Dorman replacement intake manifolds to address "Common Failures"

[jthorner]

It is interesting that Dorman is marketing improved manifolds for several GM applications and one Ford.

Are these the best fix for the common GM 3.8L intake manifold failures?

http://www.rbinc.com/pdfs/2400001IntakeManifoldExpansionSellSheet.pdf

John

 

[terminaldegree]

I'm running one now on our '99 LeSabre. Just put it on 2 weeks ago. That wasn't a fun job for a first-timer. From what I've read and heard, these are the least expensive long-term solution to the problem. Cost me $130 at O'reilly's, and it comes with a new gasket and PCV setup as well. Other people talk about the KenCo solution, which is an upper and lower intake. I've heard good things about this as well, but in most cases it is unneccessary to replace the lower as well. Apparently, the GM replacement part is the same as the old version [unimproved in the EGR area]!

Ironically, the 3800 series II on my Firebird came with an aluminum intake manifold, not the crappy plastic one. As if they didn't know there was a possible problem there... This generation of the 3800 is going to lose GM the "bulletproof" moniker. A lot of engines are going to die because people didn't think anything of the mysterious coolant leak.

 

[Spitty]

Funny how a small company can find an answer when (Big) GM can't

 

[T-Keith]

I believe the problems with 3800 manifolds were a QC issue with an outside vendor and not a design one. So I'm not sure if this is addressing an issue that GM hasn't.

-T

 

[Drew99GT]

quote:

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Originally posted by terminaldegree:
Apparently, the GM replacement part is the same as the old version [unimproved in the EGR area]!

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Does anyone know if this is true? We had a GM dealer fix this problem on my mom's Olds 88, and they repeadetly assured me that the new GM upper manifold is an "upgrade" that will not melt and leak.

Even if it is, GM has lost 4 loyal (formerly) cusomers who have bought, Oh, roughly 6 new GM vehicles in the last 10 years. 4 of them have had internal coolent leaks. It's not really that a problem exists, it's how GM is dealing with it. They're basically denying that a problem exists and telling loyal customers to shive it and pay for the repair, sometimes multiple times.

And they wonder why they're going belly-up!

 

[XS650]

quote:

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Originally posted by Spitty:
Funny how a small company can find an answer when (Big) GM can't

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Correction.... "won't".

 

[Drew99GT]

quote:

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Originally posted by XS650:

quote:

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Originally posted by Spitty:
Funny how a small company can find an answer when (Big) GM can't

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Correction.... "won't".

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The bean counters know it costs less. I think they didn't take into consideration the masses on the internet who would speak out against this **** though. Oppurtunity cost of lost business is a ***** !

 

[metroplex]

The Dorman Ford intakes cheaped out in a lot of places that I would prefer they didn't.

They left out the brass inserts for the coil pack bolt holes, but it's not a really vital area anyhow. Otherwise it's about half the price of a Ford intake kit.

The funny thing is, if you buy the PI intake from Ford Racing, it's only $199. Add your intake manifold gaskets, alternator bracket, etc... and it only increases the price by $30-$40 tops. You end up with an OEM Ford intake manifold for $250 tops. I've heard as high as $400-$600 for the NPI intake manifold kits from Ford.

 

[JohnBrowning]

Have one on my 1997 Buick Lasaber that GM refused to fix under warranty! My car was mde in the same plant on the same day etc etc..... My vin break missed the cut off by 100! Mind you I was working for GM at the time and I still could not get them to fix it! Had all the classic TSB symptoms.

The GM fix requires the replacement of the upper and lower. Even getting the parts at cost from GM it would have cost my 3 times what it cost me to use Doorman and Flepro! Doorman only requires the replacementof the upper. If you are a jobber KEN-CO makes a double sleeve kit to repair your OEM upper intake manifold!

I decided to replace my lower intake gaskets just to be safe and my injector o-rings while I was in their and my tensioner!

The Doorman 3.8 intake manifold is as good if not better in quality and materials then the OEM one that cam off the car. Northern Auto Parts has them for $109 plus shipping! My lower intake manifold gaskets looked fine but it gave me an excuse to clean the varnish from the ballance shaft, ballance shaft vbearings, push rods etc.. i also cleaned the the lower intake really well.

If I had it to over again I would leave the lower manifold alone unless I had reason to belive it was leaking as it adds a lot of time to the job. If you just replace the upper with a doorman you can be done in less then an hour!

 

[lght1]

Hi

I used the Dorman in Nov '03, and since then, have driven about 78k with no leaks according to latest uoa.

If I ever had to do it again, I think I'd use the new aluminum intake for the new Series III engine.

With the exception of needing a egr blocking plate to cover an unused port, plus a TB spacer ( Series III is drive-by-wire) its mostly a straight bolt on.

BTW, I had a '95 Olds with the Series II, and never had a failure thru 250k of miles. The only difference was that it used green coolant.

 

[Ryan00TJ]

I replaced my mother's leaking 98 3.8L manifold with a Dorman replacement. It's of nice quality and not too bad of a repair. UOA's showed coolant was getting into the engine somehow with the OEM manifold but the original manifold and gaskets looked fine? The next week after the repair her transmission went out and the POS was taken to the auction where it belongs.

 

[lght1]

Hi


My "POS" 3800 has 181,000 miles on it, use oil excessively at about a qt every 6000.

Since early in the car's life, I've did a partial atf swap every 10k (3 months for me) by dropping the pan, and changing filters every yr (55k for me).

Needless to say, still the orig 4t65e and zero repair issues.

The only changes I made beyond the Dorman, was to replace the coolant elbows, lower intake, and swap Dex out for G-O5. I also added a B&M trans cooler as well.

 

[Jim Spahr]

Two questions-1./ I know what DexCool is. That is the orange cooolant that is supposed to be long life, as in 5 years. But what is G-05? I ask because, my '94 GM car with a V8 came with green coolant and I changed out to the DexCool thinking I was upgrading. Big mistake. The coolant system had an immediate problem with s brown sludge in the cooling system. 2./ Anyone have another URL for Dorman? I couldn't get the PDF to pull up.

 

[lght1]

Hi

G-O5 is a type of coolant that is low silicate, phosphate free, coolant used by DC,Ford, MB.

It does not use E2HA OAT formula, and thus reacts much more pleasantly to air in the system.

The .pdfs worked ok for me. Is Acrobat reader up to date?

 

[Jim Spahr]

Thanks for the info on G-05. Is it recommended for the 1994 era GM cars as well? I did a search on Dorman intake manifolds and found that Dorman OE Repalcements is offering the upgraded intake manifolds for the 3800 GM V6 95> and the Ford modular 4.6L V8. GM V6 is 110.00 and the Ford V8 is 199.00. I also happened on the newly developed Fel-Pro intake manifold gasket for the GM truck 5.0L and the 5.7L V8 engines. This problem solver gasket is called the 'Perma Dry Plus' gasket. They are soon to have these upgraded int. man. gaskets for the GM 3.1 and the 3.4 V6 engines.

 

[lght1]

Hi

The G-O5 appears to be fine for older vehicles.

My old '95 used green, but if i had known about the G-O5, I would have used that instead.

Thats what has been in my '97 LSS this last year.