GL-4 Substitute?

Status
Not open for further replies.
D

Ducked

Joined
Oct 25, 2012
Messages
4,823
Location
Taiwan
Cars gearbox/transmission spec. is for 80W GL-3 or GL-4 gear oil.

So far I've only been able to find GL-5 here in Taiwan

Not urgent, but I'm thinking of just useing straight 40W motor oil (perhaps "spiked" with some GL-5) if I can't get the "right" stuff?

Any forseable issues?
 
More details would be nice?
Vehicle? Application? Any specific manufacturer specification?

You really need a straight 80w oil for a gearbox?
A actual MTF would provide a much cleaner shift

You can't put GL-5 into a 3/4 spec box. 5 isn't safe for brass/yellow metals in there.

If your gonna have to import the proper stuff, might as well go all out and do it in style
http://www.redlineoil.com/Products.aspx?pcid=7

More details will render a better answer.


TL:DR Yes, foreseeable issues
Don't do that just yet
 
Try your nearest dealership. They should have the OEM specd manual transmission fluid for your car.
 
I know of a manual transmission builder that uses Mobil 1 15w-50 in place of GL-4 spec gear oil and has been doing so for quite some time.

Personally, I use Amsoil MTG for my GL-4 application.
 
The specs and application are in the post.

Its a Daihatsu Skywing, 1986. I suppose I thought that info wouldn't be very meaningful/relevant for a primarily US readership.

FWD 993cc 3-cyl engine. Separate Engine and transmission/gearbox lubrication (obviously) i.e. Not like a BMC Mini

Its Red
smile.gif
 
My nearest dealership will probably laugh at me. Last time I went there (looking for an exhaust mounting) they gave me the standard "Meio, too old" brush-off without actually checking what I was after. They'd just seen the car.

I'd also bet money that a Taiwanese dealership won't have a clue as to the difference between GL-4 and GL-5

I'd be very reluctant to give them any money under anycircumstances

The one in the next city might be better. since the previous owners had the car serviced there.
 
Thanks. I'll try that. I'd only tried CPC to date and the only had GL-5. Failing that I'll check out the Redline option. Thanks all.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: michaelluscher



TL:DR Yes, foreseeable issues
Don't do that just yet


OK, I won't

TL:DR? More details would be nice.
 
Originally Posted By: michaelluscher

You can't put GL-5 into a 3/4 spec box. 5 isn't safe for brass/yellow metals in there.


Hence the search for GL-4.

However, I've read somewhere that the difference is quantitative rather than qualitative, i.e. GL-5 typically has about twice the EP additive level as GL-4, so my reasoning was if I "spiked" motor oil with a bit of GL-5 (they sell small tubes for scooter final drives) I could raise the EP level of the motor oil without bringing it into the danger zone.

Flaws I can see are (a) I can't be sure there aren't qualitative differences (b) I won't know the additive level of the motor oil, unless I use Mobil Delvac MX, which I've seen a ZDDP level for, though I don't know for sure that its current, and I'd prefer to avoid a multigrade.

Since I've also read er...somewhere...that most motor oils meet GL-4 specs anyway, it might be safer just to use unadulterated motor oil, if I can't get the "right" stuff.
 
Originally Posted By: michaelluscher
You can't put GL-5 into a 3/4 spec box. 5 isn't safe for brass/yellow metals in there.


I've been doing it for many years with no issues. I would suspect that anyone who gets their MTF refilled at a quickie lube is getting some sort of GL5 gear oil, too.
 
Ah. That's 2nd gen Charade mechanically

...some of us know
grin.gif


If you want to play god with a cocktail, go right ahead. We've got plenty of people round here that do that successfully.

That being said, a top notch MTF from RedLine wouldn't be that difficult to procure, gives mild reassurance (IMO), and is known for a significant improvement in shift quality and feel.
 
Most new car auto dealers have GL4 gear oils. Source some GL4 manual transmission 75w85 or 75w90 from a Nissan Hyundai Kia Mitsubishi GM Ford or Chrysler... dealership.

European vehicle delaerships also have a good selection of GL4 MT gear oil... BMW Audi VW Peugeot Renault Fiat....

10w40 motorcycle oil and 15w40 diesel engine oil are also a pretty good MT fluid substitute. Marine and industrial GL4 gearbox lubricants are another option.
 
Originally Posted By: Greasymechtech
Most new car auto dealers have GL4 gear oils. Source some GL4 manual transmission 75w85 or 75w90 from a Nissan Hyundai Kia Mitsubishi GM Ford or Chrysler... dealership.

European vehicle delaerships also have a good selection of GL4 MT gear oil... BMW Audi VW Peugeot Renault Fiat....

10w40 motorcycle oil and 15w40 diesel engine oil are also a pretty good MT fluid substitute. Marine and industrial GL4 gearbox lubricants are another option.





I'll give it a try. Taiwan is difficult though. I was in a Ford main dealership a couple of weeks ago after bearing grease. Showed them a printout of the motorcraft premium long life stuff, and armed with that they found a Castrol website in Chinese,so they knew what I was talking about, but I still got the old meio. I assume they must have some, of some kind, but no one buys it so they aren't set up for retail.
 
Originally Posted By: michaelluscher
Ah. That's 2nd gen Charade mechanically

...some of us know
grin.gif




Ok, I'm impressed.

Seems to be a mix of G10, G11 and maybe some G100 bits, which can be slightly confusing.

Originally Posted By: michaelluscher


If you want to play god with a cocktail, go right ahead. We've got plenty of people round here that do that successfully.


Play GOD? That analogy really only works if a major oil blender is your monotheistic deity.

Still, we are on BITOG, I suppose....

And God Bob looked on his creation and saw that it was Good. should be ok, no real way to tell until I've put a few miles on it, and by then something else will probably have killed it.
Originally Posted By: michaelluscher

That being said, a top notch MTF from RedLine wouldn't be that difficult to procure, gives mild reassurance (IMO), and is known for a significant improvement in shift quality and feel.


OK, I'll try and get hold of some. What do they put in it that makes it superior?
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Ducked
Originally Posted By: michaelluscher
Ah. That's 2nd gen Charade mechanically

...some of us know
grin.gif




Ok, I'm impressed.

Seems to be a mix of G10, G11 and maybe some G100 bits, which can be slightly confusing.

Originally Posted By: michaelluscher


If you want to play god with a cocktail, go right ahead. We've got plenty of people round here that do that successfully.


Play GOD? That analogy really only works if a major oil blender is your monotheistic deity.

Still, we are on BITOG, I suppose....

And God Bob looked on his creation and saw that it was Good. should be ok, no real way to tell until I've put a few miles on it, and by then something else will probably have killed it.
Originally Posted By: michaelluscher

That being said, a top notch MTF from RedLine wouldn't be that difficult to procure, gives mild reassurance (IMO), and is known for a significant improvement in shift quality and feel.


OK, I'll try and get hold of some. What do they put in it that makes it superior?



Everything about redline makes it superior! The base stock, the add pack, the shear stability, the temperature related viscosity, it's an expensive boutique product that does not compromise!
A 50/50 mix of MT90 and MTL in my gearbox has it shifting smoother than ever regardless of temperature, it's quieter, it no longer crunches between 1st and 2nd when driving 'emthusiastically'..
IME it's better than the OE fluid, it's better than Millers Nano fluid, It's better than any parts store own brand fluid, redline make the goodness
smile.gif
 
Quote:
However, I've read somewhere that the difference is quantitative rather than qualitative, i.e. GL-5 typically has about twice the EP additive level as GL-4, so my reasoning was if I "spiked" motor oil with a bit of GL-5 (they sell small tubes for scooter final drives) I could raise the EP level of the motor oil without bringing it into the danger zone.

Flaws I can see are (a) I can't be sure there aren't qualitative differences (b) I won't know the additive level of the motor oil, unless I use Mobil Delvac MX, which I've seen a ZDDP level for, though I don't know for sure that its current, and I'd prefer to avoid a multigrade.

Since I've also read er...somewhere...that most motor oils meet GL-4 specs anyway, it might be safer just to use unadulterated motor oil, if I can't get the "right" stuff.


I don't know where you read that but hopefully not here.

Use motor oil only as a last resort.

The three very important characteristics of MTL are:

1. Proper viscosity for operating temps and HP
2. GL-4 additive package for anti-wear protection
3. proper friction modification chemistry for shifter and synchro assembly
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
Quote:
However, I've read somewhere that the difference is quantitative rather than qualitative....

Since I've also read er...somewhere...that most motor oils meet GL-4 specs anyway, it might be safer just to use unadulterated motor oil, if I can't get the "right" stuff.


I don't know where you read that but hopefully not here.



I THINK this was probably the source, though it may have been somewhere/someone else repeating some of the content

http://www.widman.biz/uploads/Transaxle_oil.pdf
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

T
  • Locked
70W-80 GL-5 MTF for Subarus
Replies
12
Views
833
MolaKule
N
Substitute Motul Gear 300 75W-90 for BMW G1 75W85?
Replies
1
Views
639
oldhp
A
Mazda Hypoid SG1 Alternative
Replies
8
Views
7K
danbfree
MolaKule
  • Locked
Updated List of MTF's (both GL-4 and GL-5)
2
Replies
35
Views
10K
Ruturaj
ThatNavyGuy
2021 MX-5 Miata 6MT Gear Lube
2
Replies
22
Views
643
dfarr67
Back
Top