Honda and Amsoil

[JOD]

Originally Posted By: rationull

This is interesting and somewhat discouraging if the problem turns out to be the filter. Honda's maintenance recommendation is to change the oil filter every other oil change which works out from 10k miles to up to 20k miles depending on driving conditions. They've been recommending this for years. Doesn't seem like the filter should plug up as low as 12-13k.



That recommendation is made with the OEM filter in mind. If you're using a non-OEM filter, you should probably stick with the recommendation on the filter. My guess is that the high efficiency Amsoil filter loads up more quickly than the lower-efficiency OEM filter. I've never heard of anyone using an OEM filter for 2 OCI's and having the oil pressure light come on.

 

[bryceban]

My driving is very similar to yours....I do either 50 or 100 mile highway runs at a time twice a day and average about 50,000 a year.

I run my filters for 18-20K miles at a time with no problems and use a quick drain oil plug and drain what ever syn I am using at ~10k. However, my engine is just the simple SOHC non-Vtech. I'm currently using M1 0w20 AFE with a Wix and thinking about running it (both oil and filter) for 20K miles and doing a UOA out of curiosity. It's just hard to swallow the price of a UOA when your car only takes 3.5qts. with a filter change...

I think M1 EP with a quality filter could easily do 15-18K in your application.

Also, I'm planning on driving this sucker until the wheels fall off.....hopefully at least 500,000 miles

Edit: To all who think I'm crazy my owners manual says to run 10K on conventional motor oil and 20K on filters for my driving conditions

 

[MadMike4]

Bryceban - Thanks for the reply. What oil and filter do you prefer? M1 and Wix at the moment? Isn't the M1 filter perhaps slightly superior??

I would be very happy to find a 15k oil and filter for my little Honda engine that will protect it well. As noted above, the Amsoil combo has given me some minor issues. Your vehicle and driving are similar to mine.

 

[bryceban]

Originally Posted By: MadMike4
Bryceban - Thanks for the reply. What oil and filter do you prefer? M1 and Wix at the moment? Isn't the M1 filter perhaps slightly superior??

I would be very happy to find a 15k oil and filter for my little Honda engine that will protect it well. As noted above, the Amsoil combo has given me some minor issues. Your vehicle and driving are similar to mine.


I have been using M1 5w20 and recently their 0w20 AFE since I found some locally on clearence for $3.99/qt. and have a jug of PU to use. I have also been a long time Wix user but plan on trying a Purolator P1 next since they seem to be as good if not better for about $2 less. Quite possible the M1 is a better filter from what I read but they are $13 and don't feel they would benefit me much since my miles are so easy and my engine seems very healthy and easy on oil.

BTW, my car did burn 1/2qt. of the AFE by about 6k miles. Once I get my small stash used up, I may go to a cheaper conventional with 10K drains and 20K filter changes. It's just so easy with the quick easy drain plug now.

In my case I would feel comfortable going blindly into 15K OCI with syn for my car since it will consume 1/2qt every ~5K miles and I can top it off with fresh oil...

Edit: Even if a 15K OCI isn't ideal for your car, I would think it would easily make 200K+ miles if you are going to get rid of it anyways. You know?

 

[MadMike4]

I'm really annoyed with myself and my Amsoil mechanic because I twice had the issue with engine noise and the low pressure light coming on ..... and to this day, Idon't know if the cause was oil consumption or filter clog. We assumed it was the filter due to the known issues with these engines and that filter. But, this last time I brought it in (with no noise or light) he said I was 2 quarts low after only 10k miles!!!!

Now i'm left to decide what to do, and I don't have proper info on the casue of my problem. Very frustrating.

 

[The_Eric]

Originally Posted By: MadMike4
I'm really annoyed with myself and my Amsoil mechanic because I twice had the issue with engine noise and the low pressure light coming on ..... and to this day, Idon't know if the cause was oil consumption or filter clog. We assumed it was the filter due to the known issues with these engines and that filter. But, this last time I brought it in (with no noise or light) he said I was 2 quarts low after only 10k miles!!!!

Now i'm left to decide what to do, and I don't have proper info on the casue of my problem. Very frustrating.


Here's what you do - start all over. Be it with Amsoil or Mobil or whatever brand you please...

Check your oil religiously (if you haven't or have never done it, LEARN. Monitor the situation. This will eliminate any questions concerning oil level being the cause for your problem (and is important to do anyway) Run it to just before your light would come on (10k?). Take a sample, do a UOA. This will tell you if the condition of the oil is the cause of the low oil pressure light.. If not and you're clear to go longer on the oil (per UOA), then you'll know that it was likely the filter and that you need to change it more frequently.

Another reason for a UOA is to determine if there is any underlying engine problems. Maybe the OCI you've selected is too long...

 

[MadMike4]

those are very good suggestions. I will do as you suggest. My frustration is in having to start over.

I have mostly myself to blame as I had always assumed that a relatively new engine running a top quality synthetic would not consume any oil.

 

[Artem]

Originally Posted By: MadMike4
What I don't know, but REALLY WISH I DID, is whether I was getting oil pressure warnings after 13k miles due to the filter being abit clogged, or the oil level low.

I am an idoit for not finding this out the 2 times it happened to me. Makes it harder to decide a new course of action.

I'm sure the Amsoil has done fine for me, but to be honest, I'm considering going Mobil One EP w/ Mobil one filter and going 12k - 14k OCI. Would that work, or should I stick with Amsoil and watch the oil level better?


Here's a thread i posted with Mobil 1 EP in my 2007 Civic EX.

Mobil 1 EP - 10,000 miles

I do a lot of highway driving and according to the UOA, i could easily keep extending my OCI.

My Current fill is Amsoil SSO 0w-30 with a M1 oil filter. (Amsoil EaO oil filter was not released at the time of my OC so i used Mobil 1)

Now that the Ea15k13 filters are out, i'll be using them instead of the M1. The redesigned filters should make it to 15k without problems.

I'm not sure if you've been using these filters or the older Eao13 which caused the issues you mention.

 

[Artem]

Originally Posted By: MadMike4
those are very good suggestions. I will do as you suggest. My frustration is in having to start over.

I have mostly myself to blame as I had always assumed that a relatively new engine running a top quality synthetic would not consume any oil.


The R18 in my 2007 EX doesn't burn any oil.

What i think could be causing your slight consumption is the fact that your car is a 5sp manual...

The 5th gear ratio in the manual gear box is much shorter then that of the auto tranny's 5th gear.

Manual 5th gear @ 80mph = 3,500rpm
Auto 5th gear @ 80mph = 2,600rpm

I think its because the engine is spinning at much faster speeds which could be why its using a bit of oil.

Just my thought having owned a manual 8th gen civic before i got an Auto.

 

[Artem]

Originally Posted By: MadMike4
I'm really annoyed with myself and my Amsoil mechanic because I twice had the issue with engine noise and the low pressure light coming on ..... and to this day, Idon't know if the cause was oil consumption or filter clog. We assumed it was the filter due to the known issues with these engines and that filter. But, this last time I brought it in (with no noise or light) he said I was 2 quarts low after only 10k miles!!!!

Now i'm left to decide what to do, and I don't have proper info on the casue of my problem. Very frustrating.



I think if you regularly top off the oil, i don't see why you shouldn't be able to do 15k OCIs with either the Amsoil combo or Mobil 1.

Your engine could be wearing a bit faster, hence the oil consumption.

It could also be from you running the oil low, which isn't helping the problem either and possibly making it worse.

 

[Artem]

Originally Posted By: JOD
I'd use a different filter if I were you. If I were getting an oil pressure light at 12-13K, I don't think I'd trust the filter to 10K.

Keep in mind the typical recommended Honda interval is 15-20K for a filter. If I were in your shoes I thing I'd use the OEM Honda filter or a Fram Extended Guard and run the Amsoil to 20K.

You could also change the filter out at 10K, but honestly that filter is no fun to change. It kinda defeats your purpose of the extended drain (decreasing maintenance). At that point, it seems that it would make more sense to skip an expensive extended drain oil.


Why is everyone against the Amsoil filter???

Its obviously filtering VERY well, given the fact that its clogging up @ 12k.

I'd be happy with that... change the filter at 10k, top off every so often to keep the level proper and keep going to 20k, with excellent filtration along the way.

 

[JOD]

Originally Posted By: Artem

Why is everyone against the Amsoil filter???

Its obviously filtering VERY well, given the fact that its clogging up @ 12k.

I'd be happy with that... change the filter at 10k, top off every so often to keep the level proper and keep going to 20k, with excellent filtration along the way.


I wouldn't say I'm "against" the Amsoil filter, but I am against it in certain applications for extended drains--and it's purported to be an extended drain filter. It doesn't seem to be suitable for the filter change interval (which is 15K) on this vehicle. That doesn't mean its a bad filter.

There are filters that will offer very good filtration and be suitable for the drain interval. Since the OP is trying to reduce maintenance, this doesn't seem to be the ideal filter for his application. That doesn't mean it's "bad".

And as I said earlier, if he's trying to reduce maintenance (his stated goal), changing the filter on this car twice during an OCI doesn't really do it; this isn't an easy filter to change.

 

[MadMike4]

That is exactly what my mechanic suggested, but when I went in last week to have just the filter changed at 10k, he said I was 2 quarts low and basically did a complete oil and filter change and charged me $80 for the service.

I wanted the best for my new car and the high miles I drive. I wanted extended OCI to save me some trips to the garage, and went with Amsoil as it has a rep for being the best. I'm a little disappointed but not sure if it's my engine, the oil, the filter, the mechanic, or myself I should be disappointed in. And not sure how to proceed from here.

this site is great. Thanks for all the suggestions.

 

[Artem]

Actually the oil filter change on the new civics is by far, the easiest i've seen out of any Honda i serviced. You can reach under the front bumper and change it out without even raising the car.

I agree that doing so is rather silly, esp for the OP who is trying to avoid getting under the car.

I think the OP should try a Mobil 1 filter and see how that works for him.

 

[MadMike4]

I am considering changing to M1 EP with an M1 filter, or PU with a Wix and trying again to run 15k OCI.

But I just got a complete fill of Amsoil SSO and a new/improved Amsoil filter so I have a couple of months to decide. What ever i do, I must watch my oil level more closely to monitor consumption. I hope I haven't damaged anything.

 

[unixguru]

I would go with M1 or K&N filter and one of the following oils for the 12k miles (in order of preference):

1. Pennzoil Ultra 5w30
2. Castrol Edge 5w30 or Castrol Syntec in 0w-30
3. M1EP

I've used Mobil 1 and M1EP quite a bit previously, but since decided not to use it because my engine had yellowish stains. I though it's normal, but once I switched to Pennzoil those stains were all gone.

 

[rationull]

Originally Posted By: Artem

Just my thought having owned a manual 8th gen civic before i got an Auto.


Did you notice a measurable difference in oil consumption between your MT R18 and your AT one?

 

[k24a4]

You sound like a busy guy, but have you considered doing your own oil changes? It requires some space and time, but is really quite easy. It can be done in 10-20 minutes and most of this time is allowing the old oil to drain out. You also have the satisfaction in the knowledge that the job was done correctly (hopefully). Personally, I have a stash of pure1 filters purchased at $3 and pennzoil platinum @$20 which equals a high quality synthetic oil change for ~$23. With your driving style I would think you could go 10k+ easily.

At $80 an oil change would it not be more cost effective to either do it yourself or have it done less expensively, but more frequently, at an express lube or tire retailer? You would also be buying yourself some peace of mind, and not risking damaging your investment, which is arguably one of the most well engineered vehicles on the road.


I was ripped off at a dealership once and vowed I would learn as much as I could about my car so that it would not happen again. This led to me attempting and succeeding at basic tasks like air filter and oil changes to more involved but equally simple efforts at exchanging a rear sway bar and replacing my brake pads. It is rewarding and fun. I can't afford a new vehicle every x amount of years, and so hope to keep my Honda as long as possible.

 

[flyingtoaster]

I would use an S2000 filterr for extra capacity.

 

[bryceban]

Originally Posted By: flyingtoaster
I would use an S2000 filterr for extra capacity.


Do you know if an S2000 filter (like WIX 51334) would fit my 02 Civic LX? Thanks.