Home inspector flagged multiple neutrals on single lug in breaker panel

[mr_boring]

Bad practice and doesn't meet code. Can't isolate circuits and the expansion and contraction of the wires can loosen the connection, resulting in heat. Original builder/electrician probably did that out of laziness, just like backstabbing receptacles.

Luckily it is an easy fix that you can do yourself. You can do 3 grounds in 1 lug but only 1 neutral per lug.

I didn't know backstabbing was bad, I do it whenever I replace one. I leaned something new today - thanks

 

[mr_boring]

I have a different take on issues listed by an inspector post sales contract pre closing. Only offer the buyer a cash offer for any and all issues.

Fixing issues require reinspection, and other exposures.

Offer the Buyer a cash amount at closing and let them do any repairs. Significantly reduces your hassle and exposure.

Agree, or offer to cover % of closing cost in lieu of repair. When I bought mine in '20 - inspector found about 3k in things that needed repair. My realtor suggested I take a 3k cash credit at closing and "get the things fixed that really needed to be fixed" out of pocket. I spent about $300, maybe $350 fixing the things that really needed to be fixed, doing it all myself. This included a couple of receptacles, taking a ceiling fan off of a dimmer switch, running fresh wire to my garbage disposal and fixing a toilet (flange was broken) and getting the gas fireplace working correctly (all I had to do was clean the anode)

 

[Kantaro]

I didn't know backstabbing was bad, I do it whenever I replace one. I leaned something new today - thanks

Backstabbing is "fine" in the sense that it technically meets code, but it's not good practice and it opens the door for potential issues with loose connections. I think the fact that you can't backstab 12awg for 20A and grounds says enough. Going through my home's 40 year old wiring, I found many loose backstabbed connections that pulled right out without any effort. Unfortunately the new Decora Edge receptacles with the Wago style lever connectors weren't available at the time, otherwise I would've used those instead of J hooking and side screwing a billion wires...

I would definitely check receptacles that see high loads and make sure they aren't backstabbed. I would also address any daisy chained back stabs and pig tail those instead.

 

[mr_boring]

Backstabbing is "fine" in the sense that it technically meets code, but it's not good practice and it opens the door for potential issues with loose connections. I think the fact that you can't backstab 12awg for 20A and grounds says enough. Going through my home's 40 year old wiring, I found many loose backstabbed connections that pulled right out without any effort. Unfortunately the new Decora Edge receptacles with the Wago style lever connectors weren't available at the time, otherwise I would've used those instead of J hooking and side screwing a billion wires...

I would definitely check receptacles that see high loads and make sure they aren't backstabbed. I would also address any daisy chained back stabs and pig tail those instead.

I have to replace a couple right now and I will not backstab them. I always liked backstabbing because I never get bit doing one hot... but I did do a bit of googling just now and will change that habit going forward.

 

[short]

Pull the meter ( very high chance you don't have a meter based disconnect) Anti-Ox the mains, use the lower neutral bar and spread out the bunched up neutrals the right side and call it a day. You go any farther and you open up a rats nest. Spend the time and make it neat. You still may be bunched up because of lack of wire length. Having a sparky do it would cost you about $400+, but then you are documented. Because technically, depending on your state/city, because you are selling it, it is not your house. You don't have the "owners right to do licensed electrical work as long as it is permitted and passed- exemption" in the state/city's eyes. So you need a licensed tradesman to do the work. (cough)

So much wrong with this.

 

[Mainia]

So much wrong with this.

Not in my state/city.

 

[SHOZ]

Illinois doesn't require a license to be an electrician but the electric company is the one who approves who can work on their end. Me and my neighbor put in a new panel and meter socket with some conduit going out to a shed. We disconnected the meter and did the work then put in the old meter. I called them to say the seal got broke and what we did.

They were appreciative of the heads up about the meter and asked who did the work but didn't say anything about who did do it.

 

[demarpaint]

This is what I told the brokers who have sold houses for me in the past. "The house is priced as is, make sure you tell your clients before you bring them here." I found that works, especially when you show one or two the door. Remember home inspectors have to earn the cost of their service, at the sellers expense. They have so many disclaimers to get them off the hook if they do screw up it's comical to read one of their reports. Supply is down, and demand is pretty high where I am, and in most parts of the country. Unless you have to get out in a hurry, or it's a cheap fix I'd pass on that deal.

 

[Pablo]

I always fix the niggling garbage so the boxes can be checked. I dunno just me. So minor are some of these one or two things.

But I no longer hire an inspector when buying. I mean since the last guy missed two gas leaks that I clearly SMELLED. Other misses over the years have angered me as well. One guy didn't even catch a couple wrap around porch short posts had rotted and were just punted under the porch. Not hard to fix, but come on man.

 

[demarpaint]

I always fix the niggling garbage so the boxes can be checked. I dunno just me. So minor are some of these one or two things.

But I no longer hire an inspector when buying. I mean since the last guy missed two gas leaks that I clearly SMELLED. Other misses over the years have angered me as well. One guy didn't even catch a couple wrap around porch short posts had rotted and were just punted under the porch. Not hard to fix, but come on man.

I'm with you! I won't hire an inspector either. Their cost and ridiculous waiver/disclaimer is a big turn off. I learned how to check a house from working in new and old houses for over four decades. Many kick back money to the brokers. It's very rare they'll kill a deal if the broker referred them, which is probably why they have an ironclad waiver/disclaimer. A lot of brokers will tell a buyer they don't have to be around for the home inspection, they'll handle everything. That tells the whole story.

 

[short]

Not in my state/city.

I can’t get past the first sentence. You and your City/ State wants the homeowner to pull the meter? and cut the anti tamper tag around the metal rim of the meter? Should he/she also do it barefoot while standing in the wet grass?

 

[nwjones18]

I told the realtor that I wasn't interested in making the repair and to ask the buyer if that was a deal breaker for them. It apparently wasn't and we're moving forward with the sale. Just have to get through the VA appraiser now..

Just as a side note if sale goes through and it seems it will my house will be the highest price per sq ft ($132) ever sold in my neighborhood. My house had a minor remodel in the early 00's and the only things I've done other than maintain it since I bought it in 2011 is an A/C unit and new range/dishwasher/microwave... I spent maybe $1k prepping for sale and that included $500 for house cleaner and $300 for mulch. Market is definitely on sellers side these days.

With it said I do have one of the best lots and it is a 4br 2b where most are just 3/2's. And there is nothing actually wrong with it. I've really enjoyed living there and will miss it.

 

[Rogueman2016s]

I have to replace a couple right now and I will not backstab them. I always liked backstabbing because I never get bit doing one hot... but I did do a bit of googling just now and will change that habit going forward.

Pay the extra and purchase commercial line receps.. They have a bit more heft in the construction and quality also features a pressure plate for fastening the wires similar to a GFCI.

 

[Skippy722]

Do you have the option of doing nothing and telling the prospective buyer to pound salt? You buy an older house, you buy some problems.

I see the issue here with the panel. It should be corrected at some point, but so should a million things in every household.

I know there's really good home inspectors out there and I respect them, but I really dislike the home inspection process . It's a money grab for the buyer to save some money and the seller to loose some.

In my experience yes, you can tell the buyer “no, I ain’t fixing that” and it’s up to them to walk away, negotiate, or drop the matter and proceed anyway.

When we sold our 1st house the buyer wanted us to put in an outdoor light by the patio door and we straight up refused (in writing), they accepted that counter offer. They also wanted a “licensed contractor” to replace a few pieces of bad wood on the deck, we responded with “homeowner will replace deck boards.”

 

[4WD]

Sold a condo a few years back and the inspector had 4 electrical “issues” … Got a licensed electrician and he said one was an issue and one was an inconvenience (how light switches were wired) - but 2 were nonsense …
Did his two for just over $400 - with this explanation and action - buyer paid my full asking price -vs- others offering less …

 

[dlundblad]

Inspectors can be annoying. When the parents sold the lake house, the inspector missed a few “as is” issues (damage to drywall from a previously leaking roof for example), but was very adamant about having the buyer have my dad get an RO system installed.

Dad told the realtor to tell the buyer to pack it. The guy later bought it.

 

[JHZR2]

Your panel has Neutrals and Grounds on the same buss bars, you need to get those split out to where one bar is for grounds and one bar is for neutrals. You should be able to do this yourself, this isn't transplanting a kidney.

Unless this is a subpanel, I’m not sure that’s the case.

 

[Hall]

Pay the extra and purchase commercial line receps.. They have a bit more heft in the construction and quality also features a pressure plate for fastening the wires similar to a GFCI.

I replaced all of our kitchen counter receptacles with commercial grade as well as various ones around the house. They are typically ones that are out in the open and get things plugged and unplugged frequently (vacuum cleaner, for instance). The one behind the TV, for example, gets plugged in and never touched for years so I didn't bother. As you mention, they are nice because you can back-wire them.

They also wanted a “licensed contractor” to replace

Again, this is standard text that every home inspector (or buyer's agent) uses, simply to covers their behinds. Guarantee they'd use that same wording for "Outlet covers by stovetop and front door are cracked and need replaced by a licensed electrician".

 

[Pablo]

I replaced all of our kitchen counter receptacles with commercial grade as well as various ones around the house. They are typically ones that are out in the open and get things plugged and unplugged frequently (vacuum cleaner, for instance). The one behind the TV, for example, gets plugged and never touched for years so I didn't bother. As you mention, they are nice because you can back-wire them.

I'm nearly done replacing ALL the cheap contractor grade around our place. Seemingly never ending!

These were the very WORST child protection cheapie outlets that become IMPOSSIBLE to plug anything in, PLUS they didn't have screw terminals at all.

 

[KrisZ]

The comments in this thread are all over the map (many incorrect).

Your house was built to an older code and everything I see in the panel is typical from a house this age.

Your home inspector isn’t an electrician or code official. I’ve expressed my opinions on most home inspectors in other threads.

I would not do anything to the panel myself. I would tell the homebuyer fix it if they want. I would not try to “correct” anything yourself.

This x 1000

The home inspector is likely trying to look like his services are worth the money.