Gulfstream G600 review

Cujet,

I'm trying to read your "coffin corner" on the left display tape, but it's a bit hard to see. It looks like it's showing current speed at .88 Mach. With .92 Mach at the red line. And slightly above .84 Mach as minimum speed. (yellow line). Is it hard to maintain that in the middle at 51,000 ft. as fuel burns off? Or does the aircraft have auto throttles to perform that function?
 
who makes the displays, control system? Honeywell , Rockwell?....

"Honeywell Symmetry Flight Deck"
 

"Honeywell Symmetry Flight Deck"

Duh - thats what I get for surfing without glasses on...
 
Cujet,

I'm trying to read your "coffin corner" on the left display tape, but it's a bit hard to see. It looks like it's showing current speed at .88 Mach. With .92 Mach at the red line. And slightly above .84 Mach as minimum speed. (yellow line). Is it hard to maintain that in the middle at 51,000 ft. as fuel burns off? Or does the aircraft have auto throttles to perform that function?
Correct. The aircraft has active autothrottles. Strangely, they seem to be constantly moving in normal flight. The Fuel flow clearly changes with the throttle position, as does the N1 (fan) RPM. But the passengers in the back can't tell at all.

We've had our first failure, the RDR-4000M 3-D Weather Radar R/T (receiver-transmitter) decided to give up the ghost. The radar is fully integrated with synthetic vision, and the vertical profile. No more tilting the radar dish to see what's at your altitude, or above/below. The radar provides a complete 3D picture of what's ahead. I can't find a real pic online, but it's a really good 3D picture of what's ahead.

As expected, Gulfstream came out with a replacement unit, installed it and signed it off. All I had to do was make a call.
 
A few pics of the Pratt Whitney 815 test engine, after a lot of abuse and blade damage/rework. It's a beautiful piece of equipment in person, with exceptionally high quality workmanship and an intelligent layout. The fan is a 4 foot diameter one piece titanium part. You will notice that some of the blade tips have been ground off for testing of blend limits.

Each engine is about 16,000 pounds of thrust, and about 16,000 HP. The engine has 2HP turbines (drives the core engine) and a stunning 5 LP turbines that drive the fan and the first two stages of compression. The turbine section has active clearance control, as the case gets so hot, it grows, and the tip clearance becomes large. So Pratt pumps stage 2.5 (really stage 3) air around the turbine case in a very tightly controlled and managed way. It reduces the tip clearance and gives a 3% efficiency bump.


Vinr6Y1.jpg
XZt5N1N.jpg
Sr9RJVO.jpg
 
Last edited:
A few pics of the Pratt Whitney 815 test engine ...
Each engine is about 16,000 pounds of thrust, and about 16,000 HP.
Under what conditions do they measure that? With a jet engine, HP and thrust increase with the velocity of the air coming into the intake. With a turbofan, not so much. The real-world results would be a combination of the two depending on bypass ratio? Seems too complex to capture with a single number.
 
Under what conditions do they measure that? With a jet engine, HP and thrust increase with the velocity of the air coming into the intake. With a turbofan, not so much. The real-world results would be a combination of the two depending on bypass ratio? Seems too complex to capture with a single number.
The HP rating is in essence, the power required to drive the fan at take off power. It's good to know that thrust does not increase with forward velocity on these engines. In the past, the point of ram recovery was often designed to be about 160Kts, leading to an inlet design that did not create excessive low pressure during the start of the take off roll, and did not create excessive aerodynamic drag during high speed flight. Hence an increase in thrust as the plane rolled down the runway, picking up speed. Things are different today. The Fan RPM varies (increases) with forward velocity, and therefore inlet drag is a non issue throughout the flight envelope. For example, take off power is 93% N1, yet RPM does increase to as much as 100% in flight, overspeed is 104%.

You are correct, effective HP would be zero at the start of the take off roll, as the brakes are held and power is run to full thrust. (NOTE: this airplane will take off with brakes locked, so the example is not ideal). And power is then calculated, as speed increases as Power = F * V. As you might imagine, the calculations work out well. We can, for example, calculate how much work is done accelerating a mass to a certain speed (1HP being 550 foot pounds per second) and the number comes out to be far less than the HP required to drive the fan(s) when accelerating an airplane.

So, it's pretty clear that jet engines do not efficiently turn energy into acceleration. A car's drivetrain does a much better job, and a Telsa is darn efficient at it. However, things change markedly in flight and the modern turbofan is amazingly good in transonic flight. That's a discussion for another day.

Note2: Aero derivative gas turbine engines are used to drive generators in power plants and power ships. The HP rating becomes clear in these uses. Engines like the GE90 make about 115,000HP and the RR Trent about 70,000HP. The HP and thrust ratings are, strangely, very similar numbers.
 
I usually post this but ,,,Aircraft are amazing, could the high bypass engines be considered a ducted fan .
 
I usually post this but ,,,Aircraft are amazing, could the high bypass engines be considered a ducted fan .

Not really. Take a 16,000HP electric motor and drive that big fan and you have a ducted fan. The temperature at cruise altitude is about -60F and the Speed of Sound at that temperature is about 668mph. Note: the SoS is the limiting factor in duct velocity, as the stagnation point is reached when the airflow goes "sonic" in the duct.

Note2: We can cruise the G600 as fast as 615MPH.

So, you can imagine the difficultly pushing a big airframe, wings and tail, plus producing enough thrust to create 100,000+ pounds of wing lift with a duct discharge velocity just barely above the target cruising speed.

Note3: The heat of combustion, not only drives the 5 turbines in this case, but is VERY WELL mixed with fan air, to heat it up.

We can calculate the speed of sound, and therefore the duct discharge velocity in a modern jet engine, by taking into account the temperature. In our case, the 5.5 to 1 bypass ratio and the 1300 deg F core discharge temp result in a engine discharge velocity well over 900MPH and often closer to 1000mph.
 
What does the fan do then ? I kind of know the most basic of basics on how a turbine engine works .
 
What does the fan do then ? I kind of know the most basic of basics on how a turbine engine works .
The fan moves 5.5+ times more air than the "core" engine. But it's the heat of combustion MIXED with the fan air that makes the entire thing work.
 
Not really. Take a 16,000HP electric motor and drive that big fan and you have a ducted fan. The temperature at cruise altitude is about -60F and the Speed of Sound at that temperature is about 668mph. Note: the SoS is the limiting factor in duct velocity, as the stagnation point is reached when the airflow goes "sonic" in the duct.

Note2: We can cruise the G600 as fast as 615MPH.

So, you can imagine the difficultly pushing a big airframe, wings and tail, plus producing enough thrust to create 100,000+ pounds of wing lift with a duct discharge velocity just barely above the target cruising speed.

Note3: The heat of combustion, not only drives the 5 turbines in this case, but is VERY WELL mixed with fan air, to heat it up.

We can calculate the speed of sound, and therefore the duct discharge velocity in a modern jet engine, by taking into account the temperature. In our case, the 5.5 to 1 bypass ratio and the 1300 deg F core discharge temp result in a engine discharge velocity well over 900MPH and often closer to 1000mph.
So the increase in the temperature of the mix of bypass air and exhaust flowing out of the engine increases the speed of sound in that mix of gasses making it possible to have subsonic exhaust through the duct where it matters? Neat!
 
While on the subject of turbofans, it's interesting to see these pressures and temperatures in action. I have a video/pic somewhere of an EPR (engine pressure ratio, inlet vs outlet) of 0 and a level steady-state TAS (true airspeed) of 240-250Kts. What's actually happening is that the heat has expanded and accelerated the flow of air through the engine, despite no increase in pressure. Interestingly, the fuel burn was quite low at about 1000 pounds per hour per engine, so the overall range/economy was good considering the low altitude.

Back to the ducted fan thing, it would take some significant power to move that fan fast enough to push a Gulfstream at 250Kts Tas, at 4000 feet, absent the heat.
 
Back
Top