Delta Inherits DC9s

[Tremo]

Yo DKR,

Please note I was referring to DTW, not DFW.

I remember when Delta had a huge presence at DFW, but now I think all they have there is 2 gates.

DL still has nonstop CVG-SFO service, I saw that today when I caught the 8:30 SFO-ATL run.

 

[L_Sludger]

Originally Posted By: Silver02ex
Originally Posted By: FowVay
I don't see Delta keeping the DC-9 or the B-747. Delta is filling their fleet with Embraer and Canadair regional jets to replace their MD-88 and MD-90 fleet. The DC-9 will join the other two airframes that are slated for extinction.



I'm a little late to respond to this but you will not see the DC-9 go away anytime soon. Matter of fact Delta is pulling more DC-9 that has been parked and been using them. The CRJ-900 and E-Jet that's on property right now is it. You will not see anymore unless Delta pilots cave in on scope protection like they did in early 2000 (which i don't see it happen in the future). which will allow more 76+ seat jets being flow by regionals. CRJ's and E-190 will not be a direct replacement for the DC-9. That's one of the reason the DC-9's are still around
You can almost put money on the fact that the crew that flies the fNWA 744s to VCV will fly back in the diesel nine,

Moak or not, Delta pilots will not relax on scope at all. Even senior widebody captains are weighing in on this issue.

 

[Silver02ex]

Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
They don't.



The A330 will be gone from Deltas fleet sooner than later. And the 767 will be around for a long time. Its a excellent plane for Delta.





It would be the other way around. 767 will go before the A330. This is one of the reason why Hawaiian is getting rid of all their 767 and going to a A330 and A350 fleet in the future. I ride in the jumpseat home or to work about once a week on Northwest and this is what some of the mainline guys are telling me about what's going on with the 767 and A330.

 

[Silver02ex]

Originally Posted By: L_Sludger
Originally Posted By: Silver02ex
Originally Posted By: FowVay
I don't see Delta keeping the DC-9 or the B-747. Delta is filling their fleet with Embraer and Canadair regional jets to replace their MD-88 and MD-90 fleet. The DC-9 will join the other two airframes that are slated for extinction.



I'm a little late to respond to this but you will not see the DC-9 go away anytime soon. Matter of fact Delta is pulling more DC-9 that has been parked and been using them. The CRJ-900 and E-Jet that's on property right now is it. You will not see anymore unless Delta pilots cave in on scope protection like they did in early 2000 (which i don't see it happen in the future). which will allow more 76+ seat jets being flow by regionals. CRJ's and E-190 will not be a direct replacement for the DC-9. That's one of the reason the DC-9's are still around
You can almost put money on the fact that the crew that flies the fNWA 744s to VCV will fly back in the diesel nine,

Moak or not, Delta pilots will not relax on scope at all. Even senior widebody captains are weighing in on this issue.


Who needs scope when you can buy up the whole company like Republic did with Midwest and Frontier. I'm not saying Dealta will be bought but there's one way around scope. What i find ironic is Frontier use to pay Republic to fly for Frontier. Now Republic owns Frontier.

 

[fdcg27]

I suspect the 767 will be around for some time, just like the DC-9.
Delta once owned a handful of A310s.
They don't seem to be big Airbus fans.

 

[L_Sludger]

Originally Posted By: fdcg27
I suspect the 767 will be around for some time, just like the DC-9.
Delta once owned a handful of A310s.
They don't seem to be big Airbus fans.

You're right about the 767. It's the backbone of the international fleet. I wish they'd dump the 764, though.. that airplane is a non-rev Terminator due to weight and balance restrictions from most of its served destinations!

 

[fdcg27]

Aren't the 764s their newest 767s?
Boeing must really have been desperate to have built the 764 just for Delta and Continental. There were never any other operators.
Can't see the 764s leaving the fleet anytime soon.
Also, the only reason the 767 remains the backbone of Delta's international feet is that Delta felt that it couldn't afford, or didn't need, a decent sized 777 fleet.
Delta only recently sought to expand its tiny 777 fleet, although all of the A330s from Northwest may make that a less urgent need.

 

[L_Sludger]

As much as I adore the 777, it does seem to be too much plane for a great deal of the routes Delta serves, so the 767 is the natural fit for those markets. Only gripe is the aging interior. It feels like you're flying in a 1985 Chevrolet Caprice on the older intercontinental widebodies.

 

[Tremo]

Originally Posted By: fdcg27
I suspect the 767 will be around for some time, just like the DC-9.
Delta once owned a handful of A310s.
They don't seem to be big Airbus fans.


DL inherited those A310s from PanAm when they bought them out. I remember flying from JFK to TXL on one. Strange thing, the cabin crew were all Polish.

 

[zulu]

Originally Posted By: L_Sludger
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
I suspect the 767 will be around for some time, just like the DC-9.
Delta once owned a handful of A310s.
They don't seem to be big Airbus fans.

You're right about the 767. It's the backbone of the international fleet. I wish they'd dump the 764, though.. that airplane is a non-rev Terminator due to weight and balance restrictions from most of its served destinations!


Agreed. The only -400s I ever see are to/from PHNL or the occasional ATL-SLC.

 

[Tremo]

They used to fly -400s on the SFO-ATL run. But after all the cutbacks, it's mostly 757s now.


Speaking of weight and balance, maybe yu can answer a question. I was on a CRJ flight from HSV to ATL. About 1 hour or maybe a little less. They had to ask one passenger to get off and take a different flight because of weight and balance. Huh? On such a short flight they don't need much fuel, so why did the boot the guy off?

 

[Silver02ex]

I've been seeing the 777 more in DTW now. It's going from DTW to Shanghai. It use to be on the 747. Most of the 747 is doing DTW to NRT.

 

[dkryan]

Originally Posted By: Tremo

Speaking of weight and balance, maybe yu can answer a question. I was on a CRJ flight from HSV to ATL. About 1 hour or maybe a little less. They had to ask one passenger to get off and take a different flight because of weight and balance. Huh? On such a short flight they don't need much fuel, so why did the boot the guy off?


Well, I could guess:

The weight of the cargo limited the number of passengers for that flight, regardless of trip distance.

They did not want to offload fuel they might not have needed for a one hour flight, time delay and the cost of doing so being two factors.

I believe Huntsville (HSV?) has runways of sufficient length such that high temperatures would not effect a "balanced field" calculation for takeoff and rejected takeoff distances.

If that should ever happen again, Tremo, ask them when you are deplaning.

 

[L_Sludger]

Originally Posted By: Silver02ex
I've been seeing the 777 more in DTW now. It's going from DTW to Shanghai. It use to be on the 747. Most of the 747 is doing DTW to NRT.
It's a shame to send such a nice ship to that awful outstation. Thanks to the new NWA management, CVG and Atlanta are getting the shaft in favor of DTW, JFK and LGA. In my opinion, the exact WRONG things to do, but what do I know? I just work here.

 

[L_Sludger]

Originally Posted By: Tremo
They used to fly -400s on the SFO-ATL run. But after all the cutbacks, it's mostly 757s now.


Speaking of weight and balance, maybe yu can answer a question. I was on a CRJ flight from HSV to ATL. About 1 hour or maybe a little less. They had to ask one passenger to get off and take a different flight because of weight and balance. Huh? On such a short flight they don't need much fuel, so why did the boot the guy off?
Probably a non-revenue passenger. And CRJs aren't exactly known to be good commercial airplanes. They're inefficient, weak, noisy, uncomfortable and an all around liability for any competent operation. They are, by design, a ridiculously stretched corporate jet. They weren't made as commercial cattle carts. Therefore, their beleaguered flight controls and trim stabilization schemes can't very well compensate for a slight imbalance. And they need a long runway to take off when fully loaded - all factors that came into play when Captain Caveman told the passenger to beat it.

 

[Silver02ex]

Originally Posted By: dkryan
Originally Posted By: Tremo

Speaking of weight and balance, maybe yu can answer a question. I was on a CRJ flight from HSV to ATL. About 1 hour or maybe a little less. They had to ask one passenger to get off and take a different flight because of weight and balance. Huh? On such a short flight they don't need much fuel, so why did the boot the guy off?


Well, I could guess:

The weight of the cargo limited the number of passengers for that flight, regardless of trip distance.

They did not want to offload fuel they might not have needed for a one hour flight, time delay and the cost of doing so being two factors.

I believe Huntsville (HSV?) has runways of sufficient length such that high temperatures would not effect a "balanced field" calculation for takeoff and rejected takeoff distances.

If that should ever happen again, Tremo, ask them when you are deplaning.


I see this problem all the time on short flights like HSV to MEM or ERI to DTW. It's because we need to carry extra fuel for the alternate airport. Because of the extra weight, and the short flight we don't have enough time in the air to burn enough fuel to meet the landing weight.. Longer flights, 1+ hrs this won't be a factor since we can fly lower to burn fuel or sit little longer before taking off. This has nothing to do with runway performance or anything like that. It has to do with meeting the landing weight. If the weather is good at the destination airport this won't be a facter either.

 

[Tremo]

Well speaking of 777s and 764s, I'll be on a couple next week on the round trip from ATL to LIM. Flight down is on the 777 but flight back is on a 764.

Interesting comment about the landing weight being the problem, I never considered that.

Why have so many carriers invested in the CRJ, when the ERJ is more comfortable? CRJ must be cheaper. CRJ-900 looks awkward.

Anybody know what percentage of NWA planes have been re-painted into DL colors? Last time I was in DTW there were still a lot in NWA paint.

 

[zulu]

Originally Posted By: Tremo
Well speaking of 777s and 764s, I'll be on a couple next week on the round trip from ATL to LIM. Flight down is on the 777 but flight back is on a 764.

Interesting comment about the landing weight being the problem, I never considered that.

Why have so many carriers invested in the CRJ, when the ERJ is more comfortable? CRJ must be cheaper. CRJ-900 looks awkward.

Anybody know what percentage of NWA planes have been re-painted into DL colors? Last time I was in DTW there were still a lot in NWA paint.


I'm the opposite... I think the CRJs are WAY more comfortable/quiet than the ERJ135/140/145s. However, they don't hold a candle the the newer E-Jets.

 

[fdcg27]

We had an ERJ for our first segment to SJU last December (most Continetal flights from DAY seem to use these things).
I chose this fight partly because we had never been on an ERJ, and I like to fly on different types.
As we boarded, I could not beleive how narrow the cabin was as compared to a CRJ.
There is a good reason the seating is three abreast, and it isn't pax comfort.
Either aircraft is okay, but I agree with Zulu that the CRJ is probably more comfortable than the ERJ, having flown on CRJs in the past.
Neither is anything like as comfortable as any mainline aircraft.
I'll take an A320/319, 737-XXX, MD8X or 717 (Airtran) any time.
OTOH, given the choice between one of the regional jets and no offered connection to wherever we are going, I'll take the either the lawn dart or the Barbie jet any time.

 

[Liquidator]

Sometimes that's due to FAA regs.

In fact I know of two OLD Dc-8's the owner is looking for parts to meet FAA regs before he can get them back up in the air. Also, know of another man that has a DC8 for sale with the spare parts.