Domestic or Foreign vehicles your thoughts?

[crinkles]

Originally Posted By: opus1
Originally Posted By: crinkles
Originally Posted By: opus1
Honda, Toyota and Nissan have enough domestic content in their vehicles made here that the VIN starts with a "1".


pretty sure if you took 100% imported parts and assemble it int he USA you'd still get a "1" vin number. the vin number digit is about where it is assembled. the next two digits say which plant.
I was under the impression that this number also indicated domestic content, which is why my Sonata, even though it was built in Alabama, has a vin starting with a '5' since most of the parts are sourced in Korea.


no i think 5 also indicates US assembly. In fact, 1 4 and 5 as the first number indicates US assembly.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vehicle_Identification_Number

the link has a list of country codes. You could probably also look up the SAE codes from the SAE standards website if you don't believe wikipedia, people treat you like a leper on here if you get any info from wiipedia.

 

[Hallmark]

Originally Posted By: spasm3
If i ever by a brand new car, i would search out and buy any car that fit my needs that was NON-UNION produced.


The Mercedes, Hyundai, and Honda plants in Alabama are all non-union...are there others?

 

[mechanicx]

Originally Posted By: Hallmark
Originally Posted By: spasm3
If i ever by a brand new car, i would search out and buy any car that fit my needs that was NON-UNION produced.


The Mercedes, Hyundai, and Honda plants in Alabama are all non-union...are there others?


Funny thing is if you buy a car imported to the US there's a good chance it was union made as Europe and Japan autoworkers have a union. But if that foreign car is made in the US it is usually not union made. There are exceptions like the Toyota Matrix assembled at a UAW GM plant and some Mazdas made at Ford joint ventures. Not wanting a union made vehicle is some peoples' excuse for not buying a Big 3 brand made in the US.

 

[Autobahn88]

Originally Posted By: spasm3
i have always bought domestics , i get such good service out of them. If i ever by a brand new car, i would search out and buy any car that fit my needs that was NON-UNION produced. Without going into politics, i feel that is the best way to support america.

I feel offended by that comment being a UNION employee and all.

 

[spasm3]

Originally Posted By: Autobahn88
Originally Posted By: spasm3
i have always bought domestics , i get such good service out of them. If i ever by a brand new car, i would search out and buy any car that fit my needs that was NON-UNION produced. Without going into politics, i feel that is the best way to support america.

I feel offended by that comment being a UNION employee and all.

Its not the union workers i object to, its the union bosses and the political direction in which they send the workers dues. (without the workers say!)

 

[mechanicx]

That's definitely a valid point, but sometimes you have to take the good with the bad, the lessor of two evils etc. Sometimes the parent company owner's union or not is guilty of the same thing.

 

[Ursae_Majoris]

Originally Posted By: mechanicx
but sometimes you have to take the good with the bad

Nope do not have to, unless DC passes a law requiring us to buy GM and Chrysler cars only. Both of my cars non-union, and I will not consider a union-made car because of the union members' choice of their leadership and the causes it supports. You vote for a particular union boss, you live with the consequences.

Japanese and Korean unions do not contribute to the political campaigns in US, do not employ lobbyists to get sweetheart deals in healthcare law, so I do not care what they stand for.

 

[LS2JSTS]

Maybe the unions don't directly, but their parent companies sure do...

"Toyota is one of a number of Japanese auto companies who have pursued a policy of lobbying U.S. government officials and funding U.S. political candidates both nationally and locally. In the case of Toyota specifically, more than forty percent of the congressional members serving on the three committees investigating Toyota have received campaign donations over the last ten years from Toyota.
Toyota has contributed donations through political action committees in a useful loophole in U.S. campaign finance laws that allow foreign individuals and foreign companies to circumvent U.S. campaign finance laws by contributing instead to Political Action Committees or PACS. In the case of Toyota and other Japanese automakers, these PACs have included both industry specific PACs where Toyota and other Japanese auto companies deceitfully present themselves as “American auto companies” to participate in U.S. auto manufacturing political action committees and other types political action committees or PACS that are being created to all apparent for the purpose of funneling foreign campaign donations to U.S. politicians. Toyota has spent millions on both at both the national and local level, as have other Japanese auto firms."

 

[mechanicx]

Well my point is that both sides do things that are bad and wrong IMO so I don't have party affiliation or loyalty. The primary purpose of a union is collective bargaining for workers, but some people want to make it a political matter. like I said business owners themself support various causes one might not agree with, so it's not just a union issue per se. Some people are just against the concept of collective bargaining and try to twist things into more than it is.

 

[Ursae_Majoris]

To the OP, sorry about de-railing the thread, I will shut up now

.
I look at it this way: if it was assembled in the US, it put food on the table of US workers, even if it is 100% non-US made parts. US-made content means somebody in US had money to pay their bills, be it a Fusion made in Mexico or a Kia made in Georgia.

My apologies to Canucks, I know we go a long way back in auto-sharing, but a Canadian made Chrysler minivan is no better than a Mexican made HHR. Both source US parts. Both put US ASSEMBLY workers out of work, but provided jobs to the US SUPPLIERS.

Six one, half a dozen the other.

BTW, be careful with domestic contents labels. Often times "domestic" means US and Canadian-made parts. Last I checked, Canada was not a 51st state.

 

[Spazdog]

Originally Posted By: LS2JSTS
Originally Posted By: Spazdog
Originally Posted By: LS2JSTS

"All 50 of the 2009 models whose American Automobile Labeling Act parts content is zero are built by Asia- or Europe-based automakers, according to NHTSA."


Because somehow or another the Chevrolet Aveo managed a 1% domestic content.

1%.

Must be that Bowtie badge in the center of the grill.


Big deal...even if it was only 49 out of 50, does it really change the point.

And FTR, the Aveo will be assembled in the US in it's very near future. So that'll be one less model that gets constantly brought up like it represents the whole picture...like the Fusion does for Ford.


I'm glad the humor of that wasn't lost on you.

I read that they are going to rename the current Aveo the "Sonic". I don't know if that is after the Oklahoma based fast food drive in or the video game hedgehog.

 

[spasm3]

Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Well my point is that both sides do things that are bad and wrong IMO so I don't have party affiliation or loyalty. The primary purpose of a union is collective bargaining for workers, but some people want to make it a political matter. like I said business owners themself support various causes one might not agree with, so it's not just a union issue per se. Some people are just against the concept of collective bargaining and try to twist things into more than it is.


Its more than collective bargaining , its the money sent to political organizations that may not have americas best interests or the constitution at heart. I.E. social justice groups etc.
This is about all i better say , i don't want to get too political.
If the unions were just about building american cars than that would not bother me, it just runs deeper than that.

 

[Superbuick96]

Well I totaly expected the topic of Unions to come up. Although I hope the thread does not get hijacked into a full fledged argument about wether unions are good or bad. I think everyone has an opinion of some sort reguarding domestic vs foreign, I'd like to hear what everyone has to say.
Originally Posted By: Ursae_Majoris
To the OP, sorry about de-railing the thread, I will shut up now

.
I look at it this way: if it was assembled in the US, it put food on the table of US workers, even if it is 100% non-US made parts. US-made content means somebody in US had money to pay their bills, be it a Fusion made in Mexico or a Kia made in Georgia.

My apologies to Canucks, I know we go a long way back in auto-sharing, but a Canadian made Chrysler minivan is no better than a Mexican made HHR. Both source US parts. Both put US ASSEMBLY workers out of work, but provided jobs to the US SUPPLIERS.

Six one, half a dozen the other.

BTW, be careful with domestic contents labels. Often times "domestic" means US and Canadian-made parts. Last I checked, Canada was not a 51st state.

 

[spasm3]

To get back on subject. I have driven domestic cars and gotten such good service that i have had no reason to switch. I always got 200k and usually i was tired of it by then. Parts are reasonable, and commonly available compared to say volvo. The resale is lower on domestics so that makes it a better value for me to buy them used, i have not owned a brand new car yet. I have had 2 imports a vw porshe 914, while a very fun car with good handling, not reliable. A 81 celica ( inherited due to marriage) smoked ran poorly needed valve job at 80k. finally sold it as it was a money pit.

 

[CivicFan]

Originally Posted By: Superbuick96
IM about 3 years out from buying my next vehicle, and Ive been researching the issue of Domestic vs. Foreign vehicles. Consulting the "Made in America Index" http://www.cars.com/go/advice/Story.jsp?section=top&subject=ami&story=amMade0709 The most American car is the Toyota Camary, and 5 of the top 10 are Japanese makes. There is not one domestic that is 100% made in America anymore. I question wether its un-Patriotic to buy a foreign car, anymore when the Ford Fusion is built in Mexico, while the Honda Civic is built in Ohio for example. I understand from History that if it wernt for The Big 3's contibutions to the Alies, in WWII North America might of been speaking German right now. Ive read that domestics use a higher percentage of domestic part suppliers, while foreign makers that build in the States import a majority of they're parts. Other then that the whole industry seems very gloabal any more, what is everyones thoughts on the topic?


Keep an open mind and buy the car you like. There are good cars bearing badges of all makes. Even KIA makes cars nowadays that are worth buying.

 

[Vikas]

What a topic! OP wants to buy a new car in THREE years and started to stir the pot now

- Vikas

 

[97tbird]

I put quality and logic and what I like in a car first, before thinking where it is made. if that car that I like IS made in the US, I take that as a bonus point in my choice. If it's not, I'd still buy it.

Euro, Asian, US ... all those cars have good and bad makes:
We love all 3 of our cars; They've been great so far: They come from Germany, USA and S. Korea

it's a diverse car family.

 

[Pop_Rivit]

I couldn't care less where a vehical is assembled.

When I shop for a vehicle I determine what I need, and what type of vehicle will fill those needs. Then I make a list of vehicals that fill the need and narrow it down to 3 or 4. I test drive the 3 or 4 and purchase the one that is most cost effective.

On a side note, unlike the original poster I don't think I've ever researched a vehicle purchase that is 3 years in the future. I would think that things can change enough in the new car market that in 3 years that the research done now would be rendered mostly moot.

 

[Autobahn88]

Originally Posted By: Ursae_Majoris
To the OP, sorry about de-railing the thread, I will shut up now

.
I look at it this way: if it was assembled in the US, it put food on the table of US workers, even if it is 100% non-US made parts. US-made content means somebody in US had money to pay their bills, be it a Fusion made in Mexico or a Kia made in Georgia.

My apologies to Canucks, I know we go a long way back in auto-sharing, but a Canadian made Chrysler minivan is no better than a Mexican made HHR. Both source US parts. Both put US ASSEMBLY workers out of work, but provided jobs to the US SUPPLIERS.

Six one, half a dozen the other.

BTW, be careful with domestic contents labels. Often times "domestic" means US and Canadian-made parts. Last I checked, Canada was not a 51st state.

WOW.. 2 strikes against me. I am a union worker and a Canadian. It does not matter where a car is made. If it fits my needs and is reliable I will not hesitate to buy it. Be it German, Japanese, Korean etc...

 

[Superbuick96]

Originally Posted By: Vikas
What a topic! OP wants to buy a new car in THREE years and started to stir the pot now

- Vikas

Im not looking for board members to help me decide how to spend 20+K on a new car, I have a shortlist of vehicles Im considering. (next gen Civic/Focus),Accord,CRV,Golf,Malibu,Mustang seem to be on my radar. I know from searching around this is generaly a hot button topic, that everyone has a thought on and this board has lots of great opinions.