kinda like BW+S anyone know that one???
Maybe I'm to old.
bruce
Maybe I'm to old.
bruce
Adding LSD friction modifier to Synchromesh??
- Thread starter SteveD2
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Or Channel point??
or Dumbell Blend
how about SUS or REDWOOD
sorry I'll stop
bruce
sorry I'll stop
bruce
By "burning" I did mean it as a figure of speech. As in going through a LOT of fluid quickly.
So the RP UOA showed no change in viscosity - in how many miles? 700 miles? What were the metal levels?
I'm not advocating using all 75W-90 MTG - just one quart in 7. There is no problem mixing MTG/MTF. I have it in my car and customer's have done this in all sorts of vehicles. With the LS additive as kicker for your synchros.
What the heck does the dealer have to say? Put the factory juice in it and take it in for service when it shifts like garbage. Is your warranty up?
So the RP UOA showed no change in viscosity - in how many miles? 700 miles? What were the metal levels?
I'm not advocating using all 75W-90 MTG - just one quart in 7. There is no problem mixing MTG/MTF. I have it in my car and customer's have done this in all sorts of vehicles. With the LS additive as kicker for your synchros.
What the heck does the dealer have to say? Put the factory juice in it and take it in for service when it shifts like garbage. Is your warranty up?
USED OIL ANALYSIS
Royal Purple Report Date: 05/18/2006
One Royal Purple Lane Attn: Steve Deeter
Porter, TX 77365 Fax: 281-354-7600
Customer: Steve Deeter Date Sampled:
Our Lab#: 06051800 Unit ID: 2004 DODGE TRUCK
Your Sample ID: SYNCHROMAX Time on Oil: ~500 miles
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Comments: Oil appears to be contaminated by previously used transmission fluid. Magnesium, high
Silicon, and Zinc are not properties found in Synchromax. Silicon may be dirt which is abrasive and might
lead to wear. Viscosity is slightly low. Very low wear metals.
PROPERTY VALUE Typical New Oil
Appearance SLIGHTLY HAZY Clear&Bright
Color PURPLISH/BROWN PUPRLE
cSt @ 40°C 29.27 cSt 34.5
cSt @ 100°C 6.32 cSt 7.3
Viscosity Index 175 200
%Water %Solid TRACE % Vol. Iron 20 ppm Copper 3 ppm Lead 4 ppm Chromium Nickel 1 ppm Aluminum 5 ppm 1 max
Silver Silicon 44 ppm 20 max
Tin Calcium 230 ppm 300
Magnesium 888 ppm 5 max
Sodium 2 ppm Phosphorus 523 ppm 250
Boron 54 ppm 70
Barium Cadmium Antimony Vanadium Manganese Molybdenum 2 ppm Zinc 224 ppm Recommendations:
R#: 1162
WHOOPS, that previous post was NEW GM SYNCHROMESH FLUID, not mine...this post is the results of my RP Synchromax.
steved
Royal Purple Report Date: 05/18/2006
One Royal Purple Lane Attn: Steve Deeter
Porter, TX 77365 Fax: 281-354-7600
Customer: Steve Deeter Date Sampled:
Our Lab#: 06051800 Unit ID: 2004 DODGE TRUCK
Your Sample ID: SYNCHROMAX Time on Oil: ~500 miles
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Comments: Oil appears to be contaminated by previously used transmission fluid. Magnesium, high
Silicon, and Zinc are not properties found in Synchromax. Silicon may be dirt which is abrasive and might
lead to wear. Viscosity is slightly low. Very low wear metals.
PROPERTY VALUE Typical New Oil
Appearance SLIGHTLY HAZY Clear&Bright
Color PURPLISH/BROWN PUPRLE
cSt @ 40°C 29.27 cSt 34.5
cSt @ 100°C 6.32 cSt 7.3
Viscosity Index 175 200
%Water %Solid TRACE % Vol. Iron 20 ppm Copper 3 ppm Lead 4 ppm Chromium Nickel 1 ppm Aluminum 5 ppm 1 max
Silver Silicon 44 ppm 20 max
Tin Calcium 230 ppm 300
Magnesium 888 ppm 5 max
Sodium 2 ppm Phosphorus 523 ppm 250
Boron 54 ppm 70
Barium Cadmium Antimony Vanadium Manganese Molybdenum 2 ppm Zinc 224 ppm Recommendations:
R#: 1162
WHOOPS, that previous post was NEW GM SYNCHROMESH FLUID, not mine...this post is the results of my RP Synchromax.
steved
So it sheared. Hmmm......the wear metals don't look out of control - but it is only 500 miles.
The high Mg is weird - from the the Synchromesh. That stuff is some strange fluid.
The high Mg is weird - from the the Synchromesh. That stuff is some strange fluid.
I will only add they state it was contaminated by the previous oil. I pulled the covers off the sides and sopped up every drip of synchromesh I could get out.
There could not have been more than a single ounce left hung up in the transmission because I got the "fill" amount in without even trying...actually got 5 quarts in without overfilling...the trans is supposed to hold 4.75 stock.
So if their fluid is that sensitive???
steved
There could not have been more than a single ounce left hung up in the transmission because I got the "fill" amount in without even trying...actually got 5 quarts in without overfilling...the trans is supposed to hold 4.75 stock.
So if their fluid is that sensitive???
steved
Makes me wonder. The RP was 7.7cSt@100°C to start - that drop is not all from dilution. You felt the thinning and the improper FM activity in the shifter.
Give my brew a shot - I think the transmission simply has a narrow fluid of preference when hot. Below 7.5 cSt@100°C or so and it's not happy. Go above 14cSt@100° and it it has clearance and flow problems when cold.....my mix should be just around 10cSt with the LS additive - and shouldn't shear too much.
If you actually read my post, there were 3 more fluids to try that are similar in viscosity.
Did you actually try the lubegard? Please don't throw it in the same sentence with lucas, which is a thickener.
RoyalPurple is too thin. I wouldn't bother trying it again unless you throw in 20% Maxgear. You could probably go 50:50 without fear of goin' too thick.
The same could be said about some of the other MTF/MTLs. If shearing is an issue, thicken the fluid a little.
You need to gather some used oil analysis on the fluids when they start acting up to see if the fluid is possibly shearing thin, or oxidizing into mud.
I did read your post and the only one that would be convenient to get would most likely be the Hondacura...I know Torco doesn't seem to work in these transmissions as there have been more than one person who did try it. I have never heard of the BG oil before and would not know where to get it.
IIRC, Lubeguard lasted about as long as the Lucas did in my transmission (sorry, I used them together in the same sentence). I guess what I am doing is not just for myself (and maybe that is confusing the situation) as I will definately post good and bad findings on TDR to help out others with the same issues. And based on that, that is also where I am drawing some of my non-"self experienced" conclusions from, the findings of others. I am using all my research to date to try to figure this out...and while I might not have personally tried it, I have read of others trying it and their experiences...
As far as mixing fluids...well, looks like I'll be sending yet another order to Amsoil to get 6 quarts of MTF and a single quart of MTG.
I almost wonder if some of my problems isn't this colder weather causing tougher shifting...but even after a 50 mile ride at highway speeds, it still will clip 3rd and sometimes 5th...an even moderate shift from 1st to 2nd is all but impossible without double clutching.
And I fully intend to grab a used oil analysis from this Amsoil MTF to see how it looks...maybe do that BEFORE I add the MTG and see what might be happening. I can always add the MTG after the fact...
steved
That will work. It'll be interesting to see how the fluid is behaving. That transmission seems to be a tough customer. Cold and hot it has issues.
Thanks for posting the link to the coolers - those look cool.
Who is your Amsoil dealer, by the way?
Thanks for posting the link to the coolers - those look cool.
Who is your Amsoil dealer, by the way?
castrol syntorq from these guys http://www.quad4x4.com/NV5600.htm
I don't really have a specific dealer, but I am a preferred customer to help sway the cost of the bypass filters...To date, the Amsoil fluid has performed overall better than the others...not that it is glowingly better, just that it is consistant across the board.
I'm surprised no one had seen those coolers before...they are very popular amongst the diesel guys. Probably more so because the typical car wouldn't have a PTO cover or a 400 pound cast iron trans...
There is also a filter for the PTO covers (but you lose one of the coolers) for manual transmissions too. Since my fluid drains almost clear, I was as concerned about the filter as I was the heat.
The Syntorque...isn't that the OE fill for the NV4500...the 75w90 oil??? I believe that is the oil my dad's NV4500 calls for, but we've been running 75w90 Pennzoil Synthetic in it for years with really good luck. My NV5600 specifies Synchromesh.
I was thinking about the whole adding MTG again, and was thinking...only the RP gave trouble when it got hot...
steved
I wish there was some way to add a cooler to my NV3500.
MolaKule
Staff member
"Magnesium, high
Silicon, and Zinc are not properties found in Synchromax."
Disagree. The levels of most of these elements are indeed found in most synchromesh 9.X cSt GL4 fluids and should have these levels. Some trade Ca for Magnesium.
The silicon does appear to be about high by about 10 to 20 ppm.
Silicon, and Zinc are not properties found in Synchromax."
Disagree. The levels of most of these elements are indeed found in most synchromesh 9.X cSt GL4 fluids and should have these levels. Some trade Ca for Magnesium.
The silicon does appear to be about high by about 10 to 20 ppm.
They were stating that those aren't found in their formulation of synchroMAX and that they were most likely the result of contamination from the old fluid (synchroMESH).
I wonder what would happen if I changed back to the PZ stuff?? Probably wouldn't be able to shift at all!
steved
I have been using Mercon V (with nothing else added) in both of the Contour manual transmissions with great results. Mercon V contains additional friction modifiers. It might also be Mercon V's much better low-temperature properties--as I recall most of the problems with the notchiness of the MTX-75 were at low temperatures.
I didn't know that anyone would use Torco motorcyle gear oils in their vehicles. I thought I was one of the few that cross platforms when choosing lubes.
My recommendation is to try the MTF-R 80w(9.72cst) motorcycle gearbox oil. Torco does not make another synchromesh substitute. Torco's MTF is for manuals that require ATF.
BG synchroshift-II can be found online. Just google it. It has a following.
You should post each fluid combination, additive combination, mileage each combo was run, and your personal opinion. With $500 spent on fluid, many will benefit from your experience.
What fluid did you use with the lubegard and which lubegard did you run?
Pennzoil and Texaco make OEM synchromesh. By all means, use it if it is cost effective. Dump it when it acts up. It sure is cheaper then the boutique fluids. And, if it last just as long, why bother with anything else?
My recommendation is to try the MTF-R 80w(9.72cst) motorcycle gearbox oil. Torco does not make another synchromesh substitute. Torco's MTF is for manuals that require ATF.
BG synchroshift-II can be found online. Just google it. It has a following.
You should post each fluid combination, additive combination, mileage each combo was run, and your personal opinion. With $500 spent on fluid, many will benefit from your experience.
What fluid did you use with the lubegard and which lubegard did you run?
Pennzoil and Texaco make OEM synchromesh. By all means, use it if it is cost effective. Dump it when it acts up. It sure is cheaper then the boutique fluids. And, if it last just as long, why bother with anything else?
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