I got my pair of Filter Magnets installed today.

[Carlostrece]

Well it does infer but doesn’t prove it

If A = B and B = C then A = C

 

[Carlostrece]

I wonder if filter magnets on this Pentius filter with the center tube holes not punched out completely will keep "holes" that might become dislodged inside the filter. How powerful are these magnets?

Impressively powerful with ½ inch distance, but maybe not powerful enough at the distance from wall of can to center tube to keep dislodged holes in the center tube. I suggest buying a better filter. Last I heard, Pentius are good, but I haven't been staying up to date.

On the "bright" side, the magnets will likely catch all the metal debris after those errant loose holes floating around have damaged your engine.

 

[Pablo]

If A = B and B = C then A = C

Not equivalent

I’m not saying it doesn’t prevent wear for the 100th time. It probably does. So probable at what confidence?

 

[ZeeOSix]

I wonder if filter magnets on this Pentius filter with the center tube holes not punched out completely will keep "holes" that might become dislodged inside the filter. How powerful are these magnets?

I'd say no. If one of those hole slugs came loose the oil flow is going to push it downstream.

 

[ZeeOSix]

On the "bright" side, the magnets will likely catch all the metal debris after those errant loose holes floating around have damaged your engine.

Those slugs would be too big to make it back to the sump. No flow path in the oiling system stays large enough throughout a flow path than one of those slugs to pass it to the sump.

 

[Glenda W.]

Is there an advantage to a magnet at the filter vs oil pan?

 

[ZeeOSix]

Well it does infer but doesn’t prove it

If a magnet is catching and retaining ferrous debris that the filter can't, then it is helping reduce engine wear. Then the "but how much?" mantra will come in (same mantra used in discussions about filter efficiency). So one can generally say that they do help reduce engine wear just on the simple fact that the oil has less particles below 20u in it.

 

[Pablo]

If a magnet is catching and retaining ferrous debris that the filter can't, then it is helping reduce engine wear. Then the "but how much?" mantra will come in (same mantra used in discussions about filter efficiency). So one can generally say that they do help reduce engine wear just on the simple fact that the oil has less particles below 20u in it.

All but proven

 

[UncleDave]

Is there an advantage to a magnet at the filter vs oil pan?

Catch rate is directly proportional to proximity and surface area.

The filter magnet beats the pan magnet in both of these areas handily.

 

[ZeeOSix]

All but proven

Does seeing the arc across the horizon of the ocean or never falling off the edge when sailing prove the Earth isn't flat? Does for most. How could wear not be reduced with cleaner oil and all other factors held constant. Still haven't seen one engine wear study that says cleaner oil doesn't reduce wear.

 

[Pablo]

Does seeing the arc across the horizon of the ocean or never falling off the edge when sailing prove the Earth isn't flat? Does for most.

Don’t start. That’s stupid and you know it. Maybe you are just kidding??

Not sure why you have to be that way. It’s not intelligent. Do you claim to have taken statistics classes or at least scientific analysis type classes?

Again and again I don’t think the inference is wrong or weak - it seems like a likely outcome. Proving it with data would be great.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Don’t start. That’s stupid and you know it. Maybe you are just kidding??

Not sure why you have to be that way. It’s not intelligent. Do you claim to have taken statistics classes or at least scientific analysis type classes?

It's called sarcasm (this dude usually means sarcasm ---> or ) ... you use it all the time around here. Loosen the undies. But seriously, why wouldn't it reduce wear if the oil is kept cleaner? What physics would be involved where cleaner oil of abrasive debris didn't reduce wear between moving parts? - all other factors held constant of course. I'm still waiting for that scientific proof or wear study. Nobody needs much more than basic science or knowledge of Tribology to realize what causes wear between moving parts. And BTW I've had plenty of science classes.

Again and again I don’t think the inference is wrong or weak - it seems like a likely outcome. Proving it with data would be great.

Maybe someone has done a study ... everyone has a keyboard and fingers. It's been mentioned in this thread that magnets can lower the oil cleanliness by an ISO code or two. Magnets are used in all kinds of industry to keep oil cleaner. What actually points in the direction that they do nothing? On the flip side, where's the poof they do nothing to reduce wear?

 

[ZeeOSix]

Some basic info on magnets used in filtration.

https://www.filtsep.com/content/features/magnetic-filtration-are-you-using-it

 

[CarlB]

@Pablo answered this well in posts 126, 128, @ZeeOSix in 130, and prior posts. Others also answered it in prior posts before that. It's already been answered a dozen times. This is not complicated.

CarlB, you refuse to listen or acknowledge what they said. I don't know if you really don't understand what they said, or if (more likely) being argumentative is your game. I think you like seeing how much you can put these guys through.

I'll restate the obvious again. Even if you won't listen or see the obvious, this might be a helpful summation to someone else.

Others said motor oil filters don't catch all ferrous particles below 20 microns. I think that's being overly optimistic about filters. The best oil filters that I have access to (NAPA Gold & Microgard Select) are rated 23-25 microns @ 99%.

Strong, focused (in one direction), high heat tolerant, neodynium magnets (such as Filtermag) can catch all ferrous particles 2 microns and larger. So Filtermag is capturing 2-22 micron ferrous particles that my oil filter doesn't catch.

That ^ is a fact, not an opinion. That fact is the answer to your question of "Do magnets catch metal particles that the oil filter can't?" Yes, obviously. In my case, Filtermag catches the 2-22 micron ferrous particles that my oil filter doesn't catch. That answers your question for the umpteenth time.

I think removing 2-22 micron ferrous particles is a good thing that probably reduces engine wear. That's my opinion. It might also be a fact if there's evidence that proves it reduces engine wear. I'm not sure if reducing engine wear is a proven fact, or just an opinion.

You can credibly question if magnets reduce engine wear enough to justify the cost of the magnets. I think magnets reduce wear to some extent, but I haven't seen conclusive evidence of how much. I think my pair/set of Filtermag was money well spent, but that's just my opinion.

What you cannot credibly question is if magnets reduce ferrous particles that the oil filter could not catch on it's own. Filtermag catches all ferrous particles 2 microns and larger. My filter does not catch all particles smaller than 23. You don't have to be a genius to see that means the magnet is catching the 2-22 micron particles that my filter doesn't catch.

I wish we could just smash together adjacent observations to conclude a result.

 

[CarlB]

Just like anything in the world, if you don't think it has any benefits, or even has negatives for whatever reason(s), then don't use it or find something else that achieves some wanted goal. Most people don't always need some smoking gun proof to decide to use or do something. In the case of magnets taking particles out of the oil that an oil filter can't, people can see evidence that a magnet does that with their eyes. That's enough for a lot of people. If people want to know exactly "how much of a difference" does it really make, then guess they need to do some deeper looking (and more self research) for a better answer or just decide it's not for them.

Oh, I absolutely agree people believe in things. I'm just surprised that a results oriented forum seems to dislike my own desire to see some solid proof it captures what the filter can't and to what degree.

 

[JohnnyJohnson]

So how many 10's of thousands of miles are those magnets going to give an engine? Someone surely must have documented it.

 

[Pablo]

It's called sarcasm (this dude usually means sarcasm ---> or ) ... you use it all the time around here. Loosen the undies. But seriously, why wouldn't it reduce wear if the oil is kept cleaner? What physics would be involved where cleaner oil of abrasive debris didn't reduce wear between moving parts? - all other factors held constant of course. I'm still waiting for that scientific proof or wear study. Nobody needs much more than basic science or knowledge of Tribology to realize what causes wear between moving parts. And BTW I've had plenty of science classes.


Maybe someone has done a study ... everyone has a keyboard and fingers. It's been mentioned in this thread that magnets can lower the oil cleanliness by an ISO code or two. Magnets are used in all kinds of industry to keep oil cleaner. What actually points in the direction that they do nothing? On the flip side, where's the poof they do nothing to reduce wear?

I'm sorry I took it as an insult. No worries, really I know where you are coming from but to say asking for verifiable hard demonstrable repeatable evidence is they same as flat earthers, yeah OK that is a joke.

 

[56Cummins]

Is there an advantage to a magnet at the filter vs oil pan?

Its a real pain to remove the debris from the inside of the oil pan. Drain plug magnet.

 

[Glenda W.]

Its a real pain to remove the debris from the inside of the oil pan. Drain plug magnet.

Yes I was thinking plug magnet.

 

[rstcso]

Yes I was thinking plug magnet.

I bought a drain plug magnet and was going to do a short drain interval on the Amsoil SS, but decided to just wait until the next OCI. The only concern in doing this is remembering where I put it when the time comes.