cash or equivalent.
Our kids range in age from 33 (married, with 3 kids of their own) to 21 (senior in college). Their places in life, and so, needs, are different.
We help because we choose to, not because it’s a financial imperative or because they’re entitled. They have all, each and every one, balked at financial help* when it’s been offered.
The real help, however, is in helping them with “adulting” - handling the admin of buying houses, or cars, or getting a bank account, or credit card, or loan. Helping them understand the framework; financial, legal, personal, in which those decisions take place and helping (not directing, but guiding) them towards good decisions.
That is real parental help.
*We covered college, and each of them has (or soon will have) graduated college with zero debt. That’s real financial help.
This thread covers car purchasing, financial decisions, and parental help.
To separate them out:
1. Help is OK
2. Seven year loan on a used car is not.
3. Trading a car with one set of issues for a car with the potential for similar issues is questionable.
Burdening them with seven years of payments to accomplish 3 (above) is where the majority of respondents are having a problem.
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There was no delight in this situation. Just trying to make the best of a bad situation. I believe I already explained the situation. The van was falling apart at an alarming rate and IMO was not worth spending any more money on. I already have a plan in place to help her make sure the maintenance required is being done when it's due (this includes me doing a lot of the maintenance). This will go a long ways towards keeping the vehicle in good running condition for years to come. My daughter is like me in that we both like to keep vehicles long after they're paid off. It's the best way to get our money's worth out of them...I've used this approach my Corolla and it's almost 20 years old now and still going strong...
Since we've exhausted all the 'facts' lets see a picture of them so we can ridicule their appearance. (REALLY just kidding)
Seriously though, we've read threads like this before. The cast of characters (no disrespect intended) is ALWAYS shallowly described, i.e. poor kids with a family and a bad vehicle, a helping relative and another used car payment schedule.
This story is, however, more than a tad worse than average.
My "kinda red" flag was the OP mentioning air and cabin air filters. I conclude everyone involved is not mechanically inclined (again, no insult intended). That means maintenance is doubly important....and we can't ask HOW they drive. We all know there are people who hasten vehicles' deaths by the way they pound down the road. I know that's not the subject here but.....
a. I'm totally in the "What's done is done ...so what do you do now?", camp. The 3 day sale-cancelation option probably doesn't exist.
b. Three cheers for the "financial literacy" post. It's absolutely vital and so overlooked....as is driving gently.
c. Purchase-Operation-Maintenance. People ignore the maintenance.....makes things even more expensive.
The allure of a "new car" is immeasurable. Like a collapsed star it has immense gravity which pulls everything in.
This wouldn't be the first vehicle to break a family.
Again, no insult intended.
....and a small note about Hondas (and some other cars too?) is that many people WORSHIP them. With our abbreviated knowledge of this situation we can't even know if your daughter simply fell for "a shiny one".
And I disagree with your absolution of the van's condition having nothing to do with neglect.
Seriously though, we've read threads like this before. The cast of characters (no disrespect intended) is ALWAYS shallowly described, i.e. poor kids with a family and a bad vehicle, a helping relative and another used car payment schedule.
This story is, however, more than a tad worse than average.
My "kinda red" flag was the OP mentioning air and cabin air filters. I conclude everyone involved is not mechanically inclined (again, no insult intended). That means maintenance is doubly important....and we can't ask HOW they drive. We all know there are people who hasten vehicles' deaths by the way they pound down the road. I know that's not the subject here but.....
a. I'm totally in the "What's done is done ...so what do you do now?", camp. The 3 day sale-cancelation option probably doesn't exist.
b. Three cheers for the "financial literacy" post. It's absolutely vital and so overlooked....as is driving gently.
c. Purchase-Operation-Maintenance. People ignore the maintenance.....makes things even more expensive.
The allure of a "new car" is immeasurable. Like a collapsed star it has immense gravity which pulls everything in.
This wouldn't be the first vehicle to break a family.
Again, no insult intended.
....and a small note about Hondas (and some other cars too?) is that many people WORSHIP them. With our abbreviated knowledge of this situation we can't even know if your daughter simply fell for "a shiny one".
And I disagree with your absolution of the van's condition having nothing to do with neglect.
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That's your opinion, and I think if you had seen how this van was falling apart, you'd have a different one. There comes a time in a vehicle's life when it's no longer worth fixing anymore. This van was at that point. It's a shame it didn't last longer, but it didn't. It was time to get rid of it...
I didn't say the problems had NOTHING to do with neglect. I'm saying the lion's share of the problems were not due to neglect...and they weren't...
Were my kids in a similar position - I would’ve looked at new.
Honestly. Anything that depreciates having seven years of payments doesn’t sit well with me, but most cars will last through that long without major repair costs.
Then we figure out (and this is the important part) what they can afford.
Not what they want.
What they need.
And how much it costs.
I would’ve helped, too. Absolutely. That’s what Dads do!
But I would’ve guided a totally different set of solutions than the one in this thread.
Honestly. Anything that depreciates having seven years of payments doesn’t sit well with me, but most cars will last through that long without major repair costs.
Then we figure out (and this is the important part) what they can afford.
Not what they want.
What they need.
And how much it costs.
I would’ve helped, too. Absolutely. That’s what Dads do!
But I would’ve guided a totally different set of solutions than the one in this thread.
I didn't say the problems had NOTHING to do with neglect. I'm saying the lion's share of the problems were not due to neglect...
A 7 year loan was required to get the payment low enough for them to handle. There were no other options. I fail to see how a vehicle with half the miles has the same potential for requiring repairs as the higher mileage vehicle. Logic dictates the vehicle with lower miles will require fewer repairs until it reaches a higher mileage, and that can be pushed out even further with timely scheduled maintenance. You seem to be saying the mileage makes no difference in potential required repairs, which makes no sense...every vehicle has a potential for requiring repairs regardless of make, age, or mileage, but I'd bet on a lower mileage vehicle requiring fewer repairs every time...anyone using logic would do the same...
Anyone using logic would not have a seven year loan, and be upside down on a USED CAR!
And a gas guzzler at that.
This decision was emotional. Not logical.
I understand how you felt. I don’t understand the decision.
And a gas guzzler at that.
This decision was emotional. Not logical.
I understand how you felt. I don’t understand the decision.
This is from your original post. This is why people are saying that it's not Honda's fault because of neglect. You said yourself that "a lot of the problems with this van stem from neglect", this would suggest that it is mostly their fault. Now you're saying that the lions share of the problems is not their fault. Here is where the confusion sets in. If you post on a public forum, people will give their opinion based on information provided.
You did say "falling apart", I will admit that, but you only mentioned the doors specifically. What else was falling apart out of curiosity?
Anyway, as I said before, they own a Honda Passport now, hopefully they can find a way to save and learn to take better care of their vehicle as well as their finances. It's not the end of the world, all of this shall pass,...it may pass like a kidney stone, but it'll pass.
I hope for the best for them.
Here would have been another option. Do the timing belt. Continue to use the doors manually, save for a brake job. Ask if the TSB is covered or if you had to pay for it.
I learned to do brakes when i had a car and not much money, and the was before youtube. A hayes/chilton book is not much.
You traded a van that had a known history for a vehicle with less miles but unknown care, i.e. how did they drive it? Hard , easy ?
I learned to do brakes when i had a car and not much money, and the was before youtube. A hayes/chilton book is not much.
You traded a van that had a known history for a vehicle with less miles but unknown care, i.e. how did they drive it? Hard , easy ?
You failed them. From failure, we learn. Next time there is opportunity to do better. We have all been there, done that........learning from mistakes. Move forward and manage the challenges "better".
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Like I said, this was the best option of two bad options. Putting any more money into the van would've been a far worse decision...and you exaggerate everything, the Pilot is hardly a gas guzzler compared to the Odyssey, MPG's are slightly less overall...
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Sorry, but throwing more and more money at a sinking ship is a stupid idea...
I don't see it that way. I put them in a more reliable vehicle. Like I said, you can't put a price on that...throwing more money at the van would've been a failure...
Maybe this will make things less confusing. Some of the issues were due to owner neglect. Most were not. In either case, the van had too many problems to continue spending money on it...
Two separate instances - 1) Car sale and 2) loan. Unless it's 100% dealer-financed, one has nothing to do with the other.
Here's the part nobody gets, what were the issues that were not due to owner neglect or lack of maintenance? You only mentioned one so far, the doors and some TSB. There's always lots of TSBs out there, many of them only apply to a small group of cars and there are actually very few that apply to every single car made. When there's something massive on that scale, it's usually a recall or an extended warranty. Just because there's a TSB, it's not a good reason to dump a car. The TSB might only affect 1 in 100 or 1 in 10 or some other range so it's possible that it would never apply.
I'm not sure I believe that. We had four kids in our family growing up. We always had a car and it was usually 20 years old or older and we always made it work.
My ex-wife and I had a two door Chevy Beretta with our two kids and then upgraded to a four door Grand Prix which she still had when we divorced six years later.
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