The problem is junk parts. I am guessing the engineer didn't tell the manufacturer to make cheap parts. Someone didn't follow the correct procedures to make the parts.Maybe its time to dump all the fancy computer design programs, and go find some old retired engineer in his mid 80's that still knows how to use use a slide rule to show them all how to fix the problem.
Ford 7.3L Godzilla cam issue; Tell me what you think
- Thread starter Spike555
- Start date
- Status
dnewton3
Staff member
OK - this is a 2020 model with 112k miles on it. I'm not surprised the cam/lifter issues exists in this particular vehicle; the first year of the gas 7.3L is known for these problems. However, I also believe it's limited to that first production year, no?
OEM, I couldn't find a aftermarket cam for it.
dnewton3
Staff member
The 6.2L came out in 2010 in the F150 (for one year). Then came along in the SDs in 2011 I think. Other than some early valve spring issues, the 6.2L engine (known as the Hurricane) is a stalwart of reliability; ya can't hardly break them.
The Godzilla engine (gas 7.3L) came out in 2020, and now has a baby bro in the 6.8L (a smaller displacement version). Time will tell how these fare.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
*waiting for Uncle Tony to post a video about how the camshaft or lifters doesn't get oil and he's figured out this ever elusive culprit*
GM, FCA/Stellantis and Ford, all having camshaft/lifter problems with pushrod engines that they made for decade upon decade without an issue. Could it be a materials issue as a result of outsourcing? Nah, that couldn't possibly be it...
GM, FCA/Stellantis and Ford, all having camshaft/lifter problems with pushrod engines that they made for decade upon decade without an issue. Could it be a materials issue as a result of outsourcing? Nah, that couldn't possibly be it...
That's because you don't under stand how these things get used and abused.
I do not know what specific oil other use, I do know it is the cheapest full syn they can find.
Picture this, a 16,000lbs van with 5,000lbs of cargo, 6 days a week, tap the key and foot to the floor, 1/4 mile to the expressway, foot to the floor speed maxed out by the speed limiter.
It's 95F, exit expressway after an hour, neighborhood to neighborhood, house to house, hard on the brakes, hard on the throttle, all day long.
Emptying and filling the van at the same time.
Now the return trip after 8hrs of delivering without shutting the engine off or slowing down at all.
90 min drive back with stop and go traffic.
Leave it running while getting fuel, park it back at the building and go home, where out sits all night to do it all over again tomorrow.
In other words, extremely high crankcase temps and the cheap oil can't handle it.
Not all oils are created equal, cheap full syn is no better than a quality conventional oil.
I use diesel oil because diesels are hard on oil and the oil has to stand up to extended drain intervals, extended idle time, high bearing pressures, extremely high heat from the turbos, etc.
You must use the oil for your application, 99% of people use the oil the manufacture recommends. That oil is not suitable for what my business does and how we use our fleet.
I have one 6.2 that runs great when it starts, problem is getting it started, it floods all the time. No one can figure out why.
So far the 7.3 has been great, pulls great, MPG is right where it should be, only problems so far have been plugs and wires and this one cam.
The 6.8 V10 is a huge POS, I do not know about the new 6.8 yet.
I do not know if the cams are made in China or what, Ford knows of the issue but won't cover it, there isn't even a TSB on it.*waiting for Uncle Tony to post a video about how the camshaft or lifters doesn't get oil and he's figured out this ever elusive culprit*
GM, FCA/Stellantis and Ford, all having camshaft/lifter problems with pushrod engines that they made for decade upon decade without an issue. Could it be a materials issue as a result of outsourcing? Nah, that couldn't possibly be it...
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Wow. GM cams are billet, so they sometimes survive the lifter failure. FCA, usually the lifter packs it in first (roller/pin surface hardening failure) taking the camshaft with it, though we do have a recent example where the camshaft failed first (like your Ford). FCA is on lifter revision #7 now IIRC, and they swear they've fixed it this time. Doesn't help if it's the cam that goes first though :/
Sounds like everybody should be using billet bumpsticks like GM to avoid the camshaft side of the failure, but of course that would cost more money. GM lifter design is such that I don't believe there is any real fix for it, the FCA ones are a superior design, assuming they are properly hardened, not sure about the Ford ones.
There’s likely a lot of truth to that. The LS engines were a hugely successful middle finger to Ford’s 2V mod motors. When you don’t toss in cylinder deactivation, the cam-in-block, pushrod OHV engine is still a powerhouse and pretty simple…Maybe its time to dump all the fancy computer design programs, and go find some old retired engineer in his mid 80's that still knows how to use use a slide rule to show them all how to fix the problem.
I used to spend a long time chatting cams with Steve Tanzi, of longtime Erson fame and later Lunati. My brother had a Comp Cams cam fail from spalling, and Steve gave me a lesson on the “typical” induction hardening, which like nitriding, is a very thin, essentially surface treating. It essentially creates a camshaft like an M&M candy- a hard outer shell with a much softer center. The induction hardening, if damaged, can spall off and start the disintegration process.
Steve recommended for all performance cams to use flame hardening, which treats the entire material of the cam, so the whole thing is hard. It’s been many years, and some details are fuzzy, but I seem to remember he said the way to tell the two was the areas between the lobes- induction hardened had the dark gray/black areas between lobes, and the flame hardened had the coppery color between the lobes.
I do know the billet, flame hardened cam Steve ground for my brother’s street car in 2004 is still going strong- 242/[email protected]”, 113+0, .621” lift on both lobes with 1.7 rockers, so he must have known a thing or two
Well you have to pull the front cover, timing set and heads.
They pulled the engine from the van as it's easier that way, more room and only 10 bolt that bolt it to the transmission.
Once the cam is out I'll post pictures. They said one of the rockers was loose because the lifter was compressed.
Here is one of my oil filters cut open.
I switched to Baldwin/Hastings for the last year, I am now using Donaldson oil filters as I get a better price on them with my commercial account at a Freightliner dealer.
I buy them by the case.
I switched to Baldwin/Hastings for the last year, I am now using Donaldson oil filters as I get a better price on them with my commercial account at a Freightliner dealer.
I buy them by the case.
I’ve watched a couple of these Bosch 3410 cut opens and noticed some have a baseplate bypass and some have a dome end bypass. Have you seen any of them that have been ordered recently? I’m thinking the baseplate end bypass is the current model but it’s only speculation.
What are you experiencing with the 10r80?
- Status
