Havoline Syn-Blend High Mileage 5w-30 and 10w-30 NOACK and HTHS

[RDY4WAR]

I called Chevron's technical line earlier and got the following specs for the Havoline Syn-Blend High Mileage 5w-30 and 10w-30 oils.

5w-30

KV100.........11.8 cSt
HTHS..........3.3 cP
NOACK.......13%
Syn-blend....45%

10w-30

KV100..........10.3 cSt
HTHS...........3.1 cP
NOACK........9%
Syn-blend.....11%

The 5w-30 has a higher HTHS and synthetic percentage, but the 10w-30 has a lower NOACK. I'm not sure which I consider more important.

 

[csandste]

All 5w-30 oil, whether advertised as syn-blend or conventional is about 45-50% group III. Only Mobil sells group II+ base stocks that can make the standards. Assume there's going to be some re branding of oil within next few years.

 

[bbhero]

That is cool... Like the HTHS being a bit higher. And the 45 percent is higher than I would have thought it would be... Typically I'd bet most of the time the percentage of group 3 oils in regular oils would be 15-30 percent.

 

[csandste]

Originally Posted by bbhero
That is cool... Like the HTHS being a bit higher. And the 45 percent is higher than I would have thought it would be... Typically I'd bet most of the time the percentage of group 3 oils in regular oils would be 15-30 percent.


Got to be about 50 percent whether 5-20 or 5-30 depending on weight, not brand. I've posted Mobil data sheets pushing their goosed up group 2. I'd always thought there was far less, but whether it's semi-syn or conventional it all works out to close to fifty percent group 3. Unless it's Mobil. SN is really very stout.

 

[csandste]

10-30 has much less group 3. Any brand.

 

[bbhero]

Originally Posted by csandste
Originally Posted by bbhero
That is cool... Like the HTHS being a bit higher. And the 45 percent is higher than I would have thought it would be... Typically I'd bet most of the time the percentage of group 3 oils in regular oils would be 15-30 percent.


Got to be about 50 percent whether 5-20 or 5-30 depending on weight, not brand. I've posted Mobil data sheets pushing their goosed up group 2. I'd always thought there was far less, but whether it's semi-syn or conventional it all works out to close to fifty percent group 3. Unless it's Mobil. SN is really very stout.



Disagree... Others well more in the know shall we say it was less than thirty percent.

Which was likely part of the reason why Pennzoil Gold actually made it know it was 50 percent synthetic... And that was Dexos approved at that time. I highly doubt other regular oils that were just API SN had the same amount of full synthetic group 3 in them at that time like Pennzoil Gold did... It was there for sure. Just not where a Dexos approved oil level was needed. Was not needed for a basic API SN approval.

 

[passgas55]

I am a 10/30 fan. I live in the south and may have seen the temps got to 30 degrees one or two times this year. I would love to
see what the numbers look like with a 45% 10/30 oil. But my question is why is the price the same for a 5/30 and a 10/30? Seems the 10/30 would be cheaper to make.

 

[RDY4WAR]

Originally Posted by passgas55
I am a 10/30 fan. I live in the south and may have seen the temps got to 30 degrees one or two times this year. I would love to
see what the numbers look like with a 45% 10/30 oil. But my question is why is the price the same for a 5/30 and a 10/30? Seems the 10/30 would be cheaper to make.


It could be that they don't want people in colder climates to grab the wrong viscosity just because it's cheaper and end up with cold start problems. People would be more inclined to pick the right viscosity if the price is the same. Also, there's the factor of the vast majority of people don't understand the difference between conventional and synthetic oil, much less group II vs group III, so they just reap a higher profit margin.

Disclaimer: This theory is purely speculation, and I base it on absolutely nothing.

I'm not too concerned about the synthetic percentage. I'm undecided if, for a daily driver in mild to warm climate that you plan to keep until the wheels fall off, the 0.2 higher HTHS is more important or if the 4% lower NOACK is more important.

 

[ka9mnx]

HTHS would be more important if your goal is long engine life.

 

[dave1251]

Originally Posted by bbhero
Originally Posted by csandste
Originally Posted by bbhero
That is cool... Like the HTHS being a bit higher. And the 45 percent is higher than I would have thought it would be... Typically I'd bet most of the time the percentage of group 3 oils in regular oils would be 15-30 percent.


Got to be about 50 percent whether 5-20 or 5-30 depending on weight, not brand. I've posted Mobil data sheets pushing their goosed up group 2. I'd always thought there was far less, but whether it's semi-syn or conventional it all works out to close to fifty percent group 3. Unless it's Mobil. SN is really very stout.



Disagree... Others well more in the know shall we say it was less than thirty percent.

Which was likely part of the reason why Pennzoil Gold actually made it know it was 50 percent synthetic... And that was Dexos approved at that time. I highly doubt other regular oils that were just API SN had the same amount of full synthetic group 3 in them at that time like Pennzoil Gold did... It was there for sure. Just not where a Dexos approved oil level was needed. Was not needed for a basic API SN approval.



Back in ISLAC-4 days CP products used a minimum of 40% group III to make it to spec.

 

[RDY4WAR]

I know a lot of people into classic and muscle cars. They're all "thick" and "conventional" fans. The popular choice seems to be Castrol GTX 20w-50 in everything they run, including bone stock 150 hp 305 SBC. They always chant that you should never use synthetic oil in those older engines with the rationale that those engines were designed before synthetic oil and synthetic is "too thin" for their older engines. When I tell them their conventional oil already contains a decent amount of synthetic oil just to pass API standards, they look at me like I have no idea what I'm talking about.

Originally Posted by ka9mnx
HTHS would be more important if your goal is long engine life.


The longevity benefits of a higher HTHS are definitely known. I wonder if higher evaporation via the PCV would cause more valve deposits and reduce longevity in that way.

 

[bbhero]

Originally Posted by dave1251
Originally Posted by bbhero
Originally Posted by csandste
Originally Posted by bbhero
That is cool... Like the HTHS being a bit higher. And the 45 percent is higher than I would have thought it would be... Typically I'd bet most of the time the percentage of group 3 oils in regular oils would be 15-30 percent.


Got to be about 50 percent whether 5-20 or 5-30 depending on weight, not brand. I've posted Mobil data sheets pushing their goosed up group 2. I'd always thought there was far less, but whether it's semi-syn or conventional it all works out to close to fifty percent group 3. Unless it's Mobil. SN is really very stout.



Disagree... Others well more in the know shall we say it was less than thirty percent.

Which was likely part of the reason why Pennzoil Gold actually made it know it was 50 percent synthetic... And that was Dexos approved at that time. I highly doubt other regular oils that were just API SN had the same amount of full synthetic group 3 in them at that time like Pennzoil Gold did... It was there for sure. Just not where a Dexos approved oil level was needed. Was not needed for a basic API SN approval.



Back in ISLAC-4 days CP products used a minimum of 40% group III to make it to spec.






That was old Motorcraft.... Made by Conoco Phillips..

Everyone else made that older spec with no where near that amount of group 3 or they may not have used any group three.

Maybe Motorcraft was made that way because Ford motor company asked for it to be made well above and beyond the minimum API spec.

 

[ka9mnx]

Originally Posted by RDY4WAR
I know a lot of people into classic and muscle cars. They're all "thick" and "conventional" fans. The popular choice seems to be Castrol GTX 20w-50 in everything they run, including bone stock 150 hp 305 SBC. They always chant that you should never use synthetic oil in those older engines with the rationale that those engines were designed before synthetic oil and synthetic is "too thin" for their older engines. When I tell them their conventional oil already contains a decent amount of synthetic oil just to pass API standards, they look at me like I have no idea what I'm talking about.

Originally Posted by ka9mnx
HTHS would be more important if your goal is long engine life.


The longevity benefits of a higher HTHS are definitely known. I wonder if higher evaporation via the PCV would cause more valve deposits and reduce longevity in that way.

Those classic car guys are living in the past. In the '70's I ran the original (5w-20) Mobil1 in a '58 Ford I had with a 232ci 6 cylinder engine I rebuilt. Towed a loaded 12' U Haul trailer 3,000 miles through the mountains with no problems.

No. Valve deposits are a thing of the past now that leaded gas is gone and PFI is the norm. GDI, I guess, is a different story. Valve deposits doesn't contribute to engine longevity. Just poor running.