A/C recharge: Artic Freeze Recharge Kit - good?

[lairdwd]

So some of the A/C guys have referred to some of the additives as .. "goo" .

What would constitute goo. If the recharge quantity is high enough, I want to add a shot of oil.

Would you top off with either of these? Or am I better buying plain r134a + oil? Yea or nea?

recharge 1

arctic freeze kit

 

[Torino]

If the unit is old and has been leaking a bit (normal) add the freon with 3 oz of oil. I don't recommend ANY of the snake oils. John--Las Vegas.

 

[Chris142]

Don't put any stop leak in the system.

 

[bdcardinal]

No snake oil stop leaks. pure R134a in the proper amount with the proper oil and a shot of dye for future leak diag.

 

[Drew99GT]

I've used the Arctic Freeze stuff in my car and it blows ice cubes. The stop leak hasn't gummed anything up and it's slowed the leak to where I hardly have to top off anymore.

IMO, it comes down to the particular vehicle in question. If it's a newer car that you plan on keeping, I'd have the system checked by a professional if you think the system is low or not working as good as new. If you have nothing to lose with a semi beater car like I have, then I wouldn't hesitate using the Arctic Freeze or topping off with regular refrigerant and oil. Don't overcharge though! It's very easy to do.

 

[440Magnum]

I don't recommend "goos", but the arctic freeze version seems pretty harmless compared to some others. Unless you overdose the system with it, I don't think it should cause undue problems. Its probably an OK way to eke a little more life out of a dying system.

The real problem I have is when people keep repeatedly topping off with those all-in-one cans. The system winds up completely overloaded with oil (primarily) and also sealer. That's when the real problems start.

 

[Craig in Canada]

When a friend offered to pick some R134a up from the US for me I specified that I wanted straight R134a with no "goo" or additives of any sort. What I got back was a can of Arctic Freeze

The instructions on the can indicate that it should be rocked between vertical and horizontal while dispensing. I haven't seen that matching instruction on R134a-only containers. I figure that the additives stay as a liquid in the container and are only dispensed by the tipping. I specifically did not follow the instructions and held it perfectly vertical while dispensing. I found that the perceived fluid level in the can dropped quite a bit, but the weight didn't drop so much. I think I was probably successful at dramatically reducing the "goo injection".

Don't forget to purge the line on the can before attaching.

 

[mechtech2]

Tilting the can is NOT to ensure 'solids' get in the system.
It is advice given for straight 134a cans, also.

 

[lairdwd]

So I bought some A/C manifold gauges, and am fairly familiar with the process at this point in preparation for a DIY A/C topoff.

My big concern is making sure the compressor has the proper amount of oil after the topoff. It seems unclear to me if *any* DIY topoff is complete, unless you are topping off the oil too. This seems to be a big mystery area not clearly covered in any of the guides or FAQ's on the internet.

This is on a 2000 Honda accord compressor that's never been recharged. I have read you have to be real careful with Honda A/C. It's $150 at the dealership to discharge/recharge. Would be nice if I can DIY for $10 myself. I don't have a vacuum pump, and don't want one, so it has to be a topoff.

So my question - does a DIY topoff need to topoff oil too? I've read this is more important in older units. (assume using "pure" 134a - no goo).

 

[Chris142]

I always add a little oil. Too much oil will effect the heat transfer of the system but 2-3 oz too much wont and it will prolong the life of the compressor.

You can buy a small can of AC oil and shoot that in just like Refrigerant.

Something like this except Pag46 if you can find it.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/R-134a-R1...sQ5fAccessories

 

[cmf]

Never use that garbage with stop leak and "proprietary additives". AC units need oil and r134a, that's it. Both the stop leak and excess oil can clog the expansion valve.

Chris124's advice is good but needs elaborating. I would add r134a and oil back in the ratio that the system originally had. For example my system takes ~20 ounces r134a and 5 ounces of oil, so I would add r134a and oil back in a 4:1 ratio. 2-3 ounces overfill isn't much for a system that takes 64 ounces of r134a but for my system it would be a major overfill and would skew the ratio to 2.5:1. It is entirely guesswork though, and adding in the same ratio is going to leave you with more oil than you want but there's not really any way to know how much oil you've lost.

I would also not continually top off a system. You really need to pull a vacuum on it at some point and reset back to factory recommended r134a and oil levels. Even with manifold gauges you are guessing at how much the system needs.

 

[Slownis]

The amount of oil to put in varies depending on what is being replaced. In a 1995 Nissan Service Manual I've been looking at lately, it suggests if you are just fixing a leak, to add 1 oz of oil for a large leak, and none for a small leak. Then it says 2.5 fl oz if replacing the evaporator or condensor, .2 fl oz for the accumulator/dryer. If replacing a compressor, it actually says to dump the oil out of the old compressor, measure it, and then add the same amount of new oil to the new compressor in the suction line.

 

[mechtech2]

Originally Posted By: Slownis
The amount of oil to put in varies depending on what is being replaced. In a 1995 Nissan Service Manual I've been looking at lately, it suggests if you are just fixing a leak, to add 1 oz of oil for a large leak, and none for a small leak. Then it says 2.5 fl oz if replacing the evaporator or condensor, .2 fl oz for the accumulator/dryer. If replacing a compressor, it actually says to dump the oil out of the old compressor, measure it, and then add the same amount of new oil to the new compressor in the suction line.

This is general safe and sane advice.
So just fill her up right, and forget about it.

 

[lairdwd]

I might pay an A/C guy to discharge and pull a vacuum, and then do the PAG 46/r134a myself to factory spec. If he's cheap enough, I'll let him do the whole thing.

Very difficult to find a good A/C guy here though. Have to go way out in the boonies for anything less than $100, and I'm wondering how much the discharge/vacuum would be.

 

[440Magnum]

Originally Posted By: lairdwd
My big concern is making sure the compressor has the proper amount of oil after the topoff. It seems unclear to me if *any* DIY topoff is complete, unless you are topping off the oil too. This seems to be a big mystery area not clearly covered in any of the guides or FAQ's on the internet.

That's because, depending on where the leak is, you can lose almost all the oil or almost none of your oil by the time the refrigerant level gets low. A leak low down in the evaporator core will lose oil rapidly because oil stands in that area when the system is shut down, and it won't even start leaking refrigerant until all the oil pooled there is pushed out. A leak up high in the condenser will only leak oil when the system is running, but when its shut down it will leak pure refrigerant (of course if you have a condenser leak, you should be able to find and fix it easily, whereas an evap. leak is difficult). AND there's no way to actually measure the amount of oil in a system.

I agree with others that its a generally "safe" practice to add a small amount of oil when you top off. But I also briefly crack the suction-side schraeder valve with the system running as a quick check after adding refrigerant only. If you get oily foam, then oil is circulating and even though you might be a little bit low, its probably best not to add any. If you get a dry gas or just a fine mist of oil- add some oil. Just my advice, worth exactly what you paid for it!