The unwritten rule in OH here seems to have been 10 over is OK, 11 over gets you a ticket. I usually try to keep it to 5 over, in the center lane(s) of a 3 lane or more interstate-and I'm amazed at the number of drivers that go by ON BOTH SIDES at 25 over or more. They don't even slow down for cops in the median any more!
How much over the speed limit is too much?
- Thread starter grampi
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It all depends...safety if job one for me on the road. I used to drive motorcycles and I tend to still drive like I'm on one, very defensively!
Speed, depends on many factors:
1. What's everyone else doing
2. Is it raining
3. Road conditions
4. How much traffic
5. Am I familiar with every turn/bump in the road
6. If something goes wrong, do I have an exit strategy
7. Am I in a known speed trap area
For the most part I'd say about 10% of the cars out there are going faster than me.
Speed, depends on many factors:
1. What's everyone else doing
2. Is it raining
3. Road conditions
4. How much traffic
5. Am I familiar with every turn/bump in the road
6. If something goes wrong, do I have an exit strategy
7. Am I in a known speed trap area
For the most part I'd say about 10% of the cars out there are going faster than me.
Originally Posted by MotoTribologist
Originally Posted by grampi
Originally Posted by MCompact
Originally Posted by grampi
While I agree that slower drivers should move right, who is more wrong, the driver driving in the left lane at the speed limit holding other drivers up, or those speeding?
Easy- it's the idiots who camp out in the left lane; if those morons want to enforce the speed limit they should find a job in law enforcement.
So it's ok to break the law by speeding, but not ok to break the law impeding traffic flow?
Speeding is also not right, but there is some actual justification that most people tend to agree on for doing it.
I'm not picking on you, or anyone else, just trying to prove a point. What is the justification for speeding?
Originally Posted by grampi
Originally Posted by MCompact
Originally Posted by grampi
While I agree that slower drivers should move right, who is more wrong, the driver driving in the left lane at the speed limit holding other drivers up, or those speeding?
Easy- it's the idiots who camp out in the left lane; if those morons want to enforce the speed limit they should find a job in law enforcement.
So it's ok to break the law by speeding, but not ok to break the law impeding traffic flow?
Speeding is also not right, but there is some actual justification that most people tend to agree on for doing it.
I'm not picking on you, or anyone else, just trying to prove a point. What is the justification for speeding?
Originally Posted by MCompact
Originally Posted by FlyingVan
Most of the time I drive under the speed limit. Yes, even out west where the speed limit is 85 I drive at MY speed limit of 65. Works for me. I've been doing it for close to a million miles. I was once young and stupid and drove like a madman, but now the stress level has gone down tremendously. I arrive where I am going maybe half an hour later than if I sped, but I am more relaxed and my vehicles love me.
I'm 61 years old and I'd hardly call driving at 80-85 mph on a limited access highway driving "like a madman." I consistently drive at those speeds when the posted limit is 65-70 mph and I'm not stressed in the slightest. My 2er and 2er are happy to run at 100+ mph all day long so at 80 mph they are just loafing.
Good for you. I don't have to watch for cops, or speed traps, etc. That is stressful when you drive for a living.
Originally Posted by FlyingVan
Most of the time I drive under the speed limit. Yes, even out west where the speed limit is 85 I drive at MY speed limit of 65. Works for me. I've been doing it for close to a million miles. I was once young and stupid and drove like a madman, but now the stress level has gone down tremendously. I arrive where I am going maybe half an hour later than if I sped, but I am more relaxed and my vehicles love me.
I'm 61 years old and I'd hardly call driving at 80-85 mph on a limited access highway driving "like a madman." I consistently drive at those speeds when the posted limit is 65-70 mph and I'm not stressed in the slightest. My 2er and 2er are happy to run at 100+ mph all day long so at 80 mph they are just loafing.
Good for you. I don't have to watch for cops, or speed traps, etc. That is stressful when you drive for a living.
Originally Posted by grampi
I'm not picking on you, or anyone else, just trying to prove a point. What is the justification for speeding?
- That it does not affect others when done responsibly (ie. not in school/residential zones and similar situations)
- It causes no harm if done reasonably and when conditions allow
- People "need" to get somewhere and are running late (not a good excuse or justification by any means, but a reason most people can relate to, I think)
And to reiterate, none of these things make it "right" necessarily, but it sure stacks up against the LLDs (as I usually hear them referred to, or Left Lane "Richards" to keep it clean)
I'm not picking on you, or anyone else, just trying to prove a point. What is the justification for speeding?
- That it does not affect others when done responsibly (ie. not in school/residential zones and similar situations)
- It causes no harm if done reasonably and when conditions allow
- People "need" to get somewhere and are running late (not a good excuse or justification by any means, but a reason most people can relate to, I think)
And to reiterate, none of these things make it "right" necessarily, but it sure stacks up against the LLDs (as I usually hear them referred to, or Left Lane "Richards" to keep it clean)
Originally Posted by grampi
I'm not picking on you, or anyone else, just trying to prove a point. What is the justification for speeding?
Living in a congested city and not being an idiot so you and others can get home to their families faster. In addition to that, moving with the flow of traffic reduces the chance of accidents. Only hypermilers get a pass for driving the speed limit, and even then they are probably aware enough to GTFO.
I'm not picking on you, or anyone else, just trying to prove a point. What is the justification for speeding?
Living in a congested city and not being an idiot so you and others can get home to their families faster. In addition to that, moving with the flow of traffic reduces the chance of accidents. Only hypermilers get a pass for driving the speed limit, and even then they are probably aware enough to GTFO.
Moving with the flow of traffic is probably the best reason I've heard to justify speeding. Running late for work, or speeding to get home with your family isn't a valid reason. The point I was trying to make is that if it's done for long enough periods of time, and enough people do it, speeding is not only looked upon by most people as normal, but it's completely acceptable to do...everyone else does it, so why shouldn't I? This sort of social behavior isn't restricted to just driving either, it seeps into all facets of life...
Originally Posted by grampi
Moving with the flow of traffic is probably the best reason I've heard to justify speeding. Running late for work, or speeding to get home with your family isn't a valid reason. The point I was trying to make is that if it's done for long enough periods of time, and enough people do it, speeding is not only looked upon by most people as normal, but it's completely acceptable to do...everyone else does it, so why shouldn't I? This sort of social behavior isn't restricted to just driving either, it seeps into all facets of life...
Is this turning into a general rant about the slipping morals of society or something?
Moving with the flow of traffic is probably the best reason I've heard to justify speeding. Running late for work, or speeding to get home with your family isn't a valid reason. The point I was trying to make is that if it's done for long enough periods of time, and enough people do it, speeding is not only looked upon by most people as normal, but it's completely acceptable to do...everyone else does it, so why shouldn't I? This sort of social behavior isn't restricted to just driving either, it seeps into all facets of life...
Is this turning into a general rant about the slipping morals of society or something?
If speed truly killed by itself and not following too closely, driving recklessly, weaving in/out, cutting people off, or where weather didn't permit then we would see far more accidents then we do. Speed by itself doesn't kill!
Originally Posted by StevieC
If speed truly killed by itself and not following too closely, driving recklessly, weaving in/out, cutting people off, or where weather didn't permit then we would see far more accidents then we do. Speed by itself doesn't kill!
A lot of one car accidents are a result of speed ... the driver unable to control the vehicle, especially on curves.
"A new study out from the National Transportation Safety Board declares there's a singular and unequivocal reason for the uptick in deaths: Speed is what's killing Americans."
https://www.curbed.com/2017/7/28/16051780/us-traffic-death-speeding-statistics-speeding
"The study looked at U.S. passenger vehicle crashes from 2005 to 2014 and found that speeding was the main factor in 112,580 deaths, or about 31 percent of all traffic fatalities."
"Speed - and therefore speeding - increases crash risk in two ways: (1) it increases the likelihood of being involved in a crash, and (2) it increases the severity of injuries sustained by all road users in a crash."
https://www.ntsb.gov/news/events/Documents/2017-DCA15SS002-BMG-Abstract.pdf
If speed truly killed by itself and not following too closely, driving recklessly, weaving in/out, cutting people off, or where weather didn't permit then we would see far more accidents then we do. Speed by itself doesn't kill!
A lot of one car accidents are a result of speed ... the driver unable to control the vehicle, especially on curves.
"A new study out from the National Transportation Safety Board declares there's a singular and unequivocal reason for the uptick in deaths: Speed is what's killing Americans."
https://www.curbed.com/2017/7/28/16051780/us-traffic-death-speeding-statistics-speeding
"The study looked at U.S. passenger vehicle crashes from 2005 to 2014 and found that speeding was the main factor in 112,580 deaths, or about 31 percent of all traffic fatalities."
"Speed - and therefore speeding - increases crash risk in two ways: (1) it increases the likelihood of being involved in a crash, and (2) it increases the severity of injuries sustained by all road users in a crash."
https://www.ntsb.gov/news/events/Documents/2017-DCA15SS002-BMG-Abstract.pdf
Originally Posted by grampi
I'm not picking on you, or anyone else, just trying to prove a point. What is the justification for speeding?
I don't know, maybe you can tell us...
Originally Posted by grampi
I typically drive about 5 MPH over the limit
I'm not picking on you, or anyone else, just trying to prove a point. What is the justification for speeding?
I don't know, maybe you can tell us...
Originally Posted by grampi
I typically drive about 5 MPH over the limit
Originally Posted by ZeeOSix
Originally Posted by StevieC
If speed truly killed by itself and not following too closely, driving recklessly, weaving in/out, cutting people off, or where weather didn't permit then we would see far more accidents then we do. Speed by itself doesn't kill!
A lot of one car accidents are a result of speed ... the driver unable to control the vehicle, especially on curves.
"A new study out from the National Transportation Safety Board declares there's a singular and unequivocal reason for the uptick in deaths: Speed is what's killing Americans."
https://www.curbed.com/2017/7/28/16051780/us-traffic-death-speeding-statistics-speeding
I guarantee you they weren't driving for the road conditions, were distracted by something or were unskilled. I'm telling you in the almost 2 million kilometers I have accumulated behind the wheel in some of the worst weather imaginable I have had 0 accidents speeding where possible during that time. I have even avoided many accidents during that time as well because I'm always aware of my surroundings and road conditions.
It's not speed by itself there will always be some other factor not mentioned. Like speeding too fast for what the road conditions warrant, not seeing a curve ahead, taking the eyes off the road for a second, fumbling with the radio. Whatever...
Otherwise the Autobahn and roads like it would be an instant morgue.
Originally Posted by StevieC
If speed truly killed by itself and not following too closely, driving recklessly, weaving in/out, cutting people off, or where weather didn't permit then we would see far more accidents then we do. Speed by itself doesn't kill!
A lot of one car accidents are a result of speed ... the driver unable to control the vehicle, especially on curves.
"A new study out from the National Transportation Safety Board declares there's a singular and unequivocal reason for the uptick in deaths: Speed is what's killing Americans."
https://www.curbed.com/2017/7/28/16051780/us-traffic-death-speeding-statistics-speeding
I guarantee you they weren't driving for the road conditions, were distracted by something or were unskilled. I'm telling you in the almost 2 million kilometers I have accumulated behind the wheel in some of the worst weather imaginable I have had 0 accidents speeding where possible during that time. I have even avoided many accidents during that time as well because I'm always aware of my surroundings and road conditions.
It's not speed by itself there will always be some other factor not mentioned. Like speeding too fast for what the road conditions warrant, not seeing a curve ahead, taking the eyes off the road for a second, fumbling with the radio. Whatever...
Otherwise the Autobahn and roads like it would be an instant morgue.
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Originally Posted by StevieC
Otherwise the Autobahn and roads like it would be an instant morgue.
Those sort of logical fallacies don't add to discussion.
There are many many more variables there...but the faster you are travelling, the more scope there is for any of them in a certain time period...and the more 1/2mV^2 you are going to bring to the party.
200MPH, all going in the same direction, making the same turns is one thing. Make half of the field drive in the other direction, and you have a different risk recipe.
Otherwise the Autobahn and roads like it would be an instant morgue.
Those sort of logical fallacies don't add to discussion.
There are many many more variables there...but the faster you are travelling, the more scope there is for any of them in a certain time period...and the more 1/2mV^2 you are going to bring to the party.
200MPH, all going in the same direction, making the same turns is one thing. Make half of the field drive in the other direction, and you have a different risk recipe.
Originally Posted by StevieC
It's not speed by itself there will always be some other factor not mentioned. Like speeding too fast for what the road conditions warrant, not seeing a curve ahead, taking the eyes off the road for a second, fumbling with the radio. Whatever...
This is the biggest thing. It's all situation dependent, but I'm willing to bet it's almost always a driver issue, not a speed issue.
It's not speed by itself there will always be some other factor not mentioned. Like speeding too fast for what the road conditions warrant, not seeing a curve ahead, taking the eyes off the road for a second, fumbling with the radio. Whatever...
This is the biggest thing. It's all situation dependent, but I'm willing to bet it's almost always a driver issue, not a speed issue.
Originally Posted by StevieC
It's not speed by itself there will always be some other factor not mentioned. Like speeding too fast for what the road conditions warrant, not seeing a curve ahead, taking the eyes off the road for a second, fumbling with the radio. Whatever...
Otherwise the Autobahn and roads like it would be an instant morgue.
The people driving the Autobahn know better on how to drive at high speeds, but here are still deadly accidents there. And I'd bet most of them are due to the very high speeds involved.
If someone is excessively speeding and not paying attention, then the risk is much higher than if they weren't speeding excessively. So what do you blame the accident on ... speed, or distractions or road conditions, etc. "Speeding" could also be taken as driving too fast for conditions.
It's not speed by itself there will always be some other factor not mentioned. Like speeding too fast for what the road conditions warrant, not seeing a curve ahead, taking the eyes off the road for a second, fumbling with the radio. Whatever...
Otherwise the Autobahn and roads like it would be an instant morgue.
The people driving the Autobahn know better on how to drive at high speeds, but here are still deadly accidents there. And I'd bet most of them are due to the very high speeds involved.
If someone is excessively speeding and not paying attention, then the risk is much higher than if they weren't speeding excessively. So what do you blame the accident on ... speed, or distractions or road conditions, etc. "Speeding" could also be taken as driving too fast for conditions.
Originally Posted by Pew
Originally Posted by StevieC
It's not speed by itself there will always be some other factor not mentioned. Like speeding too fast for what the road conditions warrant, not seeing a curve ahead, taking the eyes off the road for a second, fumbling with the radio. Whatever...
This is the biggest thing. It's all situation dependent, but I'm willing to bet it's almost always a driver issue, not a speed issue.
Speed limits are set to try and cover the "driving skills" of most people on the roads. If you make the speed limit 100 MPH on narrow back roads, some people could handle it, but probably the majority of people couldn't. So yeah, how fast someone drives a vehicle is very dependent on their own perceived driving skill. Some people don't even have enough driving skill to not crash even if going the speed limit.
People driving way over the posted speed limit may or may not have the skill to kept the vehicle on the road or not get into an accident with another vehicle ... especially if they don't know the road like the back of their hand. If everyone was 100% paying attention to their driving, and drove at the speed limit or at a speed appropriate for conditions, then chances of crashing go way down. Start increasing speeds higher and higher, and start distracting yourself from driving (playing with the cell phone, eating, etc while driving) and you'll have a recipe for disaster.
Originally Posted by StevieC
It's not speed by itself there will always be some other factor not mentioned. Like speeding too fast for what the road conditions warrant, not seeing a curve ahead, taking the eyes off the road for a second, fumbling with the radio. Whatever...
This is the biggest thing. It's all situation dependent, but I'm willing to bet it's almost always a driver issue, not a speed issue.
Speed limits are set to try and cover the "driving skills" of most people on the roads. If you make the speed limit 100 MPH on narrow back roads, some people could handle it, but probably the majority of people couldn't. So yeah, how fast someone drives a vehicle is very dependent on their own perceived driving skill. Some people don't even have enough driving skill to not crash even if going the speed limit.
People driving way over the posted speed limit may or may not have the skill to kept the vehicle on the road or not get into an accident with another vehicle ... especially if they don't know the road like the back of their hand. If everyone was 100% paying attention to their driving, and drove at the speed limit or at a speed appropriate for conditions, then chances of crashing go way down. Start increasing speeds higher and higher, and start distracting yourself from driving (playing with the cell phone, eating, etc while driving) and you'll have a recipe for disaster.
Depends on flow of traffic.
Blasting by in the third lane adjacent 2nd lane dead stopped is not good judgment since a car may pull out at any time.
It seems 15-20 over another car in flow seems reasonable. Anything more a car may move over not expecting the fast passing car and boom.
Blasting by in the third lane adjacent 2nd lane dead stopped is not good judgment since a car may pull out at any time.
It seems 15-20 over another car in flow seems reasonable. Anything more a car may move over not expecting the fast passing car and boom.
Originally Posted by grampi
What is the justification for speeding?
When able, each successive lane to the left should be going faster than the preceding one. When not, drivers in each adjacent lane should adjust their speed accordingly to maintain safe gap and stagger. Speed differential between adjacent lanes shouldn't be too great as to cause unsafe passing and depth perception issues - especially at night.
Therefore, Grampi, with that dynamic in mind technically you should be speeding if the traffic speed is at or greater than the speed limit in the far right lane. Unfortunately, all too often N.A. drivers don't understand this dynamic like their European counterparts and think it's perfectly acceptable to speed in any lane they wish. In doing so they're just as bad as left lane bandits.
In good conditions I generally drive between 3 and 20 Km/h over.
What is the justification for speeding?
When able, each successive lane to the left should be going faster than the preceding one. When not, drivers in each adjacent lane should adjust their speed accordingly to maintain safe gap and stagger. Speed differential between adjacent lanes shouldn't be too great as to cause unsafe passing and depth perception issues - especially at night.
Therefore, Grampi, with that dynamic in mind technically you should be speeding if the traffic speed is at or greater than the speed limit in the far right lane. Unfortunately, all too often N.A. drivers don't understand this dynamic like their European counterparts and think it's perfectly acceptable to speed in any lane they wish. In doing so they're just as bad as left lane bandits.
In good conditions I generally drive between 3 and 20 Km/h over.
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