Originally Posted by dbias
Originally Posted by sloinker
I would use this:
.https://www.ravenol.de/en/products/usage/d/Product/show/p/ravenol-rup-sae-5w-40.html
Has BMW approvals for LL-04 and does have a little ester mixed with its PAO. The Red Line has a little too much calcium for my taste on a DI motor. AFAIK the Red Line uses mainly PAO with about 20% ester and some class III for the add pack carrier, div>
The Ravenol RUP 5w-40 is a pretty good looking oil. Low ash, LL04, HTHS 3.9 and NOACK of 6.
I think Ravenol RUP 5w-40 may be my new oil! Very similar to one another, but the RUP has an even lower Noack and Sulfated Ash content which will be even better for my DI motor. Same PAO content, with a special additive with Tungsten and Trinuclear Molybdenum to reduce wear/friction.
Usually, you don't want to run a "racing" oil for street use, but this Ravenol "racing" product is different in that it actually has formal approvals from manufacturers, including BMW, which means you're safe to run this on the street as well as on the track.
https://www.ravenol.de/fileadmin/content/documents/Ravenol-Schumacher-Presentation-EN.pdf
https://www.newtis.info/tisv2/a/en/f10-m5-lim/repair-manuals/11-engine/1VnZ1vFi9W
In my UOA thread ditching the factory fill, BMW 0w-30 under BMW LL-01 FE (fuel economy), for Ravenol VST 5w-40 (LL-01), "Oil_Film_Movies" piqued my curiosity for LL-04 as I was well aware of the rating being originally intended for diesels with DPF's, (had three vehicles with them,) but I didn't realize the spec had sort of come full circle here in the States with gasoline here better mimicing that of what is available in Europe, and thereby LL-04 has all the more so become applicable in gasoline motors in the USA as well, particularly those with modern DI-only where carbon build up can be a factor.
From Bimmerworld, about the differences between LL-01 vs LL-04.
Quote
LL-01 (2001). API SJ. ACEA A3/B3. SAE 0W30, 5W30, 5W40, 10W60. The first revision with detergents and additives brought in to work with the ridiculous 15,000 mile oil change interval that BMW promoted at the time. At the same time, certain components of the formula were removed or reduced (ZDDP). However, once cars and engines were out of warranty and mileage accumulated the nasty effects of extended oil changes were realized (i.e. oil sludge). LL-01 is compatible with engines approved for LL-98.
In 2016 BMW announced new 0W30 to replace 5W30. 0W30 carries the same LL-01 approval with a FE label, making it backwards compatible but also making newer models more fuel efficient.
LL-04 (2005). API SN. ACEA C3 (similar to A3). SAE 5W30, 5W40. The LL-04 oils have been greatly misunderstood in the past but this is now in greater demand. Most LL-04 oils are intended for Diesels, although it was also approved for gas engines in Europe and other world markets. BMW never certified LL-04 for the US (see next paragraph). Diesel oil has long been valued by engine builders and tuners because of its higher levels of ZDDP and higher HTHS ratings, both are excellent indicators of engine protection at higher temperatures. LL-04 also has a lower SAPS value which is good news for direct-injection engines (all BMW turbo engines since 2007). You won't find Genuine BMW LL-04 sold here but Red Line Euro-Series oil is produced around this standard.
As part of the efforts to make engine oil more environmentally friendly, the US EPA required ZDDP levels to be reduced in gasoline oil. However, Diesel oil was exempt from this ZDDP reduction. BMW never certified LL-04 for the US market because a) there weren't many Diesels for sale here, b) it was incompatible with the high amounts of sulfur and Ethanol in US fuel. However, since 2014 our gasoline more closely matches European formulas and interest in LL-04 has increased. LL-04 and LL-01 are interchangeable/compatible but LL-04 is preferred for its higher ZDDP and low SAPS.
https://www.bimmerworld.com/BMW-Engine-Oil/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yjNxfOoouso
https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/4922998/race-oil-with-oe-approvals-why
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
The radiator provides most of the cooling. For puttering around town and on interstates any "light" 40/"heavy" 30 weight BMW oil will work.
Personally it'd run a 30w but that's just me.
I know what you mean BUT, Texas Summer's can be brutal for 2+ months with temps over 100 °F, and a 40 just provides better protection in that environment over a 30. I had a 2015 Jeep Grand Cherokee with the 3.0L EcoDiesel that originally, when I bought it new, FCA said 5w-30. I heard of one too many of those motors suffering from internal failures and next thing we knew, FCA quietly changed the oil to 5w-40. So much so that they paid dealers to change the oil in every new EcoDiesel sitting on their lots, it was that "interesting." So for me, with the big timing chains moving the cams, Vanos, valvetronic, and two variable geometry turbochargers, I want all the protection in the heat that I can get.
Originally Posted by GZRider
Red Line or Ravenol should work but it's a BMW M so there is no lube on earth that will substitute for the DTF additive (Disposable Trust Fund) which is all but requisite to maintain those cars to 10 years and 100k miles.
I think you would be surprised how much more reliable these S63 motors are than some of the M motors in the past. I've seen many with 60k to 100k miles on them already and I expect to get that many and more out of mine. GM is switching over the "hot V" concept that BMW started with these motors over a decade ago.