Federal EV tax credit set to end completely September 30th

[UncleDave]

Jupiter, FL to SAV airport 400 miles each way. Sometimes up and back in one day. (Gulfstream service center) or to Milford, PA 1354 miles, or to Burlington, (Williston) VT 1500 miles.

When I had to do this trip for work, time was super important. Not to mention I had to carry aircraft supplies, such as seats, power carts, golf cart tow conversion, tow the helicopter dolly and so on.

Done solo most of the time. Never stop for food, just bring along drinks and sandwiches. Occasional pit stops, I'm not one that needs frequent stops.

Just an FYI, even with the Model S long range spectacular first charge range (over 200 fast highway miles) it still takes 15 stops and 8 real world hours of charging, Jupiter to Williston, VT.

I ran one of the lucid air touring through ABRP from Jupiter to Williston and got 7 stops and 2:55 of charging using NACS and 2:36 on CCS.

There is no profile for the gravity which is the fastest charging longest legged EV SUV around.

Never gonna beat ice on the leg, but how close is it possible to get I wonder.

 

[Brons2]

Because I can do my 16 hr straight trips and stop once for gas and not worry a bit about it... plus here charging places are not plentiful if I needed to use any. They don't get plentiful for 50 to 60 miles away

I personally would not do that even if I had a gas car. I gotta get out every 2-3 hours for various reasons, some health related. Which works pretty well for owning an EV and taking it on a road trip.

 

[Brons2]

Tesla's current "slump" is just customers waiting for the updated Model Y.

Wdm? I see lots of the refresh MY around town.

 

[Brons2]

I just can’t with an electric car. I still associate them with the electric golf cart we had up north that required $1k in Trojan batteries every 5 years that was often towed home by a gas cart at days end. My neighbor who retired from ford bought into the ev scam and now has a $100k PLUS lightning that can’t tow his boat up to Lake Erie and back without needing a charge and goes even less further in freezing cold. He said and I quote “worst purchase I ever made”! Now he’s stuck with it cause no one wants it. I suppose if I lived in LA and spent all day in my car to drive 50 miles, maybe I’d consider one. Meanwhile I can get 550 miles out of a tank of gas and takes 7 minutes to recharge. I had a Kia freebie from Hertz in Pensacola and it scared the bejesus out of me. Nowhere to charge it, turn on the AC and it lost 40 miles, gun it to get on the expressway and it lost 25. No thanks.

There's a few of these guys on the Lightning forums, but most owners are extremely happy. I love mine.

 

[Brons2]

No, I’m on the most east of the east coast in NC but it would help when talking rates if you could post an actual bill. I have posted many.

Our rate 24 hours a day is 10 cents a kWh.
But we also need to know the actual payment because that is higher after taxes etc. so if I use very little electricity my cost with taxes etc can be 17 cents kWh actual payment.
However if I had an EV the cost to charge it would be closer to that 10 cents since some costs of the bill are fixed I think. Sales tax isn’t included.

So when talking rates on a national level we need the actual payment divided by kWh for the true cost. I consider my electric dirt cheap. Also my previous home in SC was however before that born raised and most my adult life on Long Island NY those rates were high yet still less than train wreck CA electric rates

Whenever I quote my electrical rates, it is for the final price inclusive of taxes and fees, divided by the number of KWH used.

 

[Brons2]

The thing someone driving an EV in Cali doesn't consider, is the Great White North. An EV in the summer vs an EV in the frozen tundra, is what discourages many people away from them.
BTW - watch how the mileage changes on your hybrid in the cold - it's pretty dramatic, but worth the cost over an EV's problems.

Frozen Tesla youtube channel - lots of real world temps at -30c and below.

 

[Brons2]

So we agree that everyone is biased.

And you admittedly don't drive long distances, charge for free at home, and literally live in the place on the earth with the most charging infrastructure. Yet your unbiased somehow?

Even if everyone else is wrong so what - its there money. I did not say I had range anxiety. I said that is what the surveys always spell out. You feel free to spend yours on EV's. It doesn't bother me at all. I am just happy I don't need to directly subsidize it anymore.

I live in deep red Texas and there's lots of charging infrastructure around.

Everyone is biased and people see what they want to see. Confirmation bias abounds. But anyway.

 

[Brons2]

My wife never drives more than 100 miles. An EV would be fine for her. But she still isn't getting one - because the ROI is not there and other reasons, like she would forget to plug it in. Or maybe once she decides she wants to go somewhere, and sitting around waiting for a charger to free up doesn't sound like a good time.

I go behind my wife and make sure it's plugged in, or if not, it's sufficiently charged for tomorrow's activities. I can do that on my smartwatch, which I wear to bed at night.

The counterpoint for an ICE advocate would be, well she can fill up anywhere in 5 minutes if she forgot to fill it up. Maybe that's a gap now, but it's one that's closing with the additional buildout of DCFC infrastructure and batteries that charge faster.

I will agree the ROI is not there if you are just replacing for the sake of replacing. The ROI is much better if you're going to replace your current vehicle regardless. That was the case for both my wife and I. She wanted a new vehicle regardless, so she got a new EV and she loves it. My transmission went out on my prior vehicle and replacing it would have cost more than the value of the vehicle. So I was on the hunt for something, and I got a deal I could not refuse on the Lightning.

 

[Brons2]

I've done it many times. FL to Burlington VT in a long range Model S. Any way you slice it, the trip took an additional day.

I've done a great many 'solo' FL to NorthEast trips for my job, during covid, twice per week! Mostly to PA, 1354 miles, 19 hours. 2 fuel stops in the Ecoboost 3.5L. 1 fuel stop in the 2.7L EB with 36g tank. The EV trips are on another level.

Even a model 3 trip Jupiter to Sav and back (400 miles each way) was an exercise in wasting time.

There are times EV's work great on long trips, I won't deny that. There are also times where it simply wastes time. Been there, done that.

My wife would never agree to this even in a gas car. It would flying or we would stay home.

 

[Brons2]

What are the city pairs?
Im super curious what the longest legged fastest charging electrics could do it in now.
The EV wont prevail, but what is the best in glass gap at this point I wonder?

You no doubt used some of the longest legged vehicles one could get for these trips, which is super convenient from a fueling perspective, and a great way to roll for sure.

Were fuel stops the only stops, no bio, food beverage, or stretching ?

Porsche Taycan was cannonballed from NY to LA in less than 40 hours by Out of Spec. I don't know what a gas car can do it in and I don't really care, I have no desire to go coast to coast in 40 hours.

 

[Torrid]

Wdm? I see lots of the refresh MY around town.

There was a bit of a delay on deliveries. I think last month was huge for deliveries. Actual orders still seemed delayed and I ended up switching to an inventory car to get it sooner. I haven’t seen too many in person yet, but I’ve seen a few. There’s definitely real demand for it.

 

[Torrid]

I go behind my wife and make sure it's plugged in, or if not, it's sufficiently charged for tomorrow's activities. I can do that on my smartwatch, which I wear to bed at night.

The counterpoint for an ICE advocate would be, well she can fill up anywhere in 5 minutes if she forgot to fill it up. Maybe that's a gap now, but it's one that's closing with the additional buildout of DCFC infrastructure and batteries that charge faster.

I will agree the ROI is not there if you are just replacing for the sake of replacing. The ROI is much better if you're going to replace your current vehicle regardless. That was the case for both my wife and I. She wanted a new vehicle regardless, so she got a new EV and she loves it. My transmission went out on my prior vehicle and replacing it would have cost more than the value of the vehicle. So I was on the hunt for something, and I got a deal I could not refuse on the Lightning.

As far as charging and my wife goes, that’s never been a problem. The plug is 3 feet from the port when her car was parked. She put off getting gas because she hated making the stop. That was my one gripe every time I had to do something to her car. The gas light was always on. Even then I can check the battery level on both cars now in the app. I hated the two gas stops a week myself, but I did it because I had to. EVs literally solved every gripe we had about car in general and that’s saying it as a car guy.

Don’t get me wrong, I love the drama of a great ICE performance car. I look at it like one of my automatic watches. They feel special and still do the every day job of the more modern methods, but there’s just a more to the point way to do the job more efficiently or accurately with less moving parts. I just don’t want to do that every day anymore. When I don’t want to do give it a second thought or make sure my watch is properly set, I just grab one of my G-Shocks and I love those too.

 

[KevinMalone]

Hmm... It's almost as if there are different strokes for different folks!

 

[Torrid]

Hmm... It's almost as if there are different strokes for different folks!

Right. It’s why I fail to see the point to come into THE EV SECTION to crap on EVs. Seems like wasted energy to me.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Right. It’s why I fail to see the point to come into THE EV SECTION to crap on EVs. Seems like wasted energy to me.

Because EVs are only for rich CA granola heads, right?
What's a poor boy to do?

 

[4WD]

Because EVs are only for rich CA granola heads, right?
What's a poor boy to do?

Have bacon & eggs ?

 

[GrumpyCat]

I foresee Fiat closing up shop in the US since it would be almost impossible to sell or lease the 500e for MSRP. The $7500 cap cost reduction is what helped them sell the very few cars that they did over the last year.

Some years ago they were offering $99/mo leases in CARB states. And auction lots were covered with 2 year old off-lease 500e going begging for $4900.

 

[GrumpyCat]

Whenever I quote my electrical rates, it is for the final price inclusive of taxes and fees, divided by the number of KWH used.

"Incremental Cost" is heavily emphasized in Industrial Engineering courses. An "availability fee" or other base subscription cost does not apply to an added user of the service because you were going to pay it anyway, for powering the home. While it seems "fair" to distribute the cost to the EV, the EV's added use of electricity only adds the cost of electricity the EV used.

Consider a truck hauling from City A to City B and running empty on return. What would one charge to break even adding a load from B to A? The answer is: whatever the added cost of wear, tear, and fuel from running empty to carrying the load.

 

[CapitalTruck]

Ain't gonna happen; the world runs on oil, and big oil is far too powerful.

You would think that would reduce the need for a subsidy.

 

[GrumpyCat]

Wdm? I see lots of the refresh MY around town.

"Slump" sales figures are for months prior, not today.