Auto-Rx & MMO

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I wanted too say that I have some concerns here, I looked at some old threads, there were 2 of them where people asked about the Maintenance Dose of arx, and neither Frank or Rick20 is in either of the posts.

On the ARX site they mention that the maintenance dose was not in the original application but we have learned that a maintenance dose is beneficial, this shows me that Frank did not test this product.

Back when arx came out, the clean phase for arx was 500 miles, what is it now, 2500 miles, and if synthetic oil was used when arx came out it was 750 miles, this shows me again that this product was not tested.

The applications for the Clean Phase keep changing, is it going to be 3000 or more miles down the line.

My concern is that this product was designed for a printing press machine and not an automobile engine. The only test I can figure out is that Frank made sure this product could hold up too the heat in an engine.

I have a feeling that the reason arx attacks other oil additives is because in creating arguments, conflicts, and scare tactics they are keeping us from realizing that this product has limitations. Do the Amsoil reps attack other oil's, I have not seen it, that is because Amsoil has tests on there oil's and they can stand on there own 2 feet.

The other reason arx attacks other oil additives and anyone who questions there product is because of money, a thread starts about another oil additive, and arx jumps in, attack the product, cast doubt, divide and conquer. There position is to say anything to keep selling product. If you are lining arxs pockets you are a friend, the minute you mention another oil additive you are a threat.

I care what is best for my car, and I am sure many other members feel the same way, I sometimes feel that arx does not have our best interests at heart, but only there's.

I tell Frank my oil filter's are clogging up, his response is I don't know why, I know why he does not know why, he is a chemist and a businessman, not a car guy.

If arx did all that it claimed then I would not be using MMO right now, Frank made a great product for applications that use some sort of hydraulic fluid in a closed system:

1) Transmissions
2) Powersteering
3) Differentials

I can say this because I used the product for 24,000 miles, did it rejuvinate my valve seals, no, but I am not faulting arx because they were very old, I replaced my rocker arms and pushrods at 360,000 miles, did arx clean them up between 343,000 miles and 360,000 miles, no.

ARX does work, but a printing press environment is totally different than a car engine environment, if you use arx it may take a long time to clean things up.

If you want to learn everything about ARX, go too the user's list and click on Frank's name and you can read all of the posts and make up your own mind about arx.
 
Brent, much of the evolution of Auto-Rx in terms of mileage has been as much about broader appeal as it has with the change in motor oil over the same time span. The current 2500/3000 mile application is the winner when it came to people who wanted it NOW vs. those that didn't want to disrupt their routine and use too much oil over too short a time span. To take care of the want it now crowd Frank came up with the Fast Track application.

No product makes all the people happy all of the time.
 
Gary, as you know I have never been a huge supportor of the fast track, ARX application. However there is no question that upping the cleaning dose is faster towards the desired results. I still contend that by doing two cleaning and rinses as per instructions, result in better results. I would also go on to state that there is really no wasted oil running a 2500 mile cleaning phase on dino, followed by a 3000 mile rinse. This is all the recommended mileage the oil companies put forth anyways, for conventional oil.

Bottom line is that the product works with temperature, oil flow, and supplemental pressure, as well as concentration, within the host oil.

Gary, you are right in that Frank listens to his customers. Fast track is just an example.
 
I have always had better success with using more ARX then required in the cleaning phase and running it double as long with a twice as long rinse cycle. Changing the filter half way in between each cycle.

This yields far better results from my experiences than following ARX's instructions.

I think he has conservative mileages because he has to blanket all makes/models/engine conditions on the road and doesn't want to be sued in the process should someone not fit in the usual mould and engine damage be a result.

wink.gif
 
The problem with arx working with temperature is that many people use there cars for short trip driving where the oil does not heat up too the proper temp for arx too work.

I had a member on here who had a work truck, that was driven 4 miles too work, and at the end of the day 4 miles back home, he did this for years and was using MMO in his oil, his engine was spotless, MMO does not need heat, arx does.

I read a thread on here where some guys did not notice a difference with arx in there engines until about 400 miles, and you are recommending this fast track application on a product that works slow.

On the Arx site it says We Are The Experts, experts at selling product.
 
ARX works and works well if given the right conditions and those are the proper non-conflicting chemistry oils, heat, and a long time to work (double the mileage recommended IMO), and clean filters in between to catch all the loosened debris.

I can't comment on MMO as a cleaner as I haven't used it personally for this purpose, but after seeing what it is made up of in a VOA I would imagine that it would do great things like ARX does in less mileage and without the need for heat.

JMO, YRMV
 
I'm not c3po but: Sales from member sponsors are part of the mix. As well as endorsements from customers who found products that work well.

AD
 
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I don't think it's unreasonable that we find ARX has changed their instructions over the years. Rather I think it shows customer feedback and periodic testing are fine tuning the various applications for best results.
 
Originally Posted By: dbdeland
c3po,

Correct me if I am wrong but discussing products and how they work is BITOG and sales are connected with this forum.


According to my knowledge, and correct me if I am wrong, but ARX is no longer a site sponsor on this board, would you care to explain why ARX is no longer a site sponsor, they do have there own Forum, I am just wondering why you have not pointed members and non memebers too your forum.

You mention the word sales, see guys, ARX cares about sales. So this BITOG Forum is not about exchanging information, everyone get out your credit card so arx can swipe it.
 
c3po, If it wasn't for the exchange of information on BITOG i would have not purchased MMO & AR-X. The exchange of information is what led me to buy both products. Now if a site sponsor or any one pushing a product would be a big turn off for me and i would avoid buying there product! I don't see that happening here! I didn't see Castrol pushing there products when they were a sponsor and i don't see Mobil pushing there products nor MMO or AR-X! Not even the Amsoil dealers on BITOG push there products! IMO the exchange of information & sales go hand in hand just like win a race on Sunday, sell on Monday!
Joe
 
Originally Posted By: jmb106
c3po, If it wasn't for the exchange of information on BITOG i would have not purchased MMO & AR-X. The exchange of information is what led me to buy both products. Now if a site sponsor or any one pushing a product would be a big turn off for me and i would avoid buying there product! I don't see that happening here! I didn't see Castrol pushing there products when they were a sponsor and i don't see Mobil pushing there products nor MMO or AR-X! Not even the Amsoil dealers on BITOG push there products! IMO the exchange of information & sales go hand in hand just like win a race on Sunday, sell on Monday!
Joe

You aren't serious, are you? Maybe the reason you haven't seen Frank 'push a product' is because those threads are history now, just like him because both were a black eye for this site. Maybe you don't realize it, but some of the biggest people behind AutoRx in Frank's absence are those who have been employed by Frank, those who have been given product by Frank and moderators on Frank's forum.

There's nothing I've said here that is a matter of opinion, either.
 
Originally Posted By: greenaccord02
Originally Posted By: jmb106
c3po, If it wasn't for the exchange of information on BITOG i would have not purchased MMO & AR-X. The exchange of information is what led me to buy both products. Now if a site sponsor or any one pushing a product would be a big turn off for me and i would avoid buying there product! I don't see that happening here! I didn't see Castrol pushing there products when they were a sponsor and i don't see Mobil pushing there products nor MMO or AR-X! Not even the Amsoil dealers on BITOG push there products! IMO the exchange of information & sales go hand in hand just like win a race on Sunday, sell on Monday!
Joe

You aren't serious, are you? Maybe the reason you haven't seen Frank 'push a product' is because those threads are history now, just like him because both were a black eye for this site. Maybe you don't realize it, but some of the biggest people behind AutoRx in Frank's absence are those who have been employed by Frank, those who have been given product by Frank and moderators on Frank's forum.

There's nothing I've said here that is a matter of opinion, either.


greenaccord02, I do not think this guy has been reading the whole thread here.

It would really be nice if we could talk about different oil additives without another oil additive company coming in and slamming the product. As far as MMO goes, everyone here has been talking about the product based on our experiences, why is it that people who use MMO just talk about the product, whereas a few people who are using arx attack MMO and every other oil additive, if that is the way it is going to be, then I will be sticking up for the other oil additives.
It is now time for anyone who wants to attack another oil additive too have facts or too say the reasons why this oil additve did not work.

Sorry SaturnFan, but here it goes, everyone knows I went after him and then appologized, who do you think told me to go after him, anyways I had no right to bash him for promoting Berryman's B-12 because I was pushing another oil additive, and that was wrong, but I also could not bash him because I never used Berryman's B-12, I may think it is a bad product, I may not be a fan of it, but if I have no experience and no observations from using it then my response means nothing.

Sometimes I feel we do not have exchange for information, but instead a product is just slammed into our heads because it was that way on here for a long time, and that is wrong. We do not need products slammed into our heads, let the product speak for themselves, and if we ask for tests and proof, and you can not show us any, then at least I will not buy the product.

Everything greenaccord02 has said is correct.

jmb106, thanks for at least posting.
 
jmb106, I sincerely appreciate your post. One day certain folks want independent tests, the next day they don't want it. The same folks that accuse ARX enthusiasts of pirating threads, do the same thing about folks that are trying to start an ARX string. You need not look to far, just look at the poor orginal poster regarding his recent purchase of a 1994 Celica.

Frank might not be active on this board any longer, but his product is still the measuring stick of any other products designed to clean. I am not saying that other products don't clean.
But I am hard pressed to find any real proof that these other products can effectively clean while providing the supplemental lubricity to safe guard the release of contaminants in an "in situ" cleaning mode to the extent that Franks product does.

With respect to the maintenance dose, trashed by some folks above: the various third party tests done through oil analysis, fuel economy, reduced emissions are merely helpful tools make an informed consumer aware of likely benefits. Nobody is holding a gun to anybody's head with respect to what product to buy. I would hope that you all have enough faculty to control your own purse strings.

I have yet to see a cleaning product perform over the service life of an oil change, without releasing a fairly high percentage of its formulation out through the crankcase ventilation system.

I don't see any other green science cleaning products. Hey, I'm proud to have been part of the ARX formulation development. Bash me all you like. And no, I don't get paid by ARX for posting here. No, I don't hold any stock in Auto-Rx. I do get paid for evaluating and conducting tests on raw materials used in ARX. I like this board. Call it a hobby if you will. May be I like to try and keep the board fair and balanced. Is that a problem?
 
I actually feel the maintenance dose is beneficial, the question I ask is to back up your claims with tests from an independent lab, I cannot take 3rd party tests seriously because there are too many variables.

I am looking for a product that cleans an engine, it does not matter to me whether it is green science or not.

My uncle was over today and all he has ever used in his 1999 Chevrolet Monte Carlo is Mobil 1, I took the oil cap off and it was absolutely spotless inside, he told me he changes the oil every 6000 miles, I asked him about the 2 bottles of arx I gave him, he did a Clean and Rinse and noticed nothing. He did the Maintenance Dose and still noticed nothing.

His conclusion was that this engine was already clean and this shows a quality synthetic motor oil like Mobil 1 does have cleaning abilities.

We just may see that a quality oil like Mobil 1 does have cleaning abilities and if this is the case then we may not need oil additives.
 
Originally Posted By: Rick20
--- just look at the poor orginal poster regarding his recent purchase of a 1994 Celica. ---


I didn't feel abused by you in that thread c3po, I have been following your comments for a while ,and I know you have a burr under your saddle. I think I have a sense of why you do, and while some of the reasons make sense to me, others don't. I do want to read about everyone's experience, positive and negative. I may feel sore about the product when I am all done, or I may be pleased, maybe I'll end up using your MMO/arx cocktail, maybe I'll give up driving, who knows?
 
I have to apologize if I made it seem like I was making fun of you, this was not the case, what matters is that you get the best desired result from using arx, there are many people on here who can give you that advice, it might be best to read everything on here and make up your own mind.
 
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