Fear of A.I

A General Societal Observation:
- Those who doubt climate science are called deniers and are degraded and debased, while those who believe in environmental doom are considered enlightened. Believe the industry experts we're told. Alarmism is considered necessary to move the message to the goal line.
- Those who doubt AI is a risk to humanity consider themselves grounded, but those who believe AI risks are real are told they live in a science fiction world. Ignore the industry experts we're told. Alarmism is considered heretical and foolish and there's no message worthy of panic.

The irony is palpable.
 
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A General Societal Observation:
- Those who doubt climate science are called deniers and are degraded and debased, while those who believe in environmental doom are considered enlightened. Believe the industry experts we're told. Alarmism is considered necessary to move the message to the goal line.
- Those who doubt AI is a risk to humanity consider themselves grounded, but those who believe AI risks are real are told they live in a science fiction world. Ignore the industry experts we're told. Alarmism is considered heretical and foolish and there's no message worthy of panic.

The irony is palpable.
I have no problem with people who doubt climate science, all science needs to be challenged, and its very unlikely that any specific climate model is going to be bang on. What've you've posted here before was not convincing to me that any of those people had any real current climate modelling knowledge.

I think what's kind of crazy is not looking at the relative risks in controlling CO2 levels to a reasonable level, and not.
If the earth was a person, right now we are drinking and smoking, and starting to notice our health declining, but we want to keep drinking and smoking and blame our health decline on something else.... Sure, our health decline could be from something else, but I would try cutting down on the drinking and smoking too, its the best course of action.
 
Whenever I read the output of AI it gives me the creeps a little because it's too perfect in the sense of being polite and humble. It's so nice I don't readily believe it's sincerity. Perhaps I've been conditioned by HAL who was also too nice and look how that turned out. 55 yrs ago, 2001 was a work of genius to predict the character of AI and how it would come across, or have they just copied HAL.

You will need to be a Charles Dickens fan to get this but AI reminds me of Uriah Heap in David Copperfield who was always making protestations of being humble. In reality he was one of the most evil characters Dickens ever created.
 
I don't think currently there is scientific proof that human is unique and has conscious, instead of being just a point in the middle of a gray line from black to white. I'm not saying it is not, just no scientific proof more than just a believe held by most human.
If you are not convinced that consciousness is real you probably don't have it. ;) Absence of proof is not proof of absence. Not everything can be measured. Consciousness appears to be a neurological phenomenon and in the human species it's more developed than in other species. Consciousness creates reality. Sound, color, smell, touch. Do you know there are people who can smell sound and/or color? This is a rare but not that-rare condition called synesthesia. If a tree falls in the woods and nobody is there to hear it does it make a sound? How could it make "sound" if the sound waves are not interpreted into what we experience as sound? Think of the double-slit experiment. Observation of a wavefunction causes the collapse of the wavefunction. Is it the detector that causes the collapse or the consciousness behind the detector? Do you deny superposition? Is Schrödinger's cat alive, dead, or is it both, in one or more places until you take a peek inside the box? Physics can be rather mystical at our level of understanding. How would we know if not the universe itself has conciousness? Schrödinger actually came up with a definition for consciousness.

“The total number of minds in the universe is one. In fact, consciousness is a singularity phasing within all beings.”

Yes, no, maybe.
 
I think there should be few firewalls to computer AI takeover.

Voting should never become electronic, even now its potentially to easy for results to be manipulated, without some AI superhacker program trying. Physical voting is a cheap expense for confidence in a functioning democracy.

Critical infrastructure control should be self contained, computers with air break with no wifi capability on site(I suspect most is now?)
Ahhh
Voting, I’ll agree there needs to be a paper trail but will admit, I don’t know anything about electronic process currently in use
 
If you are not convinced that consciousness is real you probably don't have it. ;) Absence of proof is not proof of absence. Not everything can be measured. Consciousness appears to be a neurological phenomenon and in the human species it's more developed than in other species. Consciousness creates reality. Sound, color, smell, touch. Do you know there are people who can smell sound and/or color? This is a rare but not that-rare condition called synesthesia. If a tree falls in the woods and nobody is there to hear it does it make a sound? How could it make "sound" if the sound waves are not interpreted into what we experience as sound? Think of the double-slit experiment. Observation of a wavefunction causes the collapse of the wavefunction. Is it the detector that causes the collapse or the consciousness behind the detector? Do you deny superposition? Is Schrödinger's cat alive, dead, or is it both, in one or more places until you take a peek inside the box? Physics can be rather mystical at our level of understanding. How would we know if not the universe itself has conciousness? Schrödinger actually came up with a definition for consciousness.

“The total number of minds in the universe is one. In fact, consciousness is a singularity phasing within all beings.”

Yes, no, maybe.
Uhhh, how am I supposed to argue with you when you define it that way.

Let's not get hung up on whether I have a conscious or not (you can call me an animal if you want to, it doesn't bother me), let's figure out how to tell if one day AI, if able to develop just like human based on simulation (we are all encoded as DNA when we were conceived), will have a conscious. How would you define it has a conscious or not? Is it about whether it is aware of itself? whether it function the same way? whether it follow the exact equation and formula?

How do we know when does one conscious turn into two (identical twin), or two turn into one (Human Chimera)?

https://www.insider.com/what-is-a-human-chimera-and-how-does-it-happen-2017-11

How do you define it without getting culture and religion, personal believe involved?
 
You don't need an AI to manipulate votes. As I said whatever could go wrong with AI has already gone wrong in human civilization with dictators and other nutjobs. We just need to treat any AI as such and be careful about granting each with too much power, whether they re human or AI.
Ahhh
Voting, I’ll agree there needs to be a paper trail but will admit, I don’t know anything about electronic process currently in use
 
Because no one here invented any of the operating systems that the tech world operates on
How do you know? The people who created key pieces of the modern world that surrounds us are ordinary people who have cars and wonder what oil to use, just like you. So they may be on BITOG. Don't assume that everyone has to be idiot technically just because they are acting ordinary and participating on this board. I have seen plenty of evidence that some people on this board know what they are talking about but would prefer to keep their anonymity.
 
How do you know? The people who created key pieces of the modern world that surrounds us are ordinary people who have cars and wonder what oil to use, just like you. So they may be on BITOG. Don't assume that everyone has to be idiot technically just because they are acting ordinary and participating on this board. I have seen plenty of evidence that some people on this board know what they are talking about but would prefer to keep their anonymity.
How do I know?
I’m taking a wild guess and I bet I’m right.

Your questions to me and responses are completely bizarre and I don’t care to respond anymore. Just the fact that you had the audacity to pretend or imply that I think anybody in here is an idiot is so far out there. Well, never mind. I’m sure everyone else understands what I’m saying.
 
Uhhh, how am I supposed to argue with you when you define it that way.

Let's not get hung up on whether I have a conscious or not (you can call me an animal if you want to, it doesn't bother me), let's figure out how to tell if one day AI, if able to develop just like human based on simulation (we are all encoded as DNA when we were conceived), will have a conscious. How would you define it has a conscious or not? Is it about whether it is aware of itself? whether it function the same way? whether it follow the exact equation and formula?

How do we know when does one conscious turn into two (identical twin), or two turn into one (Human Chimera)?

https://www.insider.com/what-is-a-human-chimera-and-how-does-it-happen-2017-11

How do you define it without getting culture and religion, personal believe involved?
Consciousness is the noun - not to be confused with conscience.

It's not about how I define consciousness but how it's generally defined. You may want to to do some reading and further thinking on the matter before questioning the existence of consciousness. Maybe start with Heidegger.
 
How do you define it without getting culture and religion, personal believe involved?
Consciousness is about the perception of ourselves and of the world around us. Since you bring up culture, religion, and personal belief, I am pretty sure you confuse the terms consciousness and conscience. Conscience is something that is born out of the things you list and it's what is behind morals and ethicism. The question with A.I. is will a conscious A.I. have a conscience? If it does, will it be as morally and ethically flawed as human beings? Will it be ruthless in its aspirations?
 
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Right now you still have that option, but it is quite possible that a few decades from now you'll need a self driving car in order to be on a public road. Human drivers will be deemed "unsafe" as we are too distracted and error prone. Over time, humans will slowly forget how to drive, kind of like many have already forgotten how to do math by hand. Heck, most people in the US don't know how to drive a manual already.
This is not a low of nature though, it all depends on the choices and decisions you make today.
That's why I said: vote and buy accordingly.
 
AI is nothing new. Yet because it's currently doing the rounds in mainstream and social media it has suddenly become a hot topic.
 
Consciousness is about the perception of ourselves and of the world around us. Since you bring up culture, religion, and personal belief, I am pretty sure you confuse the terms consciousness and conscience. Conscience is something that is born out of the things you list and it's what is behind morals and ethicism. The question with A.I. is will a conscious A.I. have a conscience? If it does, will it be as morally and ethically flawed as human beings? Will it be ruthless in its aspirations?
So basically it is just a mirror test. Passing the mirror test does not mean it behaves morally and ethically like a human in our society today.

A lot of human can have one but not the other due to brain damage or degeneration (medically, not as an adjective to describe corrupted people).
 
So basically it is just a mirror test.
What is a test? Are you asking if consciousness can be proven by self-recognition? If that's your question you are confusing consciousness with self-recognition. Self-awareness is an expression of consciousness through the recognition of being aware of one's consciousness. Self-recognition is a prerequisite for self-awareness. There is also self-consciousness. Self-consciousness is expressed in a being's awareness of having an individual identity that differs from that of others. Self-awareness is not innate but acquired. If you want to truly understand this you have to put in time and effort by properly studying the topic. The implications of all this are extremely important as far as A.I. goes.

Passing the mirror test does not mean it behaves morally and ethically like a human in our society today.
Nobody claims it does. And don't you see any problems with AI that has consciousness but has no conscience?
A lot of human can have one but not the other due to brain damage or degeneration (medically, not as an adjective to describe corrupted people).
I don't like playing the pronoun game. What is "one"?

Consciousness? Almost impossible to imagine that subjective consciousness is not ubiquitous all the way down to single-cell organisms because of subjective awareness (proven to exist by the reaction to a stimulus). Objective consciousness can be demonstrated in higher lifeforms that have objective self-awareness which is based on self-reflection.

Conscience? There is a wide range from highly developed to potentially none at all.

Self-awareness? It's not looking too good!
https://hbr.org/2018/01/what-self-awareness-really-is-and-how-to-cultivate-it
 
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So basically it is just a mirror test. Passing the mirror test does not mean it behaves morally and ethically like a human in our society today.

A lot of human can have one but not the other due to brain damage or degeneration (medically, not as an adjective to describe corrupted people).

On the flip side, there are species that cannot pass the mirror test but has some sort of moral or ethical understanding (conscience) or vise versa, as we all know how humans are when there's no legal or physical recourse for our actions.

For example, Humans can turn wild animals into domesticated pets or into pit fighters based on what we teach it. These morale and ethical standards are conditioned responses much like how humans are taught from a young age to respond to certain situations to align with the standards of our civilization. Eventually we might be able to do the same to AI and create it advanced enough that it develops its own conscious and maybe even its own conscience as it learns off it's human creators. I don't doubt we'll get to that point; humans tend to do push things so close to the extreme that the only we'll stop is when it's too late.
 
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