How to handle dangerously bad work by a shop

[Mykl]

Originally Posted By: Vikas
I am missing something here. You had a bearing replaced at the independent. You discovered worn bearing again before two years have gone by.

How in the world are you talking about being lazy or not having the press now? I mean I could have understood it if this was the first time you had a bad bearing on this vehicle.

Here is a question to the all of BITOG. How would *you* be able to verify that the guy who replaced the wheel bearing did it right afterwards? Is the answer do it yourself "always watch the mechanic like a hawk"? Doesn't that also imply you already know exactly how the work has to be done?


You're missing a lot. It's all in the original post. The axle nut backed off the axle and ruined all the mentioned parts. The bearing didn't fail because the bearing was bad, the bearing failed the second time because the axle nut wasn't secured properly and caused the axle to bang back and forth in the bearing assembly.

 

[Mykl]

Honest question:

If the axle nut is properly torqued, and you punch in the proper safety notch, what ways could that nut back out on it's own?

Let me assume they did their job perfectly. What could have caused this to happen?

Because if there is a plausible, reasonable explanation, I won't even go to the shop. I'll just accept it as a random failure. The problem is, I can't think of any plausible explanations, but I'm also not an engineer or a professional mechanic.

 

[KrisZ]

Originally Posted By: Mykl
You're missing a lot. It's all in the original post. The axle nut backed off the axle and ruined all the mentioned parts. The bearing didn't fail because the bearing was bad, the bearing failed the second time because the axle nut wasn't secured properly and caused the axle to bang back and forth in the bearing assembly.


You wrote yourself that it was discovered by accident when checking a punctured tire. You did not feel anything at all unusual? I mean if it caused that much damage to the mating components, you would surely feel it while driving. And how do you know the nut backed off? Was it marked?

 

[Mykl]

Originally Posted By: KrisZ
You wrote yourself that it was discovered by accident when checking a punctured tire. You did not feel anything at all unusual? I mean if it caused that much damage to the mating components, you would surely feel it while driving. And how do you know the nut backed off? Was it marked?


I did not feel it while driving. The steering wheel and ride were still smooth. The amount of play on the wheel wasn't ridiculous, just enough movement to let me know something was wrong. Had it progressed I can only assume that it would have been more obvious while driving the car. That said, this is my wife's car, and while she knows enough to know when to pull over and call me, I'm not her so I can't say that she wouldn't have continued to drive it and just tell me about it later.

We know the nut had backed off because the threads on the axle were damaged to the point that the nut couldn't have been retightened sufficiently to remove the play, which is why the axle had to be replaced.

 

[dishdude]

I think you need to go back to the original shop and give them the chance to make it right. Techs are going to make mistakes, it's how management chooses to address those issues that make the shop reputable.

Blasting them online isn't fair unless they've refused to make things right.

 

[Mykl]

Originally Posted By: dishdude
I think you need to go back to the original shop and give them the chance to make it right. Techs are going to make mistakes, it's how management chooses to address those issues that make the shop reputable.

Blasting them online isn't fair unless they've refused to make things right.



Definitely, that was the plan. I'd just like to have a "plan A" and "plan B". There will be no angry customer theatrics and no threats, even if things don't go the way I'd like.

I'll also reword the review I intend to post to remove the "emotional" from the rant, but I would still like to add something to the effect of "this was a dangerous mistake to make."

Also, if they do work with me in some way, the negative review will turn into a positive one. I know that stuff happens and people make mistakes, it's what happens after those mistakes that matter more.

Vikas: clarification on the in car vibration

The car had a "I need to get the wheels rebalanced" kind of vibration, subtle. It slowly got worse, then the TPMS light came on. I discovered the screw, fixed it, and driving to the dealership the ride and steering were smoother than my initial "....wheels rebalanced" thought. I was looking for vibration at that point, then believing that just the wheel bearing was toast.

 

[Mykl]

BURRRRRRNNNNNNNN

(to any law enforcement on the board, I will not set fire to anything)

 

[RooflessVW]

Originally Posted By: dishdude
I think you need to go back to the original shop and give them the chance to make it right. Techs are going to make mistakes, it's how management chooses to address those issues that make the shop reputable.

Blasting them online isn't fair unless they've refused to make things right.



This attitude needs to be more common. All types of technicians and mechanics make mistakes. Even the good ones. Even the self-proclaimed experts online will make mistakes.

A good shop will make it right, if not, make it clear you intend to leave bad reviews online and see if they change their tune. Google reviews reach the most people. A lawyer from a letter is inexpensive and may work. I would not pursue small-claims court if you value your time.

 

[Mykl]

Saying this in isolation to make sure it's seen:

I fully intend to talk to a manager at the shop in a polite, non confrontational, non threatening way to see if they're willing to work with me before dropping any negative reviews anywhere.

I felt that way from the beginning, but my post was long-ish, so I can see how it might not have been clear.

 

[Andrew1972]

I would have called the shop when the car was on the lift and "not safe to be driven" and let them decide.

Definitely approach the shop about the bill and before you place a negative review in. If decent shop they'll offer full or partial amount(you got new parts) for the repair performed.

Dealers are drama queens too.

 

[wallyuwl]

I would present the shop with the facts and receipts. They should award you the amount of money it would have cost them to fix it. This amount won't be as much as the dealer charged you.

That is about the best you can hope for without having to get a lawyer or small claims court involved.

Start out being rational and calm. Ask to speak with the owner or at least the general manager.

 

[440Magnum]

Originally Posted By: Mykl
Shop has a 2 year/24k mile warranty.

I do have the original paperwork and I am within the warranty period. I'll call the dealership and ask if they still have the parts. I regret not arranging that to begin with, along with all the pictures and videos I would have taken to bolster my argument.

440Magnum - the reason I threw that in there was to drive home the point home that this is a big deal. I'd like to include something to that effect, highlighting what could have happened here. Would you state it more plainly, and "matter of fact" rather than how I said it?


I would make it COMPLETELY unemotional. "Failure of this repair could have led to the wheel detaching from the suspension, resulting in a partial or complete loss of control of the vehicle" is quite sufficient. Anything else, as itguy08 said, just smacks of drama and even potentially trying to overstate something to get monetary gain. Sticking to the facts comes across stronger because whoever reads it can say,"wow, someone could have gotten killed" all on their own, whereas with all the emotion they say "wow, this guy had a nut come loose and now he's trying to inflate it into something bigger... well screw THAT!"

 

[Mykl]

Originally Posted By: 440Magnum

I would make it COMPLETELY unemotional. "Failure of this repair could have led to the wheel detaching from the suspension, resulting in a partial or complete loss of control of the vehicle" is quite sufficient. Anything else, as itguy08 said, just smacks of drama and even potentially trying to overstate something to get monetary gain. Sticking to the facts comes across stronger because whoever reads it can say,"wow, someone could have gotten killed" all on their own, whereas with all the emotion they say "wow, this guy had a nut come loose and now he's trying to inflate it into something bigger... well screw THAT!"



Fair point. How about I remove the "Emotional rant:" plus the following paragraph that's written in all caps, but then pick it up with the last "It cannot be overemphasized enough...." portion, dropping the "and XXXX AUTO SCREWED IT UP." portion of the last sentence?

I'll also work the wording on the last paragraph to make it more suggestive rather than dramatic.

 

[Vikas]

The part I don't get is that you didn't do it yourself first time; so what made you think you were going to do it the second time instead of having the dealer do it while it was in for something else? I don't get why you are blaming yourself. It is not your fault.

Two years is a LONG time for labor warranty. If a bolt is going to start loosening, it will do it way before the two years.

What is your trust level towards the dealer? Did you visually inspect everything that dealer told you?

 

[Mykl]

Originally Posted By: Vikas
The part I don't get is that you didn't do it yourself first time; so what made you think you were going to do it the second time instead of having the dealer do it while it was in for something else? I don't get why you are blaming yourself. It is not your fault.

Two years is a LONG time for labor warranty. If a bolt is going to start loosening, it will do it way before the two years.

What is your trust level towards the dealer? Did you visually inspect everything that dealer told you?


The part where I'm kicking myself is that the axle nut was right there in front of me. All I had to do was look. I've removed enough transmissions from FWD cars to know what it's supposed to look like.

Between work and third trimester "a baby is coming" appointments I've been rushing some things, and instead of having the thought "take it apart and see what the problem is" like I otherwise might have if I had performed even a basic inspection, it was just irritation that the wheel bearing failed again. The idea that it could have been anything other than the wheel bearing just didn't enter my head.

Because I was convinced it had to be the wheel bearing, my original logic of "I don't have a hydraulic press, take it to someone who does" was where I went with it, just like the first time.

In the moment I noticed it I had to leave to go to the hospital, and I had planned to take that car because it's easier for my wife to get in and out of than the GTI. So I dropped the car from the stands, got in the VW, and left.

The dealer in question has been good to me in the past and has given me no reason to not trust them. However, I didn't ask the question to go look because when I said "fine, fix it" I didn't have a correct understanding of what the problem was.

I walked out with the impression that the bearing had failed and somehow caused all those other parts to go with it. It wasn't until I was picking it up that the words "the axle nut backed out" stuck and I put together all the other things they told me when I was standing there stressing out over it. They told me quite clearly when I was having it looked at originally that the car was not safe to drive, they even gave me a loaner car to go home in that night on the house.

The other regret... I enjoy wrenching as a shade-tree hobby, so I'm genuinely curious to see what this kind of failure looked like. I missed that opportunity. (ha)

 

[Mykl]

^ although, taking it to get it repaired elsewhere may have been the right choice anyway, for my wife's sake. Assuming I had sourced a replacement knuckle locally, and all the other parts at *random parts store*, I still had to drive around and find a shop to press it all in before I could put it back together. All that may have left my wife without a car for longer than I or she would have cared for.

Having it done quickly, and done right (hopefully), was probably the best way for us right now.

 

[GiveMeAVowel]

I had an issue once where a shop replaced damaged lug nuts on
a well maintained Honda Accord with only 120k miles on it. The Honda DEALERSHIP had damaged ALL EIGHT FRONT STUDS AND LUGS BY CROSS THREADING during a tire rotation and oil change. Because it was almost a year since the vehicle had been there I wasn't going to try and get them to admit their incompetence and damage. So......

The shop that replaced the damaged lug nuts then went on to HAMMER on the studs to get them out and the severe blows ended up damaging the wheel bearing. When I got it back (I also had new tires installed at the same time) I noticed a very low barely audiable drone but attributed it to the brand new tires, after just 100 miles or so after getting it back the low drone rapidly turned into a roaring noise that was clearly a wheel bearing, I went back to the shop (indy owned) and stated what the noise was and they took it for a test drive, the service writer rudely comes back to me after he came back from the drive and barked at me "wheel bearing!". I indicated that they had just worked on the car a week or so ago and now this happens. I was polite, firm, and calm in my manner when discussing but the service writer was rude and abrupt and refused to acknowledge ANY responsibility at ALL. I indicated that it was quite a
"coninsidence" that after the tech hammered the studs out that the bearing failed within 100 miles after they worked on it. He would not make one iota of effort to accept any responsibility nor would he offer a discount on replacing the wheel bearing, I calmly told him that we spent 800$ in one trip at his shop and we would NEVER be returning again. Nothing from him. He tried the [censored] about how unsafe it was to drive the car that way with the failing bearing, but I told him, "oh this is my OTHER car and my home is about 7 miles from here, I'm just going to park it and drive my other vehicle until I decide what to do with this one". He looked a bit fazed because he just lost his shop business on TWO of my vehicles, I have also told anyone and EVERYONE I know NEVER to use them. It's a small town so word gets around.

 

[Gasbuggy]

The shop has a warranty that would likely only cover the repair at their own hand, they have no obligation to reimburse you. I would find that suspicious as a shop owner if someone just brought me a receipt like you plan to. I know you didn't want to drive it but what's another 9 miles after 22,000? If you called the shop I bet they would have it towed (most shops are tight with a tow truck driver.) Disparaging the shop online, that is just continuing the trend of bad ideas, they have your personal information on record...

 

[Jarlaxle]

I suspect the dealer wouldn't have LET him drive it.

 

[Mykl]

Originally Posted By: Gasbuggy
The shop has a warranty that would likely only cover the repair at their own hand, they have no obligation to reimburse you. I would find that suspicious as a shop owner if someone just brought me a receipt like you plan to. I know you didn't want to drive it but what's another 9 miles after 22,000? If you called the shop I bet they would have it towed (most shops are tight with a tow truck driver.) Disparaging the shop online, that is just continuing the trend of bad ideas, they have your personal information on record...


This....

Originally Posted By: Jarlaxle
I suspect the dealer wouldn't have LET him drive it.


The car wasn't safe to drive.

Gasbuggy, if I were you I would also be fairly suspicious, it's understandable. You're running a business, people know you have cash flow, and I'm sure you have to be on the lookout for scams that could cost you money.

Why should I trust your shop to perform the repair properly the second time? Not only that, but as a shop owner, how annoying is it when your shop offers a free diagnosis on a problem, only to have that customer call a tow truck to take the car to a different shop? That seems to fall squarely into the "not cool, man" category of **** moves.

As recommended in a private message, my next step is to try to get a statement from the dealership specifying that the axle nut was loose, rather than the "found these broken parts" statement it says on the receipt.

If the expert testimony from a mechanic that specializes in this make of car is not enough to raise an eyebrow, I guess not much else would.