Carcarenut picks M1 over TGMO for GR Corolla

OVERKILL said:
A quick google yielded this article from 2014:
https://www.carbuyer.co.uk/news/138828/toyota-models-to-get-bmw-diesel-engines

And this from 2015:
https://www.bmwblog.com/2015/05/15/toyota-avensis-gets-bmw-diesels/
Click to expand...


And Toyota makes a ton of diesel engines in their Thailand plant. This seems to be limited to some European models in order to meet the euro standards. These are specific cases and not some worldwide thing.

The intent here was that Toyota cannot build a diesel engine. Hino has no trouble makings them as well as the Thailand plant I mentioned. There may be other facilities as well.
 
PimTac said:
And Toyota makes a ton of diesel engines in their Thailand plant. This seems to be limited to some European models in order to meet the euro standards. These are specific cases and not some worldwide thing.

The intent here was that Toyota cannot build a diesel engine. Hino has no trouble makings them as well as the Thailand plant I mentioned. There may be other facilities as well.
Click to expand...
Yes, this appears to be Euro-centric.
 
edyvw said:
I was generally talking about the Toyota lineup that is catered to more engaging customers.
I highly doubt I will ever see Corolla GR on the track.

What is minimum preparation? I have seen people on track with regular Chevrolet Impala coming to blow off some steam. That does not mean anything to come and do a few laps.

As for BMW I6, I would say, its history is lot longer than N54!

As for 240, I am not sure 230 won't outdo it on track too. BMW ALWAYS puts much more hp on wheels than other cars, bcs. they can make efficient drivetrain better than others. Plus, other NUMEROUS variables made Toyota buy cars from BMW, not another way around.
But, I am not sure BMW is a comparison, as I said, other cars in this category will be more appealing in the long run.
Click to expand...
What other models in the Toyota lineup that catered to more engaging customers were you referring to exactly?

The GR Corolla powertrain package is a first for the stateside market, but that combination launched essentially with the Yaris internationally. The aftermarket community, really tuned in (excuse me for the wordplay) on the powertrain package. The power mods can push 500 hp without the need of a breaker bar adjustment as @OVERKILL witnessed with hondaboys.

The GRMN program for the hothatch is a unique program unlike anything from a factory offering without heading into Porsche+ land. I could provide the original JP releases but heres an article.
https://www.motorbiscuit.com/awesome-toyota-gr-yaris-grmn-yaris/
 
PimTac said:
And Toyota makes a ton of diesel engines in their Thailand plant. This seems to be limited to some European models in order to meet the euro standards. These are specific cases and not some worldwide thing.

The intent here was that Toyota cannot build a diesel engine. Hino has no trouble makings them as well as the Thailand plant I mentioned. There may be other facilities as well.
Click to expand...

OVERKILL said:
Yes, this appears to be Euro-centric.
Click to expand...
That agreement ended at least by the looks of it in 2018 (WW series engine line). The timing is also interesting with Diesels fall from EU grace around that same period.

That being said tech sharing agreements are not something new nor sacrilege. Its all about the end result. If the supra for instance was designed internally with a inline 6, and cost as much as a corvette without adm, would the take rate be anything remarkable? I'm happy Toyota is bringing out some remarkable strong ICEVs in a sea of EVs as a final hurray at all price points.
 
Toyota doesn’t make any performance engines. Their 2JZ was a Yamaha engine. The 5.0 V8 in the Lexus LC and IS500 Yamaha engine, the Supra BMW engine, the 86 Subaru engine. Toyota only makes the eco engines. Even their 3.5 liter wasn’t a power house. If I’m trying to have a fun to drive car it surely wouldn’t be no Toyota. It would be a BMW.
 
NismoNVT said:
What other models in the Toyota lineup that catered to more engaging customers were you referring to exactly?

The GR Corolla powertrain package is a first for the stateside market, but that combination launched essentially with the Yaris internationally. The aftermarket community, really tuned in (excuse me for the wordplay) on the powertrain package. The power mods can push 500 hp without the need of a breaker bar adjustment as @OVERKILL witnessed with hondaboys.

The GRMN program for the hothatch is a unique program unlike anything from a factory offering without heading into Porsche+ land. I could provide the original JP releases but heres an article.
https://www.motorbiscuit.com/awesome-toyota-gr-yaris-grmn-yaris/
Click to expand...
Other? GR86.

Tuning? I am not sure why you think there is anything special. The WHP numbers are saying that it is mediocre drivetrain. Either that or crank hp is hugely overestimated.
 
PimTac said:
And Toyota makes a ton of diesel engines in their Thailand plant. This seems to be limited to some European models in order to meet the euro standards. These are specific cases and not some worldwide thing.

The intent here was that Toyota cannot build a diesel engine. Hino has no trouble makings them as well as the Thailand plant I mentioned. There may be other facilities as well.
Click to expand...
The biggest passenger diesel market is in Europe, by far. Toyota wanted to jump in that 20 some years ago, same like other Asian companies. Hyundai was smarter, they immediately went to Mercedes for help, although their engines ended up being far from being competitive in efficiency. Honda had decent diesel, nothing special and Subaru pushed boxer diesel, which was blah.
Toyota problems were :
1. Their 2.2d was literally disintegrating before 100k km.
2. Their CR pumps had huge issues. I was part of testing program with them in 2004 to determine which fuel suppliers will be listed in the manuals, for all their diesels, 1.4 to 3.0. Take into consideration that no other manufacturer had fuel related issues at that time.
3. Their DPF accessories had also big problems.

That all led to scrapping their small diesel engine program and just relying on BMW. They were FAR behind curve which would require insane amount of investment to try to catch up.

Diesel engines you are referring, and I have plenty experience with them when I worked in NATO and OSCE are seriously old technology and with that, seriously reliable. But not as reliable like Mercedes 5cyl diesels or 2.4 from VW.

Their V8 diesel is interesting proposition. But only reason why it is V8 is that they can’t achieve performance with their inline 6, it would require too much investment for very small market, and BMW inline 6 diesel, is far too expensive.
 
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edyvw said:
Other? GR86.

Tuning? I am not sure why you think there is anything special. The WHP numbers are saying that it is mediocre drivetrain. Either that or crank hp is hugely overestimated.
Click to expand...
Sorry if I don't follow, but what about the GR86? Its a 28K (the GR corolla is 35k) RWD base Mustang/Camaro competitor which (at least attempts to) reduce the frequency of the driver ending up on the sidewalk adjacent to all weekend car show event exits.

Is their anything new in that category that works better?

Tuning? I was addressing your first hand accounts of those supercharged accusumped GR Corollas which were disintegrating engines during cornering and had limited costly mods available.

I didnt realize that you were actually talking about the older Gr86s with its Subbie Boxer engines in place of the all new, higher priced Gr Corolla.
 
edyvw said:
All their passanger diesels that were available in Europe.
But, after VW debacle there is general trend of moving away from diesels, unfortunately.
Click to expand...
Its unfortunate that BMW is really good at I6 gassers, but terrible at 4 &8 gassers.
Diesels were interesting as well. M57 overbuilt tank, N57 fire hazard.
 
NismoNVT said:
Its unfortunate that BMW is really good at I6 gassers, but terrible at 4 &8 gassers.
Diesels were interesting as well. M57 overbuilt tank, N57 fire hazard.
Click to expand...
What fire hazard? They had issue with CCV. It is nothing unheard of.
4cyl was one generation issue with timing chain and even that was resolved after 2 yrs. B48 is arguably best 4cyl turbo today in tight competition with that Mercedes 2.0ltr.
V8 is different story. Too much emphasis on performance.
 
NismoNVT said:
Sorry if I don't follow, but what about the GR86? Its a 28K (the GR corolla is 35k) RWD base Mustang/Camaro competitor which (at least attempts to) reduce the frequency of the driver ending up on the sidewalk adjacent to all weekend car show event exits.

Is their anything new in that category that works better?

Tuning? I was addressing your first hand accounts of those supercharged accusumped GR Corollas which were disintegrating engines during cornering and had limited costly mods available.

I didnt realize that you were actually talking about the older Gr86s with its Subbie Boxer engines in place of the all new, higher priced Gr Corolla.
Click to expand...
How you mean does anything works better? Of course it does. You are still getting Subaru engine prone to oil starvation, they had QC issues that Toyota refused to address.
If you want track animal, buy used BMW for that money.

Corolla is interesting proposition, but I am not expecting much. Toyota is constantly using other companies to provide performance solutions. I am not holding my breath that suddenly they had revelation.
 
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