GC > 5w20 synth for '08 Dodge Ram

[opposite_locker]

Recently switched over to GC (Syntec 0w30) in my '08 Ram 4.7, and have noticed a few improvements over the previous oils used (M1 0w20 & PP 5w20). Cold valvetrain clatter is still there, as it was with M1 & PP...must be an inherent characteristic of this engine. But when warm, the valvetrain is considerably quieter with GC and the engine does idle a bit smoother. OCI with the M1 was 7500 mi, and 6k with the PP...am thinking will run the GC for 10k miles, with a filter change & topoff at 5k.

 

[hate2work]

You went from 20 weight oil to one of the thicker 30 weight oils, so you're bound to see some differences. Not sure I'd go 10k with it until the truck is broken in unless you do a UOA with it during the run. Most Dodges are noisy anyway, they should come with earplugs :)

 

[NHHEMI]

 Originally Posted By: opposite_locker

Recently switched over to GC (Syntec 0w30) in my '08 Ram 4.7, and have noticed a few improvements over the previous oils used (M1 0w20 & PP 5w20). Cold valvetrain clatter is still there, as it was with M1 & PP...must be an inherent characteristic of this engine. But when warm, the valvetrain is considerably quieter with GC and the engine does idle a bit smoother. OCI with the M1 was 7500 mi, and 6k with the PP...am thinking will run the GC for 10k miles, with a filter change & topoff at 5k.

I believe the Castrol Syntec 0W-30 is only API Service Level SL. You are supposed to be running an API Certified 5W-20 oil with the Starburst symbol which would require it to be API SM among other required factors. So not only are you running the wrong weight oil, plus the wrong certification(s), you now want to extend OCI's to 10K when 6K is the max Chrysler allows for? For whatever it is worth, from a former dealership parts and service guy( have worked both ), you are creating a recipe for hassle and out of pocket expense should you have any engine problems. You already have valvetrain noise, which BTW is not a super common 4.7L trait, and now you are going against 3 specific owner's manual requirements set for the by the car mfg. Just something to think about. I would try some different 5W-20's. You could get away with an 0W-20 in winter but at least make sure it meets all the spec's and change it on time. Good luck with the truck. BTW - how do you like the new 310HP 4.7? I had an 03 Ram w/ the 235 HP 4.7L and it was a decent enough engine but vastly underpowered for the heavy truck. Sold it for an 04 HEMI Ram which was much better. Now I have an 08 HEMI and love it as well.

 

[meep]

chrysler requires ms-6395 spec oil for warranty purposes.

 

[addyguy]

Good luck with your warranty, running a non-GF-4 API SL oil in and engine that wants SM GF-4 oil in it. Stick with what the man. specifies (AND the interval), and save the GC/10k OCI's ntil out of warranty.

 

[opposite_locker]

"Not sure I'd go 10k with it until the truck is broken in unless you do a UOA with it during the run." Truck is broken in...49k miles in the first year. "Just something to think about. I would try some different 5W-20's. You could get away with an 0W-20 in winter but at least make sure it meets all the spec's and change it on time. Good luck with the truck. BTW - how do you like the new 310HP 4.7? I had an 03 Ram w/ the 235 HP 4.7L and it was a decent enough engine but vastly underpowered for the heavy truck. Sold it for an 04 HEMI Ram which was much better. Now I have an 08 HEMI and love it as well." Chrysler actually specifies 5w30 in their engines everywhere outside the US. I can't find the link, but there is a TSB stating that the factory fill of 5w20 should be replaced with 5w30 at the first oil change and forward. Only in the US is the CAFE-influenced 20wt oil specified. I tried it for a while (48k miles) and was not thrilled with the results. Was not aware of teh SL/SM differences...what might they be? I do like the '08 4.7...it is more than adequate with a manual transmission. I would have preferred a Hemi, but it could only be had with an automatic transmission in a 1/2 ton. Perhaps you guys are right about the GC, but it seems to work so much better with my engine than any of the MS-6395 specced synthetic 5w20's that I've tried for the last 1yr/48k miles. And with as hard as I work my truck (heavy loads, high speeds, 100+ degrees in summer), I hate running a thinner oil that makes my engine run louder & rougher.

 

[440Magnum]

 Originally Posted By: opposite_locker

Chrysler actually specifies 5w30 in their engines everywhere outside the US. I can't find the link, but there is a TSB stating that the factory fill of 5w20 should be replaced with 5w30 at the first oil change and forward. Only in the US is the CAFE-influenced 20wt oil specified. I tried it for a while (48k miles) and was not thrilled with the results.

A TSB to that effect? Please do post it. My father just did his first oil change on his 08 Ram 1500 4.7 and stayed with 5w20. If it were mine, I'd run a 0w20, the Xw20 oils seem to be turning in some of the best UOAs these days, and many people report the opposite of what you're saying- ie, quieter valvetrain with the thinner oil. The thinner oil is also going to be a better coolant for the bottom end of the engine and undersides of the pistons, IMO because the flow rate will be higher than with a thicker oil. I don't think there's really that much difference between most 5w20s and 5w30s anyway- the 20s seem a bit on the thick side most of the time. I've only driven the truck once (maybe I should go visit Dad more often... ) but I was completely impressed with the power and torque from the 310-horse 4.7. It was amazing to me that they got another ~75 horsepower out of it, and that its now up to significantly more power than the old 5.9, though I think the torque peak is lower.

 

[wannafbody]

The chrysler warranty isn't worth the paper it's written on. Use whatever oil you want. 0W30 is a good choice for a truck.

 

[440Magnum]

 Originally Posted By: wannafbody

The chrysler warranty isn't worth the paper it's written on. Use whatever oil you want. 0W30 is a good choice for a truck.

Its just as good as a GM warranty, and less likely to be needed....

 

[lexus114]

I don`t know about that Bro! Chrysler`s have a lot of stupid problems,especially with their transmissions.

 

[440Magnum]

 Originally Posted By: lexus114

I don`t know about that Bro! Chrysler`s have a lot of stupid problems,especially with their transmissions.

HAD, During the 90s with ATF+3 (although our 90s Chrysler transmission lasted over 150k before a pump seal went out- internally it was still in good shape.) The rebuild went another 100k and was still going when we sold the car. Minivans were the worst, but lately Honda Odysseys have a far higher transmission failure rate than Dodge Caravans. The 545RFE in the OP's 08 Ram should be very reliable based on its performance since it came out around MY 2000 (originally as the 45RFE, first used in the Jeep Grand Cherokee).

 

[lexus114]

Well,at least you bought American. (which is more than I can say)

 

[meep]

 Originally Posted By: 440Magnum

 Originally Posted By: opposite_locker

Chrysler actually specifies 5w30 in their engines everywhere outside the US. I can't find the link, but there is a TSB stating that the factory fill of 5w20 should be replaced with 5w30 at the first oil change and forward. Only in the US is the CAFE-influenced 20wt oil specified. I tried it for a while (48k miles) and was not thrilled with the results.

A TSB to that effect? Please do post it. My father just did his first oil change on his 08 Ram 1500 4.7 and stayed with 5w20. If it were mine, I'd run a 0w20, the Xw20 oils seem to be turning in some of the best UOAs these days, and many people report the opposite of what you're saying- ie, quieter valvetrain with the thinner oil. The thinner oil is also going to be a better coolant for the bottom end of the engine and undersides of the pistons, IMO because the flow rate will be higher than with a thicker oil. I don't think there's really that much difference between most 5w20s and 5w30s anyway- the 20s seem a bit on the thick side most of the time.

echo that. I'd love to see the TSB and start running a 30wt in my 3.7. I get a good bit of valvetrain noise and would like to try a 30. M

 

[440Magnum]

 Originally Posted By: meep

 Originally Posted By: 440_Magnum

A TSB to that effect? Please do post it.

echo that. I'd love to see the TSB and start running a 30wt in my 3.7. I get a good bit of valvetrain noise and would like to try a 30. M

If its out of warranty, go ahead. As others have pointed out, the same engines are spec'd for Xw30 overseas, and both the 3.7 and 4.7 were spec'd for Xw30 in the US before a few years ago (2006 maybe?) Xw30 certainly will not harm them. From all I've read, ONLY the 5.7 with MDS really needs an Xw20, and it would probably be just fine on an Xw30 too, given that most Xw20s are on the heavy side for a 20. My point was that I really don't think an Xw30 is going to make anything sound better than Xw30, but I suppose it could. Mainly I would love to know exactly how any Chrysler TSB on the subject would be worded (maybe "in case of objectionable valvetrain noise?" use 5w30 or some similar disclaimer).

 

[opposite_locker]

I'll try to find the link, but remember that this pertains only to Chrysler vehicles outside the US. Chrysler does insist on only using 20wt in the US for non-SRT and diesel engines purely because CAFE states that if they want the slightly increased fuel economy figures of using a 20wt oil, they MUST specify that only this oil can be used. BTW, agree about their transmissions. We had an '89 Grand Caravan in which we replaced the trans at 80k with lifetime warranty from AAMCO. Now at 360k, the Caravan is still running on its 12th or 13th transmission (all free replacements from AAMCO)...needless to say they do not offer this warranty anymore. But to be fair, this was the first year of the Chrysler 4-spd auto, which was arguably the worst automatic transmission ever made. This is why I prefer vehicles with manual transmission...dont trust an automatic as far as I can throw it.

 

[SLCraig]

I agree.. MT for the win.. I will never buy an automatic car.. It writes a lot of cars off my list too.

 

[ADFD1]

 Originally Posted By: opposite_locker

I'll try to find the link, but remember that this pertains only to Chrysler vehicles outside the US. Chrysler does insist on only using 20wt in the US for non-SRT and diesel engines purely because CAFE states that if they want the slightly increased fuel economy figures of using a 20wt oil, they MUST specify that only this oil can be used.

I'd be interested in that link too. AD

 

[Audi Junkie]

I fully believe GC runs better then 20 weight. If you have a powerfull enough engine to overvome the extra drag from higher visc, it comes down to personal choice. In some urban settings, you can hear the engine noise much moreso than an open country setting, and the quieter, smoother engine is MUCH to be desired.

 

[opposite_locker]

I am having a hard time finding the link, but it was posted on this forum within the last year. Now that I think about it, the switching from FF 5w20 to 5w30 was not a TSB, but actually printed in the European owners manual, and someone here posted a link to a pdf copy of the manual. On another note, after 1000 miles on GC, it appears to be working even better! Engine has become even quieter, and I somehow managed to get 18mpg this weekend on a trip to Lake Tahoe. I have never ever (in 50k miles of 20wt synthetic oil) seen more than 17mpg over a full tank, and usually get closer to 14mpg. Doesn't make sense that I can get better mileage with a thicker oil, unless there just happens to be alot less friction (which I find hard to believe).

 

[ADFD1]

It is also possible the increased MPG is coming from the engine being broken in. It took almost 8000 miles for dads new Jeep to start getting better mpg. I think the oil difference stated in the OM is an availability issue, in other parts of the world. I spoke with a buddy of mine over the weekend who is a SM at a Jeep dealership. He searched their data base for me, there is no TSB about the oil that you've mentioned (that he could find). However he said it is common in other parts of the world to run different grades of oil because of availability. The engines are doing well on the 20 grade oils. He's been investigating the 20 grade oils for me for a while now. He also mentioned that there are some people who come into the service dept asking for oils not spec'd. He explained thinner oils are used for better mpg and, it has to do with piston and ring clearances than anything else. The engines are "tighter" in those areas then in some of the older engines, and the oil spec'd works well with the tighter engines. HOWEVER a 30 won't hurt the engine in his opinion. BTW the thick vs thin debate has been beaten to death here. I'm not looking to restart it, just sharing what I've heard. If you're getting better results with 0W30 GC use it, just be sure if you have an issue that is oil related dump it and fill with a Chrysler approved 5W20. AD