I use to run 1 Qrt MMO with three of oil for hundreds and hundreds of thousands of miles back to back. And I still did engine flushes couple times a month.
Cheapo Engine Flushes
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I know plenty people that either never change it or only change it when it is solid black, some only change it when they cant see the oil on the dang dip stick... these guys have Lexus and Benz and etc.... just dont care... One guy has a Bent and does not care because he trades every couple years (1 or 2 years)---- NUtZ
Engine flush story.
I purchased a neglected 89 bmw 325ix. I drained the oil, changed the filter and filled with mobil 1 10w30. I was reworking the car, so it stayed on jack stands for about 3 months with that oil, and I periodically would start the engine & let it idle until it came up to temp.
One day, I started it and there was no oil pressure! (this car has an oil pressure "idiot light") Thinking the switch was bad, I changed it, but still no luck. there really was NO oil pressure. I drained the mobil 1 that only had about 1/2 hour of idling time and it was black, with flakes of carbon crud floating around in it. I put on a new filter and refilled the sump with some cheap oil I had sitting around. Still no pressure. I drained the oil then filled the sump with kerosene and let it sit for about an hour, then drained and refilled with the (same) oil, started the engine, no pressure... Repeat. After about 3 reps, I finally got the oil pressure back. I was really happy about that, since I was in no mood to redo an engine.
Never tried starting it with just kerosene in there. It didn't seem like the right thing to do.
I purchased a neglected 89 bmw 325ix. I drained the oil, changed the filter and filled with mobil 1 10w30. I was reworking the car, so it stayed on jack stands for about 3 months with that oil, and I periodically would start the engine & let it idle until it came up to temp.
One day, I started it and there was no oil pressure! (this car has an oil pressure "idiot light") Thinking the switch was bad, I changed it, but still no luck. there really was NO oil pressure. I drained the mobil 1 that only had about 1/2 hour of idling time and it was black, with flakes of carbon crud floating around in it. I put on a new filter and refilled the sump with some cheap oil I had sitting around. Still no pressure. I drained the oil then filled the sump with kerosene and let it sit for about an hour, then drained and refilled with the (same) oil, started the engine, no pressure... Repeat. After about 3 reps, I finally got the oil pressure back. I was really happy about that, since I was in no mood to redo an engine.
Never tried starting it with just kerosene in there. It didn't seem like the right thing to do.
I have an anal retentive impulse to clean the heck out of everything I think about for any length of time: My car, its engine, my keyboard, my paintball guns, hand tools, office equipment, vacuum cleaners, lawn & garden equipment, etc ...
However, I used an engine flush on my '68 Camaro about 15 years ago, left it in for a little longer than recommended and 1 week later, the headgasket failed. I've heard of this since in other vehicles.
So, I'm pretty gun-shy about using any solvents or aggressively pursuing any gunk or deposits which may be sitting in deep dark corners of old motors.
My favorite flush is an additional oil change. Maybe add some Neutra or MMO to the oil a week or a couple hundred miles before the oil is drained. That's it.
When changing the oil, I jack the car up in different spots to get the most from each drain and will sometimes stick a rag in the oil fill hole to sop up some of the old oil left in a couple places.
OF COURSE I clean off the dipstick and the underside of the oil filler cap. I'll even reach underneath the valve cover as far as I can in pursuit of sludge.
But I don't allow myself much more than this. I'm too afraid to ruin a lube's ability to protect while dissolving some old oil build up.
--- Bror Jace
However, I used an engine flush on my '68 Camaro about 15 years ago, left it in for a little longer than recommended and 1 week later, the headgasket failed. I've heard of this since in other vehicles.
So, I'm pretty gun-shy about using any solvents or aggressively pursuing any gunk or deposits which may be sitting in deep dark corners of old motors.
My favorite flush is an additional oil change. Maybe add some Neutra or MMO to the oil a week or a couple hundred miles before the oil is drained. That's it.
When changing the oil, I jack the car up in different spots to get the most from each drain and will sometimes stick a rag in the oil fill hole to sop up some of the old oil left in a couple places.
OF COURSE I clean off the dipstick and the underside of the oil filler cap. I'll even reach underneath the valve cover as far as I can in pursuit of sludge.
But I don't allow myself much more than this. I'm too afraid to ruin a lube's ability to protect while dissolving some old oil build up.
--- Bror Jace
Rislone 700 miles before oil change
Ray: Geez, what the heck did the prior owner/clown do to that poor Bimmer before you got it? (Actually, "not do" is more appropriate.) That's pretty wild. I've glanced in oil filler caps of used cars I've looked at, but not routinely SCRUTINIZED through the cap. Comments like yours will definitely make me take a long, hard look through those "engine windows" in the future.
Bror: You remind me of a fellow car racer I knew. He had a race-prepped Toyota MR2, and I swear you could eat off the engine. I always teased him about that, but was secretly envious of his "car hygiene." As for your Camaro, I doubt if the flush actually "caused" the head gasket failure -- I'm at a loss as to how 5+ minutes of kerosene exposure can damage a metallic head gasket -- but perhaps the gasket was failing anyway, with only compacted soot (or similar gunk) ensuring a seal at that particular point of the gasket..? Along comes the kerosene, and the soot is dissolved and swept away, leading to a leak at that spot..? I'm thinkin' that the head gasket was already seriously compromised before the flush..? This reminds me of the "Mobil 1 causes oil leaks" suspicions, when what was really happening was the syn oil's qualities were simply highlighting any seals which were already going bad. In the end, your comment of "My favorite flush is an additional oil change" might be exceptionally wise.
Bror: You remind me of a fellow car racer I knew. He had a race-prepped Toyota MR2, and I swear you could eat off the engine. I always teased him about that, but was secretly envious of his "car hygiene." As for your Camaro, I doubt if the flush actually "caused" the head gasket failure -- I'm at a loss as to how 5+ minutes of kerosene exposure can damage a metallic head gasket -- but perhaps the gasket was failing anyway, with only compacted soot (or similar gunk) ensuring a seal at that particular point of the gasket..? Along comes the kerosene, and the soot is dissolved and swept away, leading to a leak at that spot..? I'm thinkin' that the head gasket was already seriously compromised before the flush..? This reminds me of the "Mobil 1 causes oil leaks" suspicions, when what was really happening was the syn oil's qualities were simply highlighting any seals which were already going bad. In the end, your comment of "My favorite flush is an additional oil change" might be exceptionally wise.
This is all the beauty of ARX. Clean as you drive. Very slow methodical cleaning, with no chunks is the way to go. Conversion to synthetics, makes it worthwhile if the motor is clean at conversion. Not only clean but the seals are cleaned and reseated before conversion. I know of no other product that enhances oil film(no dry spots), nor enhances EP characteristics, of the host oil, while cleaning is occuring. From my experience, it's the best method, period.Some folks gripe about the price, I tend to think that you get what you pay for. Why increase the amount of disposable capacity, when the the oil that is currently in the motor has the ability to clean with ARX.
I just can't understand those who warn against kerosene, diesel or naptha flushes, but then talk about MMO or Rislone.
Price is great when you compared to a Bosch engine flush machine treatment that costs $75 and likely does little to nothing. Certainly nowhere near as effective as AutoRX. Seeing it at work at the microscopic level through UOA and macroscopic through the oil filter are truely amazing.
The car was bought at auction in Feb 99 with 80000 miles and then registered in florida by a female. The car was driven until about 8/2002 when the timing belt snapped. The head work was done by a friend of hers, but shortly thereafter the front drive shaft spun & they gave up on it. I bought the car unseen from a posting on the ix registry, and can only guess about the maintenance over those 40k miles, but from the looks of it when I got it, the coolant and brake fluid had not been changed in several years. The oil probably was changed, but the engine apparently was fairly well sludged up. The oil in the power steering, differentials and transmission was antique. The interior had not been cleaned in years either (and she smoked).
The car is feeling better now, but is anxious to get back on the road....
[ November 18, 2003, 04:57 PM: Message edited by: Ray Garlington ]
More astoundingly useless drivel from the merciless MSDS train...
6. Amsoil Engine Flush - long term use
43% naphtha
40% kerosene
17% other
7. Solder Seal/Gunk 5 Min. Engine Flush
~100% diesel fuel
[ November 18, 2003, 05:36 PM: Message edited by: TC ]
6. Amsoil Engine Flush - long term use
43% naphtha
40% kerosene
17% other
7. Solder Seal/Gunk 5 Min. Engine Flush
~100% diesel fuel
[ November 18, 2003, 05:36 PM: Message edited by: TC ]
TC - what is YOUR definition of "long term use"???
Amsoil does not recommend anything but a one time, idle only, use of Amsoil Engine Flush.
Amsoil does not recommend anything but a one time, idle only, use of Amsoil Engine Flush.
You mean to say that i spent 3.50 on a flush that is less than a gallon of diesel fuel?! Wow..... i'll just say that was a mistake of my past. AutoRX is gonna go in after my run with some Havoline Synthetic that I'm doing. I found it at big Lots for 2 bucks. SL rated!
The point is to take the $3.50 and purchase one dollar of diesel, one dollar of kerosene, and a 24oz cup of coffee---and wake up!
Yeah, that's why If I do a flush now, I use a cleaner or such and only put a few ounces in with FRESH oil, run a short trip or a day or two, and chaneg.... IMHO this needs to be done once and awhile, JUST BECAUSE.
As far as how much my flushes cost me most of the time if I do them it is just before I go to get the oil changed and they coast from .20-.60 cents, yup I'm-sa BIG spender.
Holden: Yeah, but if you just use straight kerosene or diesel fuel, instead of pouring same from a cool looking bottle, you don't get that "warm & fuzzy" feeling as it glugs out of the container. If 100% diesel fuel comes out of a bottle with impressive "Sludge Killer 5000!!" graphics, it's gotta be better than something that comes out of a jerry can, right???
Pablo: My bad if I mistook Amsoil's use instructions. By "long term" I simply meant anything longer than a brief (5+ minutes) idling flush, or basically any product you can drive with, as opposed to those that warn "Do not drive car -- idle only." By the way, Amsoil evidently e-mailed another poster, insisting their engine flush contains no kerosene. (They should have read their own MSDS.) Evidently it's tough admitting your boutique engine cleaner is 40% kerosene!
Pablo: My bad if I mistook Amsoil's use instructions. By "long term" I simply meant anything longer than a brief (5+ minutes) idling flush, or basically any product you can drive with, as opposed to those that warn "Do not drive car -- idle only." By the way, Amsoil evidently e-mailed another poster, insisting their engine flush contains no kerosene. (They should have read their own MSDS.) Evidently it's tough admitting your boutique engine cleaner is 40% kerosene!
I think Amsoil HQ said that the engine flush isn't 100% kerosene.
As for "boutique", at $3.45 a can they sure are going for the upper crust.
As for "boutique", at $3.45 a can they sure are going for the upper crust.
Holden: “I just can't understand those who warn against kerosene, diesel or naptha flushes, but then talk about MMO or Rislone.”
I wouldn’t use Rislone … but only an ounce or two of MMO or Neutra a day or two before an oil change, as I said above.
TC: “I'm at a loss as to how 5+ minutes of kerosene exposure can damage a metallic head gasket -- but perhaps the gasket was failing anyway, with only compacted soot (or similar gunk) ensuring a seal at that particular point of the gasket?”
You might be right but the car was not on the road at the time and kerosene sat in the motor for a while, so it wasn’t just 5 minutes. Maybe closer to 15 minutes run time and at least a week sitting. I was around 18 and didn’t know any better.
Thankfully, I had already decided to replace the motor and had found a 4-bolt, 350 truck motor to overhaul. The blown headgasket(s) merely hastened replacement. Upon teardown, the motor (which was NOT original) was smoked. Bearing shells were deeply scarred, etc …
I have heard of flushes dooming other headgaskets since then and I remain paranoid about any sort of (non-ester) intensive cleaning of the inside of a motor. Besides, if you use good oil, filters and don’t try to go too long between changes, sludge shouldn’t form in any appreciable amount.
--- Bror Jace
I wouldn’t use Rislone … but only an ounce or two of MMO or Neutra a day or two before an oil change, as I said above.
TC: “I'm at a loss as to how 5+ minutes of kerosene exposure can damage a metallic head gasket -- but perhaps the gasket was failing anyway, with only compacted soot (or similar gunk) ensuring a seal at that particular point of the gasket?”
You might be right but the car was not on the road at the time and kerosene sat in the motor for a while, so it wasn’t just 5 minutes. Maybe closer to 15 minutes run time and at least a week sitting. I was around 18 and didn’t know any better.
I have heard of flushes dooming other headgaskets since then and I remain paranoid about any sort of (non-ester) intensive cleaning of the inside of a motor. Besides, if you use good oil, filters and don’t try to go too long between changes, sludge shouldn’t form in any appreciable amount.
--- Bror Jace
Ain't marketing great?
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