Battery Charger Testing Results

[D1dad]

And they don’t with the pro logix?

At least it gives a voltage readout!

I would love for someone to confirm that the desulfation process works on the Pro Logix 4 amp version. For $40, it is a bargain.

I have the pl2140 and the readout for % charged is very generic, nothing like the Pulsetech xc400. As far as if it works for desulfation, I have no clue. Whenever I’ve used it overnight the battery ended up around 95-98%, not that that’s bad. I’m sure if I let it go through it’s “exercise” function for a few days it probably would have topped it off. The only battery I had that was brought back from the abyss was my boat battery and I did that with my Pulsetech. I do like the pro logix for long term storage. I left it hooked up on my car while I was away for 3 weeks since it has auto restart. It’s a good bargain for sure for $40, especially with all its features. I agree on the temp compensation thing. Decades have gone by without it and no issues.

 

[Quattro Pete]

I have the pl2140 and the readout for % charged is very generic, nothing like the Pulsetech xc400.

I was referring to PL2310 which does have a digital voltage and % charge readout.

 

[D1dad]

I was referring to PL2310 which does have a digital voltage and % charge readout.

Those do look nice and like something you’d use in a commercial setting. I think pro logix for what they charge, is a great deal. I know the cord on my $40 charger looks like something you’d use in a window air con.

 

[f355spider]

Those do look nice and like something you’d use in a commercial setting. I think pro logix for what they charge, is a great deal. I know the cord on my $40 charger looks like something you’d use in a window air con.

They have some nice features, like the ability to use as a power supply while coding a car...but at 10amps, or even 20amps, not sure that is sufficient. The shop I use, theirs is like 100 amps I believe. Most coding devices say 40amp minimum is desired, so not sure where these fit in for that use.

My issue is still that these larger units cannot be easily used for maintenance charging as they only have clamps. It would be cool if they added a dedicated low amperage output cable for maintenance use. (say for 4amps and below or something).

 

[D1dad]

How’s that Pulsetech?

 

[f355spider]

How’s that Pulsetech?

I need a few more weeks with it, but so far, I am not seeing it improving the state of charge or resistance over the Battery Minders.
Seems to perform similarly...which is not a knock, that is great. I'm comparing on some AGMs currently. I do have one flooded battery on my Tundra, and will try it for a week on that one, plugging in overnight each evening.

 

[D1dad]

I need a few more weeks with it, but so far, I am not seeing it improving the state of charge or resistance over the Battery Minders.
Seems to perform similarly...which is not a knock, that is great. I'm comparing on some AGMs currently. I do have one flooded battery on my Tundra, and will try it for a week on that one, plugging in overnight each

I’ve been alternating cars, one day on a battery minder, one day on a Pulsetech. I’m interested in seeing the algorithm compared to the battery minder.

 

[pasadena_commut]

My Harbor Freight 63350 seems to have failed, but not in a "dead as a door nail" manner. Near the end of charging, which was after many many hours, it used to charge an AGM battery with the screen showing a voltage dancing around 13.2-13.4V (the current is rapidly cycling at this point), until all bars appear, then the screen would turn green and show 13.2V. Similar behavior with a conventional lead acid battery. Now after a short while the voltage keeps going up and up, it eventually hits 14.9V where all bars appear and the screen turns green. It really should go to maintenance mode at that point (however it got to green screen == full), but it doesn't, or at least not quickly, it just sits at 14.9V. The mode was set to "12V AGM" or "12V STD" to match the battery, ambient temperatures were around 70F. On the 45AH Prius battery (tester says it only measures 40AH, it is about 4 years old) today it started at 12.42V / 69% SOC and ended at 12.85V / 100% SOC, in only 1 hour. Which does not add up, since .3x40 = 12AH and the charger only briefly hit 2A, then 1A, then went into its cycling mode, so it is abut 10AH shy of the 12AH it should have pushed in.

 

[ripcord]

My Harbor Freight 63350 seems to have failed, but not in a "dead as a door nail" manner. Near the end of charging, which was after many many hours, it used to charge an AGM battery with the screen showing a voltage dancing around 13.2-13.4V (the current is rapidly cycling at this point), until all bars appear, then the screen would turn green and show 13.2V. Similar behavior with a conventional lead acid battery. Now after a short while the voltage keeps going up and up, it eventually hits 14.9V where all bars appear and the screen turns green. It really should go to maintenance mode at that point (however it got to green screen == full), but it doesn't, or at least not quickly, it just sits at 14.9V. The mode was set to "12V AGM" or "12V STD" to match the battery, ambient temperatures were around 70F. On the 45AH Prius battery (tester says it only measures 40AH, it is about 4 years old) today it started at 12.42V / 69% SOC and ended at 12.85V / 100% SOC, in only 1 hour. Which does not add up, since .3x40 = 12AH and the charger only briefly hit 2A, then 1A, then went into its cycling mode, so it is abut 10AH shy of the 12AH it should have pushed in.

I had one of these. It worked great for 5 or 6 years and then failed with the voltage increasing into the 16v range as the battery neared a full charge.

 

[Trav]

They have some nice features, like the ability to use as a power supply while coding a car...but at 10amps, or even 20amps, not sure that is sufficient. The shop I use, theirs is like 100 amps I believe. Most coding devices say 40amp minimum is desired, so not sure where these fit in for that use.

My issue is still that these larger units cannot be easily used for maintenance charging as they only have clamps. It would be cool if they added a dedicated low amperage output cable for maintenance use. (say for 4amps and below or something).

Definitely not enough for many euro cars BMW F can go up over 50A+ during programming. Using a modified HP server power supply is a common hack for cheap.

 

[f355spider]

Definitely not enough for many euro cars BMW F can go up over 50A+ during programming. Using a modified HP server power supply is a common hack for cheap.

I have an old school battery charger with a 75 amp "booster" setting for starting a car...is that safe to use for that purpose?
I am very hesitant to do so.

 

[LeakySeals]

My Harbor Freight 63350 seems to have failed, but not in a "dead as a door nail" manner. Near the end of charging, which was after many many hours, it used to charge an AGM battery with the screen showing a voltage dancing around 13.2-13.4V (the current is rapidly cycling at this point), until all bars appear, then the screen would turn green and show 13.2V. Similar behavior with a conventional lead acid battery. Now after a short while the voltage keeps going up and up, it eventually hits 14.9V where all bars appear and the screen turns green. It really should go to maintenance mode at that point (however it got to green screen == full), but it doesn't, or at least not quickly, it just sits at 14.9V. The mode was set to "12V AGM" or "12V STD" to match the battery, ambient temperatures were around 70F. On the 45AH Prius battery (tester says it only measures 40AH, it is about 4 years old) today it started at 12.42V / 69% SOC and ended at 12.85V / 100% SOC, in only 1 hour. Which does not add up, since .3x40 = 12AH and the charger only briefly hit 2A, then 1A, then went into its cycling mode, so it is abut 10AH shy of the 12AH it should have pushed in.

I’ve been using mine for a few years now and it does not behave the same way for the types you mentioned. For AGM the charger goes up to 14.7-14.9 then falls back down to around 12.9 which is close to fully charged for AGM battery. It never goes into the 13 range the time that I’ve had it attached for a couple of days. I think the perform any desulfur function the charging has to be elevated?. Not sure but it seems to just flat line on AGM. Maybe I had to leave it on for longer.

This video is the way its behaving right now on a standard 12V lead acid battery with a 2019 day code. Been in storage for years.

 

[LeakySeals]

I can’t edit anymore.

 

[f355spider]

For AGM the charger goes up to 14.7-14.9 then falls back down to around 12.9 which is close to fully charged for AGM battery. It never goes into the 13 range the time that I’ve had it attached for a couple of days. I think the perform any desulfur function the charging has to be elevated?. Not sure but it seems to just flat line on AGM. Maybe I had to leave it on for longer.

The desulfation method depends on the algorithm, but for most that can be used with the battery in the car, it is going to be some sort of pulse technology. What you are describing above is the common algorithm to properly charge an AGM battery, not desulfate it. But properly charging it helps prevent sulfate formation.

I think there maybe something wrong with that charger/maintainer. 12.9vt for float is much too low, unless there is temperature compensation and its 120F in your garage.

Yes, charging should go up into the high 14vt range typically but for maintenance it should be around 13.3 to 13.6vt it is does not have temperature compensation (fixed float voltage). With temperature compensation it can go up to maybe 14.2 when cold and down to 12.9vt if it's really hot out.

With a flooded battery the float or maintenance voltages will be similar...usually a tad lower...perhaps 13.2 to 13.6 and some range if temperature compensated.

After charging an AGM, I would set it to the flooded setting to get the higher 13.5vt float voltage.

 

[pasadena_commut]

I’ve been using mine for a few years now and it does not behave the same way for the types you mentioned. For AGM the charger goes up to 14.7-14.9 then falls back down to around 12.9 which is close to fully charged for AGM battery. It never goes into the 13 range the time that I’ve had it attached for a couple of days. I think the perform any desulfur function the charging has to be elevated?. Not sure but it seems to just flat line on AGM. Maybe I had to leave it on for longer.

There is no "mode" indicator on this model. Yet it definitely has modes. When it first starts it begins with 12.x volts and works its way upward to 14.x (x because I don't recall the digits). This is some sort of probe mode, determining the state of the battery. I have seen it do this step more than once on a battery. Then it starts the actual charging which with a clamp ammeter shows a steady 2.0A. The voltage will be set to achieve that current. After a while it falls down to a steady 1.0A, again, with the voltage set to achieve that current. It then transitions to some sort of rapid pulse charging which is pretty much unreadable on my clamp ammeter. The corresponding voltage varies over a range like 13.2 to 13.4, jumping between those two values. At the end of this all the bars are filled in and the screen goes green. At that point it is supposed to go into float mode. There could be other modes which I never noticed, because no mode indicator!

I have only once seen this device put out 4A, and that was when it was charging two very large parallel batteries on a Ford F350 Super Duty. Calling it a 4A device is pretty much false advertising. (Maybe it does that at 6V?) The periods spent in 2.0 A constant and 1.0 A constant are usually a small fraction of the total charging time, most of which is spent in the pulse mode.

 

[ripcord]

I’ve been using mine for a few years now and it does not behave the same way for the types you mentioned. For AGM the charger goes up to 14.7-14.9 then falls back down to around 12.9 which is close to fully charged for AGM battery. It never goes into the 13 range the time that I’ve had it attached for a couple of days. I think the perform any desulfur function the charging has to be elevated?. Not sure but it seems to just flat line on AGM. Maybe I had to leave it on for longer.

This video is the way its behaving right now on a standard 12V lead acid battery with a 2019 day code. Been in storage for years.

View attachment 289465

Hmm... I used a DC amp clamp on my HF 4 amp charger to see how it's algorithm worked. On mine, I regularly saw it put out a nominal 4 amps on regular sized car batteries (groups 65, 34, 24, etc.). It would do the "probe mode" thing you mentioned and then did a series of constant current charges. It would put out 4 amps and hold it steady until the voltage climbed to about ~14.4v to 14.6v, then it would start over with a probe and then charge at 2 amps until the voltage climbed back to fourteen and a half volts. It would repeat the process with 1 amp and finish with .5 amps. With regular flooded batteries, the float charge would bounce around between 13.2v and 13.4v.

 

[Trav]

I have an old school battery charger with a 75 amp "booster" setting for starting a car...is that safe to use for that purpose?
I am very hesitant to do so.

No, it is not capable of producing that for a longer time or is the amps controlled or regulated depending on the load. You tube HP server mod for vehicle programming, $30 on ebay and it is a relatively easy job.

 

[doitmyself]

Just to stir the pot here, do we have any consensus that battery desulfation actually works with off the shelf chargers? A few years ago we had a website salesperson here that claimed they did. Many people think that they somewhat work, but it takes months. Years ago I read that some people home-built desulfators that actually did have the kahunas to work.

Opinions?

 

[f355spider]

Just to stir the pot here, do we have any consensus that battery desulfation actually works with off the shelf chargers? A few years ago we had a website salesperson here that claimed they did. Many people think that they somewhat work, but it takes months. Years ago I read that some people home-built desulfators that actually did have the kahunas to work.

Opinions?

From personal experience, I have found the Battery Minder brand did bring back two batteries (one AGM, the other flooded) that were dropping in CCA, and came back to exceed their CCA rating. In both cases they were run on another battery tender that also claimed to have pulse desulfation mode (Granite Digital Save a Battery 50 watt) during the float mode, but clearly did not work as they were connected several nights a week for a couple years. Once I switched to Battery Minders, I could see the improvement with my Ancel BA101 over the next several weeks. The improvement tapered off at about two months time. I continue to put them on the Battery minders at least a couple times a week overnight.

 

[ripcord]

Just to stir the pot here, do we have any consensus that battery desulfation actually works with off the shelf chargers? A few years ago we had a website salesperson here that claimed they did. Many people think that they somewhat work, but it takes months. Years ago I read that some people home-built desulfators that actually did have the kahunas to work.

Opinions?

I did a before and after test with the battery "reconditioning" setting of my Black and Decker 15 amp charger. I used it for 6 days on a weak 5 year old battery that would still marginally work to start a vehicle. After 6 days, the internal resistance on that battery increased as measured by an Ancel BA101 tester, so it made it worse.