That sounds more like an operators use that should know better.
Anyone notice a pattern?
- Thread starter buster
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Agreed.
My favorite part of the story is when they rebuild the engine, add oil pan baffles, and change to a heavier grade oil from Royal Purple or Red Line, or even a conventional oil... and then conclude that since they have no more problems, Mobil 1 or synthetic oil was what caused the failure.
My favorite part of the story is when they rebuild the engine, add oil pan baffles, and change to a heavier grade oil from Royal Purple or Red Line, or even a conventional oil... and then conclude that since they have no more problems, Mobil 1 or synthetic oil was what caused the failure.
I won't post all the links as there are many, but here is just two examples racers using just plain old Mobil 1 5W-30 right out of the box.
http://www.automobilsport.com/uploads/_neustart/00American-Series/grandamkrohnNo76Action2.jpg
http://cache1.asset-cache.net/xc/9017616...30A760B0D811297
http://www.automobilsport.com/uploads/_neustart/00American-Series/grandamkrohnNo76Action2.jpg
http://cache1.asset-cache.net/xc/9017616...30A760B0D811297
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Originally Posted By: steve20
what good is a clean 'worn ' engine? -as evidenced by high Fe ratings in UOA. I would rather the oil have a good dose of EP and AW agents and a little detergent. The inside of a motor was never meant so clean as to eat off of.
I`m wondering about this also like Steve,is there a trade-off..........more detergents/more wear,less detergents/less wear? I guess what makes me wonder,is that the other night I was on here searching through the UOA`s,and noticed the dino ones always have less wear metals (iron and copper mostly) than the most expensive synths. In ever car I`ve tried different oils,the dinos always run smoother. The smoothest running oils I`ve ever tried were VR1 (which has the least detergents for a street oil afaik) and Pennzoil yb (which always blows away every synth in the book on UOA`s). I`m no petroleum engineer,but it just makes me wonder.
what good is a clean 'worn ' engine? -as evidenced by high Fe ratings in UOA. I would rather the oil have a good dose of EP and AW agents and a little detergent. The inside of a motor was never meant so clean as to eat off of.
I`m wondering about this also like Steve,is there a trade-off..........more detergents/more wear,less detergents/less wear? I guess what makes me wonder,is that the other night I was on here searching through the UOA`s,and noticed the dino ones always have less wear metals (iron and copper mostly) than the most expensive synths. In ever car I`ve tried different oils,the dinos always run smoother. The smoothest running oils I`ve ever tried were VR1 (which has the least detergents for a street oil afaik) and Pennzoil yb (which always blows away every synth in the book on UOA`s). I`m no petroleum engineer,but it just makes me wonder.
Originally Posted By: txrhino
Mobil 1 is a "has been" ?
You keep believing that.
Mobil 1 is a "has been" ?
You keep believing that.
Oh, okay, misunderstood. You are correct, it is not a has been.
Originally Posted By: tig1
After 32 yeaers of using M1 oils I might switch to Fram synthetic. I predict it will be the new darling of Bitog in 3 weeks.
I cant get on the conoco phillips web site!
After 32 yeaers of using M1 oils I might switch to Fram synthetic. I predict it will be the new darling of Bitog in 3 weeks.
I cant get on the conoco phillips web site!
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Originally Posted By: steve20
what good is a clean 'worn ' engine? -as evidenced by high Fe ratings in UOA. I would rather the oil have a good dose of EP and AW agents and a little detergent. The inside of a motor was never meant so clean as to eat off of.
I`m wondering about this also like Steve,is there a trade-off..........more detergents/more wear,less detergents/less wear? I guess what makes me wonder,is that the other night I was on here searching through the UOA`s,and noticed the dino ones always have less wear metals (iron and copper mostly) than the most expensive synths. In ever car I`ve tried different oils,the dinos always run smoother. The smoothest running oils I`ve ever tried were VR1 (which has the least detergents for a street oil afaik) and Pennzoil yb (which always blows away every synth in the book on UOA`s). I`m no petroleum engineer,but it just makes me wonder.
I guess the new paradime at BITOG is a dirty engine means longer engine life. It's going to take me a while to wrap my thoughts around this new enlightenment.
Originally Posted By: steve20
what good is a clean 'worn ' engine? -as evidenced by high Fe ratings in UOA. I would rather the oil have a good dose of EP and AW agents and a little detergent. The inside of a motor was never meant so clean as to eat off of.
I`m wondering about this also like Steve,is there a trade-off..........more detergents/more wear,less detergents/less wear? I guess what makes me wonder,is that the other night I was on here searching through the UOA`s,and noticed the dino ones always have less wear metals (iron and copper mostly) than the most expensive synths. In ever car I`ve tried different oils,the dinos always run smoother. The smoothest running oils I`ve ever tried were VR1 (which has the least detergents for a street oil afaik) and Pennzoil yb (which always blows away every synth in the book on UOA`s). I`m no petroleum engineer,but it just makes me wonder.
I guess the new paradime at BITOG is a dirty engine means longer engine life. It's going to take me a while to wrap my thoughts around this new enlightenment.
I believe that buster's original observation was very insightful. I have been away from BITOG for a couple of years (with only a quick peek at topics from time-to-time) and the marketing emphasis has changed from the large Multi-Nationals. I see a dual emphasis ...
1 - (per Buster) Engine cleanliness and anti-sludge claims (possibly driven by some of the sludge problems of the Lexus and Toyota engines??)
2 - Extended drain guarantess (M1EP, Castrol Edge and now PZ Ultra). Probably driven by the GM OLM and the Honda Maintenance Minder. [My wife's new Traverse was giving her an OCI of 13K on dino. It is now full of Castrol Edge....but i digress]
If you assume that the auto market in the U.S. is mature....one way for big oil companies to make more $$$ is to fill every possible niche within the market (dino, semi-synthetic, HM, synthetic, extended drain synthetics, etc.). Each has their own target market, price points and value.
I personally tend to gravitate toward a good dino or the top-end extended drain oil. Everything else in the middle is just too confusing with too much overlap.
Good observation Buster!!!
1 - (per Buster) Engine cleanliness and anti-sludge claims (possibly driven by some of the sludge problems of the Lexus and Toyota engines??)
2 - Extended drain guarantess (M1EP, Castrol Edge and now PZ Ultra). Probably driven by the GM OLM and the Honda Maintenance Minder. [My wife's new Traverse was giving her an OCI of 13K on dino. It is now full of Castrol Edge....but i digress]
If you assume that the auto market in the U.S. is mature....one way for big oil companies to make more $$$ is to fill every possible niche within the market (dino, semi-synthetic, HM, synthetic, extended drain synthetics, etc.). Each has their own target market, price points and value.
I personally tend to gravitate toward a good dino or the top-end extended drain oil. Everything else in the middle is just too confusing with too much overlap.
Good observation Buster!!!
Originally Posted By: tig1
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Originally Posted By: steve20
what good is a clean 'worn ' engine? -as evidenced by high Fe ratings in UOA. I would rather the oil have a good dose of EP and AW agents and a little detergent. The inside of a motor was never meant so clean as to eat off of.
I`m wondering about this also like Steve,is there a trade-off..........more detergents/more wear,less detergents/less wear? I guess what makes me wonder,is that the other night I was on here searching through the UOA`s,and noticed the dino ones always have less wear metals (iron and copper mostly) than the most expensive synths. In ever car I`ve tried different oils,the dinos always run smoother. The smoothest running oils I`ve ever tried were VR1 (which has the least detergents for a street oil afaik) and Pennzoil yb (which always blows away every synth in the book on UOA`s). I`m no petroleum engineer,but it just makes me wonder.
I guess the new paradime at BITOG is a dirty engine means longer engine life. It's going to take me a while to wrap my thoughts around this new enlightenment.
I better get that Synthetic oil out fast. Lord knows i dont want a spotless engine with a rod hanging out of the oil pan!!!LOL
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Originally Posted By: steve20
what good is a clean 'worn ' engine? -as evidenced by high Fe ratings in UOA. I would rather the oil have a good dose of EP and AW agents and a little detergent. The inside of a motor was never meant so clean as to eat off of.
I`m wondering about this also like Steve,is there a trade-off..........more detergents/more wear,less detergents/less wear? I guess what makes me wonder,is that the other night I was on here searching through the UOA`s,and noticed the dino ones always have less wear metals (iron and copper mostly) than the most expensive synths. In ever car I`ve tried different oils,the dinos always run smoother. The smoothest running oils I`ve ever tried were VR1 (which has the least detergents for a street oil afaik) and Pennzoil yb (which always blows away every synth in the book on UOA`s). I`m no petroleum engineer,but it just makes me wonder.
I guess the new paradime at BITOG is a dirty engine means longer engine life. It's going to take me a while to wrap my thoughts around this new enlightenment.
I better get that Synthetic oil out fast. Lord knows i dont want a spotless engine with a rod hanging out of the oil pan!!!LOL
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: tig1
You won't need to change the synt out, just dump in two spoons of sludge gathered from some old Model A and put it in the oil fill hole. Fix you right up for a longer running engine.
Only on BITOG....
You won't need to change the synt out, just dump in two spoons of sludge gathered from some old Model A and put it in the oil fill hole. Fix you right up for a longer running engine.
Only on BITOG....
Originally Posted By: tig1
You won't need to change the synt out, just dump in two spoons of sludge gathered from some old Model A and put it in the oil fill hole. Fix you right up for a longer running engine.
But i would have to do that every week, The syn oil will just keep cleaning it up. What happens when i run out of sludge here at the house?? Go to Jiffy Lube???
You won't need to change the synt out, just dump in two spoons of sludge gathered from some old Model A and put it in the oil fill hole. Fix you right up for a longer running engine.
But i would have to do that every week, The syn oil will just keep cleaning it up. What happens when i run out of sludge here at the house?? Go to Jiffy Lube???
Here is another example.
http://www.mobil1.com.au/why/outstanding.aspx
Quote:
Mobil 1 Offers Superior Resistance To Deposits Even At High Temperatures
Mobil 1 is more effective at resisting high temperature deposits than some other leading fully synthetic and semi-synthetic oils. Our test simulates high temperature piston deposit formulation which reduces engine efficiency. The test oil is heated to 285°C and directed onto a rapidly spinning (2500rpm) aluminum disc which is heated to 330°C. This test lasted 3 hours. At the end of the test, we assigned the oil a cleanliness rating out of 100.
http://www.mobil1.com.au/why/outstanding.aspx
Quote:
Mobil 1 Offers Superior Resistance To Deposits Even At High Temperatures
Mobil 1 is more effective at resisting high temperature deposits than some other leading fully synthetic and semi-synthetic oils. Our test simulates high temperature piston deposit formulation which reduces engine efficiency. The test oil is heated to 285°C and directed onto a rapidly spinning (2500rpm) aluminum disc which is heated to 330°C. This test lasted 3 hours. At the end of the test, we assigned the oil a cleanliness rating out of 100.
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
I`m wondering about this also like Steve,is there a trade-off..........more detergents/more wear,less detergents/less wear? I guess what makes me wonder,is that the other night I was on here searching through the UOA`s,and noticed the dino ones always have less wear metals (iron and copper mostly) than the most expensive synths. In ever car I`ve tried different oils,the dinos always run smoother. The smoothest running oils I`ve ever tried were VR1 (which has the least detergents for a street oil afaik) and Pennzoil yb (which always blows away every synth in the book on UOA`s). I`m no petroleum engineer,but it just makes me wonder.
There are always going to be trade-offs, especially in the fuel economy vs. deposit control area.
This Lubrizol video explains it:
http://www.gf-5.com/the_story/performance/
I`m wondering about this also like Steve,is there a trade-off..........more detergents/more wear,less detergents/less wear? I guess what makes me wonder,is that the other night I was on here searching through the UOA`s,and noticed the dino ones always have less wear metals (iron and copper mostly) than the most expensive synths. In ever car I`ve tried different oils,the dinos always run smoother. The smoothest running oils I`ve ever tried were VR1 (which has the least detergents for a street oil afaik) and Pennzoil yb (which always blows away every synth in the book on UOA`s). I`m no petroleum engineer,but it just makes me wonder.
There are always going to be trade-offs, especially in the fuel economy vs. deposit control area.
This Lubrizol video explains it:
http://www.gf-5.com/the_story/performance/
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