Battery Charger Testing Results

[f355spider]

The question the is, what if I have about 4 flooded sealed batteries of different capacity?

I reread the IFUs for both the 2012 and 128CEC2. It makes no mention of capacity differences, but if the batteries are not properly desulfated in advance, the desulfation will favor the largest battery in the group. So they recommend desulfation is performed individually, not as a group. Once they are desulfated, they can be maintained as a group...but again, the smallest in the group may not benefit as much as the largest battery.

There may be something to this, which I will need to test. One of my BMWs has two batteries (they are original Varta and 6+ years old), an H9 AGM and H5 AGM. I use the Y adapter from Battery Minder and have them on the 128CEC2 for the past two years or so. The H9 is rated at 950 CCA and tests at well over 1000 CCA, while the smaller H5 rated at 660 CCA is testing around 569 CCA. Still passes the test as a "good battery", but I wonder if a month or two on the Battery Minder maintained separately might improve the results? I just went out and removed the Y adapter and have it maintained by itself. I'll report back in a month.

 

[f355spider]

BTW, I was just on the Pulse Tech website, and noticed they have a sale going on both of their 4 amp battery maintainers. Their XC400 has had an ongoing sale for a while at $69.99. But their XC450 is $49.99 (50% off) through tomorrow.

The difference is the XC450 cannot charge multiple batteries, but adds the feature of charging lithium ion, which could be useful in the future. Neither has temperature compensation.

I'd don't presently own a Pulse Tech, but am very tempted at this price point.
https://pulsetech.com/products/xtreme-charge-xc450-battery-charger-maintainer-and-conditioner

 

[Mav123]

BTW, I was just on the Pulse Tech website, and noticed they have a sale going on both of their 4 amp battery maintainers. Their XC400 has had an ongoing sale for a while at $69.99. But their XC450 is $49.99 (50% off) through tomorrow.

The difference is the XC450 cannot charge multiple batteries, but adds the feature of charging lithium ion, which could be useful in the future. Neither has temperature compensation.

I'd don't presently own a Pulse Tech, but am very tempted at this price point.
https://pulsetech.com/products/xtreme-charge-xc450-battery-charger-maintainer-and-conditioner

Thank you for the heads-up. Of course, it wouldn't hurt to try. They have a 30-day return policy, pretty sure we'd pay the shipping vs if you were to buy on Amazon. If it doesn't work out, you could also return, but w/o the shipping charge.
When you mentioned their XC450 is capable of charging lithium-ion batteries and could be "future-proof", what were you seeing on the horizon, do you see we eventually will transition to this technology instead of lead acid for cars?

I am surprised that we as a Nation have not adopted a capacitor based system. This type of tech is almost bulletproof, it does not degrade with what I've seen.

 

[f355spider]

Thank you for the heads-up. Of course, it wouldn't hurt to try. They have a 30-day return policy, pretty sure we'd pay the shipping vs if you were to buy on Amazon. If it doesn't work out, you could also return, but w/o the shipping charge.
When you mentioned their XC450 is capable of charging lithium-ion batteries and could be "future-proof", what were you seeing on the horizon, do you see we eventually will transition to this technology instead of lead acid for cars?

I am surprised that we as a Nation have not adopted a capacitor based system. This type of tech is almost bulletproof, it does not degrade with what I've seen.

$12.45 shipping charge (even when ordering two) and no sales tax. Amazon sells this for $99.50 with free shipping and free returns, but charges sales tax.

I don't know about "future proof", but may be useful in the future. Though I bought my first lithium ion battery for my motorcycle at least 9 years ago from Deltran, maker of Battery Tender brand battery tenders. It was like $115 at the time, so about three times the cost of a flooded battery, but I was changing those every three to four years. (and I like the zero maintenance of lithium) Surprisingly, it still works...both the battery and the charger. I would have thought lithium ion would have fallen in price and availability for cars...but alas, not yet.

 

[Mav123]

I reread the IFUs for both the 2012 and 128CEC2. It makes no mention of capacity differences, but if the batteries are not properly desulfated in advance, the desulfation will favor the largest battery in the group. So they recommend desulfation is performed individually, not as a group. Once they are desulfated, they can be maintained as a group...but again, the smallest in the group may not benefit as much as the largest battery.

There may be something to this, which I will need to test. One of my BMWs has two batteries (they are original Varta and 6+ years old), an H9 AGM and H5 AGM. I use the Y adapter from Battery Minder and have them on the 128CEC2 for the past two years or so. The H9 is rated at 950 CCA and tests at well over 1000 CCA, while the smaller H5 rated at 660 CCA is testing around 569 CCA. Still passes the test as a "good battery", but I wonder if a month or two on the Battery Minder maintained separately might improve the results? I just went out and removed the Y adapter and have it maintained by itself. I'll report back in a month.

I found a "new" battery in my garage, apparently it was just sitting there. It is rated for 690 CCA, but measures after I put a Ctek charger on it, 488 CCA, the internal resistance is 6 mΩ.

I am amazed how you and Patrick were able to maintain CCAs well above the rated specs 6+ yrs later.

 

[Mav123]

$12.45 shipping charge. Amazon sells this for $99.50 with free shipping and free returns.

I don't know about "future proof", but may be useful in the future. Though I bought my first lithium ion battery for my motorcycle at least 9 years ago from Deltran, maker of Battery Tender brand battery tenders. It was like $115 at the time, so about three times the cost of a flooded battery, but I was changing those every three to four years. (and I like the zero maintenance of lithium) Surprisingly, it still works...both the battery and the charger. I would have thought lithium ion would have fallen in price and availability for cars...but alas, not yet.

Yes, Amazon is not too shy of overcharging but providing free shipping.
Careful with their chargers, they are rated at 4 amps, a bit too much for the longevity of a battery to be constantly using.

 

[Mav123]

Yes, Amazon is not too shy of overcharging but providing free shipping.
Careful with their chargers, they are rated at 4 amps, a bit too much for the longevity of a battery to be constantly using.

By the way, I show that the same seller was charging $59.50 from March 25 to March 31 of this year. I have a price tracker app on my PC, an add-on to my browser, Keepa and Camelizer. Outsmart the platform at its own "game".

 

[Mav123]

I cannot tell the difference but BM docs says the BM 128CEC2 in the constant voltage stage tries to top off the battery to 0.1% of max current storage while the 2012 does 0.5% before going into float voltage.

Thank you, it seems that the BM 128CEC2 tries to squire as much as possible to a battery.

 

[Mav123]

I reread the IFUs for both the 2012 and 128CEC2. It makes no mention of capacity differences, but if the batteries are not properly desulfated in advance, the desulfation will favor the largest battery in the group. So they recommend desulfation is performed individually, not as a group. Once they are desulfated, they can be maintained as a group...but again, the smallest in the group may not benefit as much as the largest battery.

There may be something to this, which I will need to test. One of my BMWs has two batteries (they are original Varta and 6+ years old), an H9 AGM and H5 AGM. I use the Y adapter from Battery Minder and have them on the 128CEC2 for the past two years or so. The H9 is rated at 950 CCA and tests at well over 1000 CCA, while the smaller H5 rated at 660 CCA is testing around 569 CCA. Still passes the test as a "good battery", but I wonder if a month or two on the Battery Minder maintained separately might improve the results? I just went out and removed the Y adapter and have it maintained by itself. I'll report back in a month.

I found a video that shows a possible culprit why your batteries are not charged up equally, balanced charging. It talked how to properly connect to mitigate it. Of course, it is meant for multiple batteries, like 4, but you could experiment.


https://www.impactbattery.com/blog/post/how-to-charge-marine-and-rv-batteries-in-parallel

 

[f355spider]

I found a video that shows a possible culprit why your batteries are not charged up equally, balanced charging. It talked how to properly connect to mitigate it. Of course, it is meant for multiple batteries, like 4, but you could experiment.


https://www.impactbattery.com/blog/post/how-to-charge-marine-and-rv-batteries-in-parallel

I'm not removing the batteries to maintain them.
They have to be maintained while installed in the car. They are electrically isolated by the BMW Intelligent Battery Sensor ECU, and used for separate functions. The main battery (H9) for starting and running the car, the aux H5 for running all accessories when the engine is off when using the start/stop function. Which I have fully programmed/coded off, except when using ECO driving mode.

Using a combination of two pig tails and the Battery Minder Y adapter has clearly worked fine the past three plus years it has been installed (first using a Granite Digital 50 watt "save a battery" tender). The past two years using the Battery Minder 128CEC2. The unbalance issue could conceivably be resolved by simply running the Battery Minder directly to the smaller of the two batteries for a month, perhaps every 6 months. I will check for the next month and see if it improves. Or, if I purchase the Pulse Tech, it appears to desulfate in a much quicker process of a few days.

I'm not even clear what caused (after 6 years) for the smaller of the two batteries to have a slightly lower capacity than rated, versus the main starting battery. It still passes the test on an Ancel BA101. It may be the "normal" aging process. Many owners of my model car (M550ix) have replaced one or both batteries at this point, usually this smaller one (H5).

 

[D1dad]

BTW, I was just on the Pulse Tech website, and noticed they have a sale going on both of their 4 amp battery maintainers. Their XC400 has had an ongoing sale for a while at $69.99. But their XC450 is $49.99 (50% off) through tomorrow.

The difference is the XC450 cannot charge multiple batteries, but adds the feature of charging lithium ion, which could be useful in the future. Neither has temperature compensation.

I'd don't presently own a Pulse Tech, but am very tempted at this price point.
https://pulsetech.com/products/xtreme-charge-xc450-battery-charger-maintainer-and-conditioner

I think you’d like it. I just had my cars that are usually on the battery minders on the Pulsetechs all weekend. It’s a way different algorithm than BM uses but very effective. That’s what brought back my old boat battery that sat discharged all winter. My 18 rogue gets the Pulsetech exclusively and always tests full charged and way above the CCA on the sticker. For $62 I don’t know that there’s a better deal out there for the quality.

 

[Mav123]

I think you’d like it. I just had my cars that are usually on the battery minders on the Pulsetechs all weekend. It’s a way different algorithm than BM uses but very effective. That’s what brought back my old boat battery that sat discharged all winter. My 18 rogue gets the Pulsetech exclusively and always tests full charged and way above the CCA on the sticker. For $62 I don’t know that there’s a better deal out there for the quality.

Which version of Pulsetech do you have and find beneficial? XC400 or XC450 ? And which version of BM do you use?

 

[D1dad]

Which version of Pulsetech do you have and find beneficial? XC400 or XC450 ? And which version of BM do you use?

I actually have the 400 and the 450. The 450 has an agm setting, although I don’t know that it matters. The 400 will resume if a power outage happens while the 450 doesn’t. You also can add the quad link set up to the
400 but not the 450. The 400 also has percentage indicators which I like. But, @ $50 the 450 is hard to pass up. I rotate back in 4th between my 2012s and Pulsetechs, I figured what one may not do, the other does. So far so good.

 

[f355spider]

I think you’d like it. I just had my cars that are usually on the battery minders on the Pulsetechs all weekend. It’s a way different algorithm than BM uses but very effective. That’s what brought back my old boat battery that sat discharged all winter. My 18 rogue gets the Pulsetech exclusively and always tests full charged and way above the CCA on the sticker. For $62 I don’t know that there’s a better deal out there for the quality.

I ended up buying two of the 450s, as I intend to give one to my buddy to try as well.

 

[D1dad]

I ended up buying two of the 450s, as I intend to give one to my buddy to try as well.

You’re a good friend lol. I’ve tracked these things and gave up trying to figure out how they work. It’s a pretty standard algorithm until they go into float mode. At that point they’ll maintain @13.4, give or take and the charging light goes off. Then a few hours later they charge again and hit the battery with 14.6 or so for a time period. I left a battery on the 400 that was reading “replace” on my ancel and it came back to good. Between the Pulsetech and the northern tool that battery will probably make it another year. They are only 4 amps but can charge a battery relatively quick. I emailed them on whether the higher float voltage was a concern and they indicated that’s how they work. I found a video of a guy getting 13 yrs out of a flooded battery only ever using a Pulsetech on it. Apparently it’s more high frequency than volts. My water level in my flooded battery didn’t change in the week I left it hooked up, which is good.

 

[f355spider]

You’re a good friend lol. I’ve tracked these things and gave up trying to figure out how they work. It’s a pretty standard algorithm until they go into float mode. At that point they’ll maintain @13.4, give or take and the charging light goes off. Then a few hours later they charge again and hit the battery with 14.6 or so for a time period. I left a battery on the 400 that was reading “replace” on my ancel and it came back to good. Between the Pulsetech and the northern tool that battery will probably make it another year. They are only 4 amps but can charge a battery relatively quick. I emailed them on whether the higher float voltage was a concern and they indicated that’s how they work. I found a video of a guy getting 13 yrs out of a flooded battery only ever using a Pulsetech on it. Apparently it’s more high frequency than volts. My water level in my flooded battery didn’t change in the week I left it hooked up, which is good.

You might try an inexpensive bluetooth battery monitor from eBay. I have one on one of my cars and use that as the test bed to figure out how the algorithm works. It can graph out on the app, in one day, seven day and 15 day increments, showing voltage over time. If it has temperature compensation, you can see the daily rise and fall of temperature change in my garage. I can also watch how the bulk, aborption and float voltages work.

 

[Quattro Pete]

You might try an inexpensive bluetooth battery monitor from eBay.

Do you have a link to the one you bought?

 

[f355spider]

Do you have a link to the one you bought?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/3645902572...+bluetooth+monitor&sacat=0&relatedSearch=true

I have been using the Vgate for about three years. You download a free app to use it. Be aware there are other features on the app, like a car finder feature to find your car in a parking lot, but this unit doesn't take advantage of that app feature, so be sure to turn off the location services within the app. There was some concerns from users about why it needed location information, thinking it was nefarious, but was simply a feature that the Vgate doesn't use. I have found the app to be very useful. If you want to run multiple units, then you need to purchase a fee based app, but I don't believe it was expensive...it was like a $5 one time fee or something like that.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Thanks. So do you have it connected to the battery permanently?

 

[f355spider]

Thanks. So do you have it connected to the battery permanently?

Yes, that is how it works. It is constantly data logging, you simply open the app when you are within Bluetooth range to read the current and stored results. It will log the last one or two starts (cranking test) which can give you a quick indication if your battery is on the way out, as that puts a significant load on the battery. I have this on my Ferrari as the battery is in a very inaccessible location (behind a panel in the passenger foot well) that requires getting tools out to access the battery to test it. This is a much easier way for me to keep constant tabs on the battery health.