Originally Posted By: dnewton3
Originally Posted By: Stelth
Oh my, I did not expect this from you. Your leaf springs on your truck certainly are "springy", they're made of spring steel! If you are going to consider a stamped mild steel spacer to be a spring, then the can and filter element must also be springs, since they all work together to hold the whole works together under tension. If you take the coil spring that is in some filters, and set an anvil on it, when you remove the anvil, it returns to its former shape (possibly somewhat distorted depending on the weight of the anvil). If you take the "leaf spring" spacer from a Fram or other filter that uses it, and set an anvil on it, it will smash, and when the anvil is removed, it will stay smashed.
Also, the element isn't wavy because of spring pressure. The pressure, as it is, is directed from the can through the stamped spacer to the steel element tube, and from there to the base plate. The element itself does not experience this pressure.
Also, if that definition of spring applies, then any bolt that is torqued to a certain value is also a spring, because the "stretch" of the bolt applies pressure to the part being bolted, or to the gasket. But the fact remains that
bolts are not springs. And neither is the stamped spacer in a filter.
Getting into the game of semantics, eh?
Any metal that has resilience where it can travel from and return to a known location could be a "spring". Yes - some headbolts have "stretch" that makes them retain their clamping force, as opposed to TTY bolts which are stretched past their yield return point. Yes - some bolts act as minature springs.
Call it a spacer if you want. But that piece of metal in the OCOD provides not just a "space", but also a compressive force that will self-correct for movement; it has resilience that will return to some location after relieved. If it were only a spacer, providing only a fixed postional attriubute, then I should be able to substitute any manner of other inanimate object for it. I could put in a puck of solid steel, or other such solid piece, and in your estimation, it would perform the same function. But I profess that the "wings" (for a lack of a better term") are what provide a spring effect. And clearly I'm not the only one that sees it that way. In fact, if it were only a spacer, then the entire filter unit and each component would have to be made to exact dimensions. No, make that EXACT KNAT's-BOOTY dimensions. Because if there were ANY tolerance stack up in a negative dimension, then the filter would permanently leak around some component somewhere. If that "spacer" didn't "spring", then any dimensional loss would result in an internal path leak. If it were only a spacer, then even the dimensional growth of the filter can with heat/cool cycles would make it "loose" enough that the "spacer" would promote a leak.
Still think it's not a spring? Then let me ask you this ... Why is it that some companies use a coil spring in that very same location to accomplish that very same task? If Fram and others including Motorcraft and Purolator use a "leaf spacer" because there is no need for a spring, then why do other companies use a "coil spring" and not a "coil spacer"? If the "leaf spring" is only a spacer, then why do others use "springs" where only a "spacer" is needed? Your logic fails miserably here.
BTW - I'm not standing along on an island when I call that (stamped metal thingy) a "spring":
http://www.fleetfilter.com/comparison-motorcraft-filter.html
http://www.fleetfilter.com/comparison-purolator-filter.html
So, "Yes" - I consider some pieces of stamped mild steel to be "springs" depending upon their application. They are used in that manner as inexpensive tools all the time, from childrens toys, to musical instruments, to electronic switches, pressure switches, bolt latch return devices, etc, etc. Ever see a reed-valve for two-stroke induction intack tracks? Some are made of a resilient fiber-infused nylon, and some are made from (hold your breath ....) stamped mild metal.
You may not acknowledge a resilient stamped steel piece as a "spring" but much of the rest of the advanced world does. Even when used in an oil filter.
This is silly ...
But then, this is BITOG after all ...
Not so much semantics, Dave, but the idea that words have meanings. The spacers that are in my recent thread that shows 3 filters cut open aren't springy. If you press on them, they tend to bend. Also, the ends of the spacers are pressed against the sides of the can, which doesn't allow for lateral movement, unless the can distorts, in which case, by your definition, the can is also a spring. The ADBV is pressed between the element and the baseplate, so is it also a spring?
I'm not an expert on reed valves, but I think the ones that are made of steel are generally made of tempered steel, not mild steel.
So my logic fails because some companies make filters that use a coil spring, and some don't? There's no room for accomplishing the same thing in a different way? BTW, if the can expands when heated, the center tube of the filter, if it's made of steel, and the steel spacer also expand. Looks to me like maybe the manufacturers using the coil spring maybe have looser tolerances. The coil spring could make up for that.
The fact that a guy over at Fleet Filter calls it a spring is irrelevant. Now, if the manufacturers call it a leaf spring, well, I guess I could call it that, too, although I would still believe it to be a misnomer.
I would point out that on the Fram, there is also some "crush" of the part of the element that engages the spacer and the base and/or adbv. That alone could make up for some tolerances. I also think that there is probably a little bit of leakage on any filter that uses a metal-to-metal fit between the spacer and the element. How much depends, as you point out, on tolerances. But probably very little.
Anyway, if you want to call it a spring, go ahead. I'll call it a spacer. However, if you go to the hardware store and ask for some 1/4-20 springs (see bolts above), and nuts, you may run into a communication, or "semantic" problem.
