Hertz is selling off a portion of its Tesla fleet... cheap.

[Burt]

Is 50-100,000 miles typical for rental ICEs today? Used to be 20-30,000 miles.

I’d say it is pretty impressive that Hertz held on to them this long. Whether they are “throwing in the towel” depends on whether they are replacing them in the fleet. It doesn’t say in the article.

 

[Rmay635703]

Is 50-100,000 miles typical for rental ICEs today? Used to be 20-30,000 miles.

I’d say it is pretty impressive that Hertz held on to them this long. Whether they are “throwing in the towel” depends on whether they are replacing them in the fleet. It doesn’t say in the article.

One of the Hertz Tesla cars had 192,000 miles, it sold quickly and honestly wasn’t all that cheap or that old.

If their argument is nobody rents Teslas and they can’t make money I honestly don’t get how some of the cars had such high miles if nobody was renting

 

[dishdude]

One of the Hertz Tesla cars had 192,000 miles, it sold quickly and honestly wasn’t all that cheap or that old.

If their argument is nobody rents Teslas and they can’t make money I honestly don’t get how some of the cars had such high miles if nobody was renting

They had a partnership with Uber, the Uber drivers could rent them for around $500/week.

 

[Torrid]

They had a partnership with Uber, the Uber drivers could rent them for around $500/week.

Sounds like they made money then.

 

[PandaBear]

This is exactly why EV's are considered by many as "throwaway" vehicles.
Once you are done with them, there's little demand in the used market for one.

In a world that's supposedly concerned with the environment, you couldn't have a more wasteful proposition.

Most things are considered throwaway. Your engine is probably designed for 200k miles, transmission as well if you are lucky. Hybrid battery at 150k, etc. If a Tesla can last 200k then it is OK to be honest. You just have to make sure you buy it for the right usage like mid distance commute, instead of just sit there depreciating 20 years when the battery dies at 30k miles, or want to drive it 500k miles like a Prius but had to fast charge every day and it dies at 5 years 150k miles.

Your BMW is probably not that durable if it is fancy and complicated. I know a guy who junked his Mercedes because his rear window (a convertible) is stuck and it cost $7k to repair it. The power train is fine otherwise.

Your Nissan with JATCO CVT should have lasted 200k miles but it fail at 70k miles due to design problem and nobody will repair it? The trade in value is 1k and it cost 6k to replace it but the car is only worth 5k? Junkyard time.

The biggest problem with cool new thing is the depreciation can be massive out of nowhere because of demand and supply, and fashion direction change, or it is no longer "cool". Tesla is cool now, in high demand, and models keep improving constantly. It is a recipe for massive depreciation even if it last a long time and never malfunction, just nothing you can do about it.

 

[alarmguy]

Is 50-100,000 miles typical for rental ICEs today? Used to be 20-30,000 miles.

I’d say it is pretty impressive that Hertz held on to them this long. Whether they are “throwing in the towel” depends on whether they are replacing them in the fleet. It doesn’t say in the article.

Hertz is replacing 1/3 of its EV fleet with gasoline vehicles. So think safe to say throwing in the towel as far as any possible future EV expansion plans.

They have been a fail and the vast majority, 80% of its fleet are Teslas. Hertz notified the SEC they are taking a 245 million write down do to high depreciation costs.

The EVs are getting in more crashes, parts/repair/ damage costs more expensive (close to 100% higher) and deprecation higher, punishing for a rental company.

Here is a well written story from a known “green” news network.

https://www.cnn.com/2024/01/11/business/hertz-tesla-selling/index.html

Good read

 

[demarpaint]

Is 50-100,000 miles typical for rental ICEs today? Used to be 20-30,000 miles.

I’d say it is pretty impressive that Hertz held on to them this long. Whether they are “throwing in the towel” depends on whether they are replacing them in the fleet. It doesn’t say in the article.

I heard on business news they'd be replaced with ICE vehicles. A small percent of their fleet would be EV, nowhere near what it was.

Edit to add: CNBC just said they sold them off because there wasn't enough demand, and the cost to repair is high. Having said that I'd say they know the car rental business, but they screwed up with their go broke or go home mentality on this deal.

 

[Jetronic]

Many years ago Hertz painted some of their rentals with this unique color scheme. Made them instant classics. Maybe they ought to try it again with the ratted out Teslas.


View attachment 197732
Autoweek

That looks great!

 

[Trav]

I would be concerned about the battery warranty, is it transferable? It would be huge hit if someone bought one of these for 20K and in a few months it needed a 20K battery. Personally I would not buy one of these things new for 20K never mind a used rental.

 

[alarmguy]

I would be concerned about the battery warranty, is it transferable? It would be huge hit if someone bought one of these for 20K and in a few months it needed a 20K battery. Personally I would not buy one of these things new for 20K never mind a used rental.

Tesla battery warranties are good for a minimum of 100,000 miles or eight years and online depending on model.

“The balance of original Battery and Drive Unit Limited warranty still applies for used vehicles.”

 

[dogememe]

I honestly don't think these are THAT cheap considering the abuse and hard life these batteries have had. If I was in the market for a used Tesla I'd much rather take my chances with a used one with a single owner.

Keep in mind whether rented out by Hertz or used in the Uber partner program, these were pretty much always fast-charged. And while some people say there is no correlation between battery degradation and how it was charged, I think it does matter at least somewhat.

I think EVs are nice, heck, I own a 3/4-EV, but they are, at the moment, not ideal rental cars. To make it work would mean investing in a large quantity of Level2 charging stations at all rental car locations. If they could rent out cars charged to 80% every time, and charged (no pun intended), let's say, a flat fee of $20 so you can bring the car back as low as you want, that could work out. But the way they're currently doing it sucks IMO.

 

[Trav]

Tesla battery warranties are good for a minimum of 100,000 miles or eight years and online depending on model.

“The balance of original Battery and Drive Unit Limited warranty still applies for used vehicles.”

Some of these cars have 80+K on them so its 20K or less warranty left on the battery with a 20K+ replacement bill possibly right around the corner. I was born at night but not last night, a moron would not buy into that deal.

 

[alarmguy]

Some of these cars have 80+K on them so its 20K or less warranty left on the battery with a 20K+ replacement bill possibly right around the corner. I was born at night but not last night, a moron would not buy into that deal.

I agree on the high mileage ones, the 25,000 mile ones are another story, either way these are not giveaway prices yet. There will be future markdowns. It was a very costly boondoggle getting into the EV rentals. Just out of bankruptcy Hertz management shows their in-competance again.

Im not sure you saw my previous link from very early this morning. (best part is no one can deflect claiming its that "other" news network) Some questions arose if they are going to replace those EVs with other EVs. The answer is a resounding NO. They are replacing with EVs with gasoline automobiles in order to return to profitability instead of losing money on the EV rentals.
https://www.cnn.com/2024/01/11/business/hertz-tesla-selling/index.html

 

[Torrid]

I think this whole story just shows me that Hertz likes to be in the news. Doesn't matter if it's good or bad, but the Shelby program, the exotic car program, EVs. I'm pretty sure this was round 3 for attempting EVs and definitely the biggest purchase of them. Knowing some of those meetings I sat in on I'm sure someone along the way are saying, "yeah, but they're talking about us." Got to stay positive I guess.

I agree on the high mileage ones, the 25,000 mile ones are another story, either way these are not giveaway prices yet. There will be future markdowns. It was a very costly boondoggle getting into the EV rentals. Just out of bankruptcy Hertz management shows their in-competance again.

Im not sure you saw my previous link from very early this morning. (best part is no one can deflect claiming its that "other" news network) Some questions arose if they are going to replace those EVs with other EVs. The answer is a resounding NO. They are replacing with EVs with gasoline automobiles in order to return to profitability instead of losing money on the EV rentals.
https://www.cnn.com/2024/01/11/business/hertz-tesla-selling/index.html

Oh how right you are. I could write a novel on that one. I moved states for a new career because of their business practices.

 

[Brons2]

Lowest Model 3 around Austin/San Antonio is a 2020 with 90K miles listed at $29K. Near new price for a beat-up rental with battery half-gone? These people are nuts...

I saw some in the lower 20s last week, they must have sold already.

 

[Brons2]

What might make this more workable, and buying high mileage used EVs in general, is aftermarket batteries in the ~$5K range.

These are out there already for the Priuses of the world. There's some videos on YouTube of folks like ChrisFix installing aftermarket batteries in a Prius. I'm sure with the Siennas being all hybrid now, there will be an aftermarket battery replacement soon for those as well.

It's a big jump in capacity to an EV battery, but, that doesn't mean it can't be done. It's just more risky because of the higher costs. But someone will take it on eventually.

 

[Rmay635703]

I would be concerned about the battery warranty, is it transferable? It would be huge hit if someone bought one of these for 20K and in a few months it needed a 20K battery. Personally I would not buy one of these things new for 20K never mind a used rental.

Federal law requires an 8/100 warranty on the battery, where things get murky is on repaired salvage.

The trouble is at least 100 of Hertz’s cars had over 100,000 miles so no warranty no matter what

 

[proveitwithdata]

So from what i read on the hertz website and understand from tesla.

standard kit
hertz 7 day return policy:
7 days/250 miles

hertz powertrain warranty
1 year/12000 miles

Tesla service mode i assume would be able to tell me a lot of data tesla hq can see regarding pack wear, and other onboard systems

unknown:
tesla battery warranty has a rental exclusion warranty on page 7 of their agreement. Whether hertz has a special agreement is unknown.

optional
Hertz offers extended warrantys.


If I was bored and wanted to dip my toes into the ev sphere at a low cost of entry, I take the odds of winning this gamble over a used nissan leaf.

 

[Torrid]

What might make this more workable, and buying high mileage used EVs in general, is aftermarket batteries in the ~$5K range.

These are out there already for the Priuses of the world. There's some videos on YouTube of folks like ChrisFix installing aftermarket batteries in a Prius. I'm sure with the Siennas being all hybrid now, there will be an aftermarket battery replacement soon for those as well.

It's a big jump in capacity to an EV battery, but, that doesn't mean it can't be done. It's just more risky because of the higher costs. But someone will take it on eventually.

You should check out Electrified Garage which is an actual shop that does some battery repairs if you're not already familiar with them. Owned by Rich Benoit who has the Rich Rebuilds channel. I know they fixed a Model S from another YouTube guy for around $1,200 by replacing a cell and balancing. That needs to be a more commonly possible repair.

$29k is a hard sell for an 80k+ mile rental when these are the current new prices.

 

[dogememe]

What might make this more workable, and buying high mileage used EVs in general, is aftermarket batteries in the ~$5K range.

These are out there already for the Priuses of the world. There's some videos on YouTube of folks like ChrisFix installing aftermarket batteries in a Prius. I'm sure with the Siennas being all hybrid now, there will be an aftermarket battery replacement soon for those as well.

It's a big jump in capacity to an EV battery, but, that doesn't mean it can't be done. It's just more risky because of the higher costs. But someone will take it on eventually.

You can get a Prius battery with BRAND NEW cells for $2K: https://www.greentecauto.com/hybrid...rius-hybrid-battery-with-new-generation-cells

Meanwhile, take my 2015 Volt for example... there are no new cells available. There is nothing to rebuild unless you just want to mix-and-match used cells. Even though its 17Kwh total/10Kwh usable pack is small compared to most "real" EVs, the lack of availability of new cells is the bigger problem.

Long term rebuilding will never work out unless new cells are available. And vehicle manufacturers have no incentive to make new cells available for past EVs.

What I'm trying to say is you can't compare the low cost and ease of replacing a battery in a Prius to doing battery work in literally any actual EV.