Ford vs. GM Reliability

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I think if you want to see an unbiased snapshot of what Ford can do with reliablilty when they get serious about it, then you need look no farther than Jaguar. I have owned Jags across the entire time span of Ford's ownership of the company.

When they bought Jaguar, it was only a half joke that you needed two of them so you would always have one that ran.

For the last seven or eight years, Jaguar has been at the top or very near to the top in reliability. They are extremely complex cars so that speaks volumes about Ford's talent in this regard.

I am not sure I would have the confidence to buy another one now that Ford has sold the marque.

edit: my memory is bad today. The '93 Explorer blew out the clutch throw out bearing in our driveway at about 100K miles or so. That is a big repair - the tranny has to come out.
 
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Having owned both, but presently neither, I'll try to be objective about this one.

Not going back 40 years, our experience was that Fords made through the '90s and up until about 6-7 years ago were more difficult to service, but were overall only slightly more reliable than GMs. Ford had one stretch in the mid 90s where it was obvious the engineers had completely forgotten the mechanics in design. But both were equally annoying, all things considered. So, pick your poison.

Both seem to have improved of late, perhaps Ford a little more due to the parts reduction program that Mulally has fostered. But neither yet measures up to the best Japanese models for reliability (and I don't own any of those presently, either). Durability is a whole different beast. There, I think Europeans generally still set the benchmarks.
 
Originally Posted By: Tundraz
Fords appears to be b etter because all thier good cars and SUV's are actually Mazdas, the Fusion and Mercury variant is nothing but a Mazda 6 , the CX7 and CX9 are actually Mazdas.


What?

The F-150; Ford's best selling vehicle has no roots in Mazda. Neither do the Super Duty trucks, Explorer, Expedition, NOR THE MUSTANG.

Quote:
The Mazda 6 and the Ford Mustang is made on the same assembly line, why is the Mazda a high quality vehicle and the Fords junk? beats me , you couldnt pay me to drive a Ford.
Ford cut too many corners, anything to save a penny as long as the customer is stuck with the headaches.


Coming from a family that has owned more Fords than you probably have had years in your life, I find the above hilarious.

The Mustang and Mazda 6 are produced in the same facility. It does not mean they have a lot in common.

The S197 Mustangs have been fantastic cars.

With a name like "Tundraz", it's pretty easy to see where your bias lies though......

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My wife had a Lincoln Continental,the power steering pump were always failing like once a month, upon close examination i realize that the pump were mostly made of plastic, plastic, can you believe that? every couple of week the vibration from the drive train would crack the pump.
Tundraz


The built-in reservoir on basically ALL older Ford PS pumps are made of plastic. The only METAL ones I know of are on much older GM's.

It doesn't stop them from lasting. Maybe you were putting the wrong fluid in it, since I've had FIVE of them in various vehicles that have lasted 300,000+Km......... And still going.
 
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Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL


The built-in reservoir on basically ALL older Ford PS pumps are made of plastic.


Well . . . my '68 and '73 Fords had metal reservoirs. And they churned Type F. I don't remember what our '84 Ford had. But I know what you mean.
 
Ford did sell Jaguar to a company in India.Jaguars are a big pos and are very complicated.Their EFI system uses no fuel pressure regualator and use two fuel pumps instead,a primary and a secondary.Plus they have big time electrical problems and the parts are hard to get which are very expensive.Any aftermarket scan tools will not read the codes on a Jaguar,to the dealer.The only aftermarket scan tool that will read the codes is the Snap On Modis.
 
Originally Posted By: Volvohead
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL


The built-in reservoir on basically ALL older Ford PS pumps are made of plastic.


Well . . . my '68 and '73 Fords had metal reservoirs. And they churned Type F. I don't remember what our '84 Ford had. But I know what you mean.


Sorry, I was sort of thinking EEC-IV to present-era vehicles. Any of my PERSONAL vehicles, due to my age, have all been 80's and up, save my '74 Cutlass (yes, I owned a GM!, two actually) and they have all had the plastic reservoirs on the PS pumps. They have all spec'd Mercon as well.
 
Originally Posted By: wafrederick1
Ford did sell Jaguar to a company in India.Jaguars are a big pos and are very complicated.Their EFI system uses no fuel pressure regualator and use two fuel pumps instead,a primary and a secondary.Plus they have big time electrical problems and the parts are hard to get which are very expensive.Any aftermarket scan tools will not read the codes on a Jaguar,to the dealer.The only aftermarket scan tool that will read the codes is the Snap On Modis.


Most newer GM vehicles run a returnless fuel pump setup that involves the PUMP regulating the pressure at the rails...... Are they junk too?
 
I know an used car dealer that also buys classic cars even owned by celebrities.He said he would never buy another Jaguar,nothing but problems with them and put money into them.Jaguars are low graded cars often called Junkguars.Look under the hoods of late 1970s Jaguars,the original drive drivetrain replaced with a small block Chevy drivetrain and there are kits out there to do this.The engines were junk which blew up.My father's friend Rich works on them and I hear about it
 
On the Ford P/S pumps, my '72 Torino has a steel reservoir. In fact there is probably next to no plastic under the hood other than the distributor cap, plastic overflow and windshield washer containers. My old '88 Merc Grand Marquis had the plastic reservior, and with 300K kms on it when I sold it, there were no P/S problems ever.

As for the comment about all cars from the 1970's being junk, that is truly misinformed. Yes, 1970's cars had quality control issues, particularly with steel quality and crude emmisions controls. And obviously there were terrible cars like the Vega, but there were a lot of great reliable cars. All of the 1970's vehicles my family owned were very reliable cars (one exception: our 1979 Fairmont), and two of them are still on the road today, my '72 Torino, and my brother's 1976 Malibu - which are in near showroom condition. GM, Ford and Chrysler did build decent quality cars in the 1970's, but they were the big old RWD, V8 cars, not the POS compacts. In my opinion, during the 1980's the big three pumped out some of it's worst cars.
 
Originally Posted By: milwaukee
I think Ford is the best in the business right now. I would not be shocked if Ford keeps climbing and is soon the maker others wish to be.



+1 I believe they will eclipse Toyota.
 
Ford Triton engines have this problem bigtime: Blowing out spark plugs.This is one reason why to change plugs on these before 100,000 miles.Ford charges $300.00 a hole to fix this.Ford also has problems with the GEM modules going out,the sealing of the windshield area leaks and ruins the GEM Module.The fix for this is to remove the windsheild and resealing it also replacing the GEM module.The 1.9 sohc in the Focuses and Escorts lasts up to 150,000 miles,wore out and have to put a set of rings and pistons in them.Did this to a 2002 Ford Focus for another dealer with 146,000 miles on it and most yards get calls for this engine.
 
Aww [censored], back about 6-7 years ago the U-pull-it yards were loaded with 1.9L Escorts with the engine still in 'em. Might still be that way but I haven't gone to a U-pull-it in that long.

Also..the Focus never had a 1.9L in it.
 
Originally Posted By: brianl703
Aww [censored], back about 6-7 years ago the U-pull-it yards were loaded with 1.9L Escorts with the engine still in 'em. Might still be that way but I haven't gone to a U-pull-it in that long.

Also..the Focus never had a 1.9L in it.




He lives in a magical land of make believe.
 
Do I take the yellow brick road to get there? I have been looking for this place, I hear it's wonderful.
grin2.gif
 
Some Ford Focuses did have 1.9s and this 2002 Ford Focus I worked putting in pistons and rings in had a 1.9,vin P instead of the Zetec engine.One local yard in my area,Fodrocy's does get call calls for them
 
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