EPA says to finish E15 gasoline rule before summer

Messages
2,744
Location
San Antonio, TX
Originally Posted by BigD1
More gas stations around here during the last couple years have started selling non-ethanol. Price is jacked up compared to the common E-10. If big oil has a problem with the E-15 cutting into profits, lower the dang price on non-ethanol, and I will buy it.
Can't happen with all the existing legislation stacking the deck for E10 and on its way for E15, including RINs costs & trading as well as these volatility exemptions. USEPA granted E10 the 1 PSIA RVP waiver statting in 1988.
 
Messages
9,619
Location
Virginia
Originally Posted by wemay
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-epa-ethanol-idUSKCN1PJ2GX
Originally Posted by Reuters
President had promised U.S. farmers and biofuels producers that his administration would lift a long-time ban on summertime E15 sales to help boost demand for the corn-based fuel... The ban had been imposed over concerns that E15 contributes to smog in hot weather, though research has since shown that the 15 percent blend of fuel may not increase smog relative to the more common 10 percent blends that are sold year-round. E15 has been a hot-button issue between the oil and corn industries. Farmers and biofuel producers have been lobbying for an end to the E15 ban to bolster demand, but the oil industry has expressed opposition to any policy that would further raise ethanol's share of the fuel market.
US corn lobbyists vs Big Oil lobbyists.
Here's a idea that will never happen.... All Senate, House and President elections paid for by tax payers only.... Zero and I mean zero money from anyone else... And zero money from these lobbyist while in the nation's capital has well... This would put A LOT of people out of work in and around the DC area... So it will never happen. Though it needs to happen.
 
Messages
1,686
Location
Wisconsin
Originally Posted by Nyogtha
Originally Posted by BigD1
More gas stations around here during the last couple years have started selling non-ethanol. Price is jacked up compared to the common E-10. If big oil has a problem with the E-15 cutting into profits, lower the dang price on non-ethanol, and I will buy it.
Can't happen with all the existing legislation stacking the deck for E10 and on its way for E15, including RINs costs & trading as well as these volatility exemptions. USEPA granted E10 the 1 PSIA RVP waiver statting in 1988.
Makes me wonder how the e0 87 octane station only sells it at 7 cents a gallon more.
 
Messages
780
Location
E. Tennessee
Just my uninformed opinion: Mandate all cars in the USA must be E85 Flex-fuel capable (via the ECU adjusts for E0 to E85, 87 octane to 93+ octane for best performance/MPG and not emissions), drop all subsidies and let the market decide fully what they what to run. So enabled, a turbo car on E85 can be quite fun!
 
Last edited:
Messages
6,029
Location
Florida
Originally Posted by WhizkidTN
Just my uninformed opinion: Mandate all cars in the USA must be E85 Flex-fuel capable (via the ECU adjusts for E0 to E85, 87 octane to 93+ octane for best performance/MPG and not emissions), drop all subsidies and let the market decide fully what they what to run. So enabled, a turbo car on E85 can be quite fun!
What is mandating all vehicles be E85 going to do? For most of the country E85 is not economical vs E10. A few stations sold E20 around here. For a nickel less than E10. No thanks.
 
Messages
3,561
Location
Central Iowa
Originally Posted by Uphill_Both_Ways
Hooray for E15! It brings in tons more cash burning food than eating it.
Who would be eating it? Of the entire U.S. corn crop production, only 20% goes to the human food supply. Of the 80% left, roughly 40% goes to ethanol production, leaving a significant portion that never goes to ethanol production. Now true, there are many throughout the world who could benefit from getting more corn in the food supply, but that is a problem of their government not allowing them to have it, not because farmers don't want to sell it to them. Farmers will sell to whoever will give them the best price for their product and they could actually care less who uses it. I grew up farming and still live on the farm stead that I grew up on. It really doesn't matter to a farmer if the grain goes to ethanol, livestock, or human consumption. Just that there is a market for the stuff. So the farmer's lobby nonsense regarding ethanol is just that,.... nonsense.
 
Messages
2,744
Location
San Antonio, TX
Originally Posted by Rmay635703
Originally Posted by Nyogtha
Originally Posted by BigD1
More gas stations around here during the last couple years have started selling non-ethanol. Price is jacked up compared to the common E-10. If big oil has a problem with the E-15 cutting into profits, lower the dang price on non-ethanol, and I will buy it.
Can't happen with all the existing legislation stacking the deck for E10 and on its way for E15, including RINs costs & trading as well as these volatility exemptions. USEPA granted E10 the 1 PSIA RVP waiver statting in 1988.
Makes me wonder how the e0 87 octane station only sells it at 7 cents a gallon more.
You have figures that locally support a different differential during winter blending season? It clearly shows my post to be accurate.
 
Messages
780
Location
E. Tennessee
Originally Posted by hatt
Originally Posted by WhizkidTN
Just my uninformed opinion: Mandate all cars in the USA must be E85 Flex-fuel capable (via the ECU adjusts for E0 to E85, 87 octane to 93+ octane for best performance/MPG and not emissions), drop all subsidies and let the market decide fully what they what to run. So enabled, a turbo car on E85 can be quite fun!
What is mandating all vehicles be E85 going to do? For most of the country E85 is not economical vs E10. A few stations sold E20 around here. For a nickel less than E10. No thanks.
Not sure about where you live but here, E85 is about $0.50/gallon cheaper than E10 87 octane gas. If the engine is tuned for it (especially turbo engines), it can be a win for the driver. Either way, having a car/truck that "auto adjusts" allows me maximum flexibility with what fuel I want to run.
 
Last edited:
Messages
6,029
Location
Florida
Originally Posted by WhizkidTN
Originally Posted by hatt
Originally Posted by WhizkidTN
Just my uninformed opinion: Mandate all cars in the USA must be E85 Flex-fuel capable (via the ECU adjusts for E0 to E85, 87 octane to 93+ octane for best performance/MPG and not emissions), drop all subsidies and let the market decide fully what they what to run. So enabled, a turbo car on E85 can be quite fun!
What is mandating all vehicles be E85 going to do? For most of the country E85 is not economical vs E10. A few stations sold E20 around here. For a nickel less than E10. No thanks.
Not sure about where you live but here, E85 is about $0.50/gallon cheaper than E10 87 octane gas. If the engine is tuned for it (especially turbo engines), it can be a win for the driver. Either way, having a car/truck that "auto adjusts" allows me maximum flexibility with what fuel I want to run.
Where I live E85 is unavailable. I was in TX for a week and ran E85. It wasn't close to being cost effective. You're probably breaking even at $.50 off at current pricing, but having to fill up much more so it still has a downside. The performance aspect is a different discussion. Most vehicles aren't going to notice much difference.
 
Last edited:
Messages
1,843
Location
California
Originally Posted by oldhp
2017 Jeep Wrangler 3.6 manual says do not use E15 or E85. They must know it's junk..........
No, it means the 3.6 engine is not designed to run on any fuel with ethanol content above 10% (E10). Maybe you were being sarcastic laugh
Originally Posted by blupupher
Many vehicles say not to use more than e-10.
Yes, which makes me think that E10 will be around for a long time. But then I realize they may come up with some maximum distance required to travel for E10 when everything local is E15 or greater: "Sir, E10 is still available for your vehicle, it's only 20 miles from your [work/home] location." I can totally see this happening.
 
Messages
3,561
Location
Central Iowa
Originally Posted by DGXR
Originally Posted by oldhp
2017 Jeep Wrangler 3.6 manual says do not use E15 or E85. They must know it's junk..........
No, it means the 3.6 engine is not designed to run on any fuel with ethanol content above 10% (E10). Maybe you were being sarcastic laugh
Originally Posted by blupupher
Many vehicles say not to use more than e-10.
Yes, which makes me think that E10 will be around for a long time. But then I realize they may come up with some maximum distance required to travel for E10 when everything local is E15 or greater: "Sir, E10 is still available for your vehicle, it's only 20 miles from your [work/home] location." I can totally see this happening.
That is certainly a possibility worthy of concern. There would have to be some financial benefit from more E15 and limiting E10. There would have to be a real financial benefit for a station to eliminate E10 in its area and only have E15. Not sure that is possible to achieve. In my area, E0 is still more than readily available. I live rural, roughly 11 miles from 3 towns. One can get E0 at many locations within each of those towns. One convenience store chain, Casey's, which has the largest number of outlets in the state, prides itself on selling both E0 regular and E0 Premium. Just that name brand chain, there are almost a dozen of their stores between those 3 town I live between. And the primary reason they offer E0 regular and premium is that they have better profit margins from that fuel and people want to buy it. I am not even convinced that Casey's would even offer E15. Other stations near me do, but Casey's doesn't. I think some folks just let their minds run amok and see a boogeyman behind every tree.
 
Messages
3,993
Location
Chicagoland
Originally Posted by TiredTrucker
Originally Posted by DGXR
Originally Posted by oldhp
2017 Jeep Wrangler 3.6 manual says do not use E15 or E85. They must know it's junk..........
No, it means the 3.6 engine is not designed to run on any fuel with ethanol content above 10% (E10). Maybe you were being sarcastic laugh
Originally Posted by blupupher
Many vehicles say not to use more than e-10.
Yes, which makes me think that E10 will be around for a long time. But then I realize they may come up with some maximum distance required to travel for E10 when everything local is E15 or greater: "Sir, E10 is still available for your vehicle, it's only 20 miles from your [work/home] location." I can totally see this happening.
That is certainly a possibility worthy of concern. There would have to be some financial benefit from more E15 and limiting E10. There would have to be a real financial benefit for a station to eliminate E10 in its area and only have E15. Not sure that is possible to achieve. In my area, E0 is still more than readily available. I live rural, roughly 11 miles from 3 towns. One can get E0 at many locations within each of those towns. One convenience store chain, Casey's, which has the largest number of outlets in the state, prides itself on selling both E0 regular and E0 Premium. Just that name brand chain, there are almost a dozen of their stores between those 3 town I live between. And the primary reason they offer E0 regular and premium is that they have better profit margins from that fuel and people want to buy it. I am not even convinced that Casey's would even offer E15. Other stations near me do, but Casey's doesn't. I think some folks just let their minds run amok and see a boogeyman behind every tree.
There's a Casey's near me that sells e15, but the one in my hometown does not. Very hit or miss.
 
Messages
4,251
Location
Kansas
We got e0 in 87&91,87e10,e15 and e85. E10 or Pure 87/91 are used almost religiously. The farmers won't use the high ethanol in their own tractors or mowers. The old hot rod/motorcycle guys use 91 pure and 87 pure has a good following from people just not wanting to be told what they have to buy. The 87e0 started well during the polar vortex when it was minus ten the other day. I would like to see pure, e5 and maybe e30-50 at the most.
 
Messages
368
Location
Boise, Idaho
I looked up both my vehicles. Both won't tolerate the proposed E15. If that becomes the defacto fuel I will have to switch both my vehicles to E0. That will put a dent in my budget. I guess engine repairs would too if I used E15. No thanks EPA. I don't trust your engineers say so. I am going by what my manufacturer says about what I can use safely in my vehicles.
 
Messages
586
Location
Raleigh NC
Originally Posted by MRtv
I looked up both my vehicles. Both won't tolerate the proposed E15. If that becomes the defacto fuel I will have to switch both my vehicles to E0.
Don't worry, this is not going to happen any time soon.
 
Messages
4,130
Location
Central Virginia
Originally Posted by bbhero
Originally Posted by wemay
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-epa-ethanol-idUSKCN1PJ2GX
Originally Posted by Reuters
President had promised U.S. farmers and biofuels producers that his administration would lift a long-time ban on summertime E15 sales to help boost demand for the corn-based fuel... The ban had been imposed over concerns that E15 contributes to smog in hot weather, though research has since shown that the 15 percent blend of fuel may not increase smog relative to the more common 10 percent blends that are sold year-round. E15 has been a hot-button issue between the oil and corn industries. Farmers and biofuel producers have been lobbying for an end to the E15 ban to bolster demand, but the oil industry has expressed opposition to any policy that would further raise ethanol's share of the fuel market.
US corn lobbyists vs Big Oil lobbyists.
Here's a idea that will never happen.... All Senate, House and President elections paid for by tax payers only.... Zero and I mean zero money from anyone else... And zero money from these lobbyist while in the nation's capital has well... This would put A LOT of people out of work in and around the DC area... So it will never happen. Though it needs to happen.
Totally agree with that with basically legal bribery. That being said, we have separate pumps for E-15 around here (not all stations have it). I like it because my 2000 Mustang seems to run better on it although there is a 1 mpg hit on mileage. Supposedly cars 2001 and newer can use it, but I'm living on the edge by using it in my Y2K LOL.
 
Messages
130
Location
AR
Bring the bountiful harvest unto us so our chariots, of renewable plastics, may bask in the glow of burning sunshine Ra has provided. So let it be written. So let it be done. What's another kernel or two?
 
Messages
18,185
Location
Upper Midwest
Originally Posted by Sayonara_Sonata
Bring the bountiful harvest unto us so our chariots, of renewable plastics, may bask in the glow of burning sunshine Ra has provided. So let it be written. So let it be done. What's another kernel or two?
You were gone there a couple weeks or so, where did you go?
 
Messages
130
Location
AR
And as your comment in my thread you again bring nothing to the table. That's two goose eggs. Perhaps you should share them w/someone hungry for nothing. ETA: E10 has been fairly well received within the automotive industry. I fail to see impending doom or catastrophe from bumping it another half.
 
Last edited:
Top