Originally Posted By: BusyLittleShop
Originally Posted By: 02SE
I don't NEED to see anything
Are you sure you wouldn't like to visit me out here in California and inspect Mr.RC45's gears???
Larry, do you mind if I call you Larry? It was not my intention to call you out, but simply to inquire if you have ever inspected your transmission gears for wear. By your response it seems clear you haven't, and don't intend to. As for California, it offers some great places to ride. It would be cool to meet another Motorcycle enthusiast and ride some of those fantastic roads you have there.
Originally Posted By: 02SE
As far as ZDDP levels. It makes one wonder why bike specific oils which are presumably created by qualified, competent Engineers, have much higher levels of ZDDP, if higher levels are indeed damaging as alluded to in your post.
It makes me wonder too given that higher levels of ZDDP does NOT provide more wear
protection, it only provides longer wear protection... I think we agree that extended
oil intervals beyond the recommended OCI is not a big selling point with motorcyclist...
Well, your statement that higher levels of ZDDP does not provide more wear protection, is contrary to official comments I've seen repeatedly from oil companies. Mobil touts the higher levels of ZDDP in their Mobil 1 15w50 formulation as being key in improving the anti-wear characteristics of the oil, especially in flat-tappet engines.
Brad Penn claims their 1500ppm of zinc as being key to anti-wear characteristics of the oil. Here's a press release from Brad Penn, posted here at Bitog:
Bitog LINK
From the press release:
Originally Posted By: Richard Glady from American Refining Group
Prior to January 8, 2008, Penn Grade 1® High Performance Oils were blended with zinc levels below 1500 ppm. This was in part dictated by the API service classification SJ which limited the phosphorus level to 1000 PPM max for catalyst compatibility. It was only after a decision was made to depart from the API performance classification that it was possible to increase the phosphorus level to 1340 to 1400 range of the current product. This corresponds to the advertized zinc concentration of 1500 PPM.
Being the former Kendall Refinery located in Bradford, Pa., we process 100% Pennsylvania Grade crude oil. From the crude oil, we obtain a unique base oil cut which builds a stable oil film that withstands high pressure, high temperature and scuffing associated with race and older, high performance engines. The product provides double protection (layer of lubricant with the zinc and phosphorous protection) to critical engine parts especially for flat tappet and roller cams. In fact, a majority of the cam manufacturers’ tested and now recommend our High Performance Oils before we reformulated the product.
From the same press release regarding the reason for the lower level of ZDDP anti-wear additive in their Break-in oil:
Originally Posted By: Richard Glady from American Refining Group
The Brad Penn® Penn Grade 1® Break-In oil is designed specifically with a lower level of ZDDP and other select additive components as a Break-In oil. Since break in is a wearing process high levels of an anti-wear additive may be counterproductive. The type of ZDDP used in this oil is also more suitable for break in applications. This product is highly recommended by a number of engine builders for use when breaking in newly assembled engines to lubricate and assure proper sealing of components.
So, we have seemingly contradictory comments from oil manufacturers. The comments you posted, and the comments I posted. The last VOA I saw on here for Mobil 1 10w40 4T Motorcycle specific oil, showed zinc at 1700ppm. They do not claim it is intended as an extended OCI oil. Presumably the Engineers at Mobil who also formulated the Mobil 1 Advanced Fuel Economy 0w30 oil you use, know what they're doing.
