TiGeo
$50 site donor 2024
That looks like what you would see where I am in central VA, not what I'd expect in CO where you actually have winter and folks should know better. Combo no winter tires and driving beyond the conditions.
Are winter tires "worth it"?
- Thread starter Ws6
- Start date
I put the Blizzaks on the R before Halloween. Discount Tire in Highlands Ranch was slammed, but I had an appointment.
4 proper winter tires on an AWD is hard to beat, the war is awesome, but the challenge in Colorado is dealing with these bozos (who think 4WD and AWD somehow help stability or stopping) - not the slick roads…
I was in Denver yesterday when this hit and had to drive back. Took I25 and 83 through Castle Rock. I was expecting absolute horror on the roads as I looked neighborhood Facebook page and people absolutely freaking out.
Got from downtown Denver to NE Colorado Springs in 1.30hrs.
One constant on Facebook: “if you don’t have AWD don’t go out!” Or my favorite:”even with AWD, I was sliding.”
CO has tricky weather. Lot’s of sun that melts stuff fast. People think they can get away with “el chepo” all seasons.
@TiGeo
This is why people get in trouble. After snow stops, it clears out fairly fast. We don’t have depressing weather. And sun is strong! You have to have some sunscreen in the car all year around. This was taken at 6,500ft altitude. Through fairly well tinted windows, I can still feel sun, like something is crawling on my skin. That obliterates remaining snow fast after snowplows remove it and treat roads (if they treat, bcs. they bet on sun too). People think they can ride out one day storm and next day it will be fine. The problem is that these are the Rockies. It is high. So you get a lot of micro climates. Yesterday I went to Denver all good, in the Speings, some 40-60mls away (depending where in Denver or Springs) 6” of snow that covered layer of ice.
So, people play roulette:” maybe I won’t get in accident during bad storm, and live to see sun.”
And they truly believe they are right. If you tell them anything, they will find 100’s of excuses why they don’t have snow tires.
This is why people get in trouble. After snow stops, it clears out fairly fast. We don’t have depressing weather. And sun is strong! You have to have some sunscreen in the car all year around. This was taken at 6,500ft altitude. Through fairly well tinted windows, I can still feel sun, like something is crawling on my skin. That obliterates remaining snow fast after snowplows remove it and treat roads (if they treat, bcs. they bet on sun too). People think they can ride out one day storm and next day it will be fine. The problem is that these are the Rockies. It is high. So you get a lot of micro climates. Yesterday I went to Denver all good, in the Speings, some 40-60mls away (depending where in Denver or Springs) 6” of snow that covered layer of ice.
So, people play roulette:” maybe I won’t get in accident during bad storm, and live to see sun.”
And they truly believe they are right. If you tell them anything, they will find 100’s of excuses why they don’t have snow tires.
That can't be the Front Range. I don't see a windshield covered in rock chips...
Lol. This one on BMW and on wife’s Tiguan just doesn’t give up. And BMW has bunch of track tine with all kind of stuff hitting windshield. But, you once you turn towards the sun, you can see something like hundreds of small chips. I actually hope this one cracks.
Put on a side safety thing. Considering labor rates and parts, if they get you once out of trouble, they paid themselves off multiple times.
Tires make YUGE difference.
Slippery conditions in any vehicle, best tires ever made, can and do expose people who just plain rass can't drive and really have limited ability to control the 5000 lb+ vehicle they have put into motion. I have seen people......people "driving" cars coming at me sideways who have simply given up and let go of the steering wheel. Physics escapes them and apparently the thought they could kill someone's small children.
Slippery conditions in any vehicle, best tires ever made, can and do expose people who just plain rass can't drive and really have limited ability to control the 5000 lb+ vehicle they have put into motion. I have seen people......people "driving" cars coming at me sideways who have simply given up and let go of the steering wheel. Physics escapes them and apparently the thought they could kill someone's small children.
Typical story going up or down I70 when storm hits. Bunch of people renting 6,000lbs SUV’s bcs. they think that is recipe to deal with snow. Then they quickly realize more mass means more trouble.
I will take BMW and Tiguan over Sequoia any time in snow, regardless that Sequoia is also on snow tires.
There are many factors, it easily depends.
Does one live in Hancock, MI or Central IL?
What type of vehicle? An AWD CR-V, or 2WD?
Every ‘all season’ tire isn’t equal with traction, not by a long shot. As an example, say one has the Michelin Defender type tire on an AWD, with reasonable tread or better. I submit you likely don’t ‘need’ dedicated winter tires.
So many get wrapped up with 4wd or AWD anywhere that gets a little snow. One can jump ahead driving a front wheel drive with winter tires, as to sticking on the road. I’ve seen people get the AWD, then let tire quality lapse.
Lastly, I know more than a handful of funerals that didn’t have to be, due to sliding out of control into a fatal accident. Some were very tragic, kids involved. In these instances, the family would gladly go back and pay $5000 for each winter tire. Yes, 5k x 4 = $20k.
You are always at the mercy of others, sliding into you, out of control.
Does one live in Hancock, MI or Central IL?
What type of vehicle? An AWD CR-V, or 2WD?
Every ‘all season’ tire isn’t equal with traction, not by a long shot. As an example, say one has the Michelin Defender type tire on an AWD, with reasonable tread or better. I submit you likely don’t ‘need’ dedicated winter tires.
So many get wrapped up with 4wd or AWD anywhere that gets a little snow. One can jump ahead driving a front wheel drive with winter tires, as to sticking on the road. I’ve seen people get the AWD, then let tire quality lapse.
Lastly, I know more than a handful of funerals that didn’t have to be, due to sliding out of control into a fatal accident. Some were very tragic, kids involved. In these instances, the family would gladly go back and pay $5000 for each winter tire. Yes, 5k x 4 = $20k.
You are always at the mercy of others, sliding into you, out of control.
I'm just the opposite, If I absolutely have to be somewhere, I'm taking my dually every time. Now saying that, if I'm just running into Woodland Park, I'm taking the Civic, no matter how hard it's snowing and blowing. Studded snows on everything I own.
Nope. Can’t agree.
Your AWD vehicle with “good” all seasons is exactly what I used to watch sliding down hills, crashing into others and in the ditch during a Vermont winter.
AWD cannot help you stop or turn.
Most wrecks happen as a result of an inability to stop or turn.
So, maybe in Virginia Beach, AWD with good all weather tires like Nokian would be good, and in fact, that’s the XC.
But the AWD with all seasons would be insufficient where there is actual winter weather.
Saw three Subarus wreck on my road one snowy afternoon in Stowe.
THREE
On the same day, in the same spot.
They were hopelessly and hilariously unprepared to stop because they had all season tires. They hit trees or ended up in someone’s yard. AWD is not magic. Can’t make up for inadequate tires.
I gave one driver a ride in my ancient RWD Volvo wagon that was properly equipped with Nokian Hakapellittas.
He marveled at the traction of my “AWD” Volvo. “Nah, it’s Rear wheel drive”, I said.
I must say my 1985 245Ti with snows was 100% better than my 1996 855 FWD with snows. No comparison.
RWD is million times predictable. FWD uphill absolutely SUCKS. Just when you need the grip surface loaded up, it's not.
Even my Tacoma is RWD only - it seems better than FWD. I will use 4x4 mode, not never feel over confident and pretty useless in tight quarters when grip is given. Then again, no grip - front and rear lockers are just two switch flix (Rear, front) (compressor has separate switch to)
One factor I don't see discussed here is temperature. Snow tires use rubber compounds formulated for sub-zero temperatures to keep the tread pliable. I also live in Colorado and wait until the seasonal temps drop before mounting my snows. While all-season tires work OK, there's nothing like snow tires (currently on Michelin X-Ice on my Nissan Versa HB) on all four sides when the roads get slick.
I mean, we did discuss it numerous times. Like everything else in this topic. But, each winter we just need to repeat topic bcs. there is always someone.
4WD
$50 site donor 2025
I’m happy to pay my $18/day additional fee rentals bcs they obviously stop and corner better …
Earlier this year I decided I had to bring my 4 wheeler to a motocross track for an "open ride" day. During a pretty crazy snowstorm. The roads weren't plowed and we already had 6-8'' of snow. It was just hardpack with more coming down and very blustery. Loaded the 4 wheeler on my small utility trailer and hooked it up to the V8, RWD Grand marquis. I'm running snow tires on it and have weight in the back for extra ballast.
It took a few hours to get down there but I did it. A few times on the interstate I had to have a bit more speed than I wanted to get up the hills but the Grand Marquis handled it. A few of the hills there were AWD vehicles that couldn't get enough traction to get up it.
At one point, a Crosstrek on regular tires decided to fly by me. I was going at what I felt the safe limit was (45). The crosstrek was sliding as the driver was passing me. I joked and said I'll see him in the ditch shortly.
He wasn't in the ditch but we did have to stop for a few minutes because the car was on it's lid in the middle of the road about 20 miles later.
RWD is so predictable. I had a lot of people telling me how bad my Grand Marquis would be in the snow. Uphill is definitely an advantage over FWD. No one believes me but the Marquis is so much more stable on the highway than the Forester it replaced ... and I'm running the same exact snow tires on it.
I also came across a situation last winter where I think having RWD was actually better than AWD (with snow tires) . Long , steep-ish hill on the highway dropping into the city. It was icy. Unfortunately I was already committed by the time I realized how bad it was -- vehicles off on both sides. As soon as I tapped the brakes to slow down ABS was tripping. I locked the automatic trans in 2nd gear and didn't touch either pedal on the way down. Was able to hold the car back with the rear wheels and steer with the front.
