99 4l60e change to Dexron VI troubles

[gregmp]

One Important thing to add...

I had a motor mount than had some play in the rubber a few weeks ago (the driver side is the one that usually goes bad) It was making the shifts feel inconsistant and sloppy. I jacked up the eninge and stuffed a hard rubber piece in the bottom of the mount which limited the movement. This tightened up the shift feel to perfect. I had just flushed w/ Dex.III a month or two ago and was worried the Penzoil fluid was not as good as the Castrol I used before, but this was not the case.

Just another possible cause for what you are obviously feeling. I hate it when any part of my driving experience feels sloppy or slow.

 

[Whitewolf]

If you have a case of III-H from XM with a license number on it somewhere then you can say with 99% confidence that it's the real thing.

As for my credentials...that would be telling.

 

[Whitewolf]

That's a really good example of how someone can easily end up with an incorrectly identified root cause for given a problem.
Thanks.

 

[99TA]

Well after adding the 4qts of dexIII it feels much better but the 2-3 shift is still very odd.It just laggs too long,all the other shifts are solid bumps.I'm thinking maybe there is alot of clearance in the 3rd clutch pack causing this bit of weirdness.

 

[gregmp]

Leave it alone for a while. Give the PCM some time to adapt to the fluid changes. Then re-evaluate the shifts in a week or so.

It will give you a break from worry as well.

 

[JohnBrowning]

99TA, No offense but you are chaseing your tail trying to blame this on the fluid!!! GM tested this fluid in everytign it make's that was useing Dex-III and they have had the same basic line up of transmissions now for year's for the most part!! Every ATF will change the shift charteristics a little from brand to brand...In this case you are also useing a newer spec. fluid so youhave to expect some difference in shift performance.....If you think their is a problem drop the pan and check the filter or take it to someone that does diagnastics on transmissions... Easy check are for foaming fluid, hotter then normal trans temp, quick color change and smell change of the fluid!

 

[gregmp]

Originally Posted By: JohnBrowning
99TA, No offense but you are chaseing your tail trying to blame this on the fluid!!! GM tested this fluid in everytign it make's that was useing Dex-III and they have had the same basic line up of transmissions now for year's for the most part!! Every ATF will change the shift charteristics a little from brand to brand...In this case you are also useing a newer spec. fluid so youhave to expect some difference in shift performance.....If you think their is a problem drop the pan and check the filter or take it to someone that does diagnastics on transmissions... Easy check are for foaming fluid, hotter then normal trans temp, quick color change and smell change of the fluid!


If the fluid can change the shift feel, and he doesn't like the new shift feel...Then by all mean go back to what you like. So there you go, different fluid = different shifts. But give it a week to break in/adjust before you make any more changes.

One sock may be better quality than another and thus last longer. But if the sock don't fit, you ain't gonna want to wear it......... Dex.VI may not fit in this case.

 

[99TA]

Thanks for all the good replies,i descided not to touch it and stay with the 2/3 DexVI and 1/3 DexIII at least for a few weeks.I had the car out this morning and drove about 60 miles and it worked perfect for some odd reason.Shifts were firm without weirdo soft can't feel um shifts.I'm starting to think the pcm has something to do with this just like you posted.With out a doubt the trans is much much smoother but i gotta keep my firm shifts.If it stays like this i will be happy.
I also notice without a doubt the car responds to throttle much nicer with the DexIII added to the DexVI when the torque converter is unlocked.This has to be a viscosity issue.With only DexVI the engine really feels loose when its unlocked.

 

[cfromc]

Perhaps a PCM download would bring back your shifting preferences while still using the better fluid? Modifications are not for everyone but my 1989 Formula has a shift kit and I would never go back to stock. My 2004 Grand Prix (that I just sold) had the PCM programming changed, which included a change in shift firmness and RPM (among other things) and the improvement was substantial. On both cars my 0-60 and 1/4 mile time dropped significantly. I even had the programming changed on my 2001 Suburban and the shifts are much less mushy and more "positive" feeling. I'm not saying this is the answer for you, just an option. BTW, on both the GP and the Suburban I used Amsoil ATF with very good results.

 

[99TA]

Good info,where did you get them reprogramed?The dealers here are like knockers on a bull.....

 

[bruce381]

Foamy oil or air in shift body?
bruce

 

[gregmp]

The PCM will adjust for shift time. If is too long, it will firm/quicken the shifts over a period of time until the programming is met. So yeah it should get better, or at least stay the way it is now.

Hey, lots of people put in a converter to raise the stall speed. So some may like if the torque converter is a bit looser with Dex.6 I personally like a tight (stock) converter for the twisty turns.

 

[PT1]

Originally Posted By: bruce381
Foamy oil or air in shift body?
bruce


That is what I am thinking. I would drop the pan and check the seal on the filter just to be certain. If it is not making a complete seal it will exhibit this characteristic. This sounds like a hydraulic issue and not fluid type. If it were fluid the symptom should disappear when the trans reaches full operating temperature.

 

[99TA]

geez i posted up before that the oil is cOMPLETELY CLEAR...no foam no bubbles...we even ran it hard then pumped the pan out and it was clear like it comes out of the bottle.Please get off the screen,seal,foam thing...ever hear a pump sucking ANY air...even a small amount??? can you imagine doing WOT runs with a LS1 engine with aNY air getting sucked in? It aint happenin so forget about it.The trans would be trashed by now,i beat the living [censored] out of it for 3 days.

 

[99TA]

Originally Posted By: gregmp
The PCM will adjust for shift time. If is too long, it will firm/quicken the shifts over a period of time until the programming is met. So yeah it should get better, or at least stay the way it is now.

Hey, lots of people put in a converter to raise the stall speed. So some may like if the torque converter is a bit looser with Dex.6 I personally like a tight (stock) converter for the twisty turns.
It doesn't need any looser than stock imo,its too loose to begin with.It substantially changed just adding 4 qts dexIII to the DexVI.I'm not sure why after telling people over and over they continue to bring up the foam thing.The pump would screaming!

 

[99TA]

Originally Posted By: PT1
Originally Posted By: bruce381
Foamy oil or air in shift body?
bruce


That is what I am thinking. I would drop the pan and check the seal on the filter just to be certain. If it is not making a complete seal it will exhibit this characteristic. This sounds like a hydraulic issue and not fluid type. If it were fluid the symptom should disappear when the trans reaches full operating temperature.
Did you ever see the seal on the 4l60e trans for the filter?It a double lip seal,that means there are twi sealing rings spaced apart from each other.BOTH would need to fail making contact with the filter.I was there when they installed the filter,it went in tight.This shop does alot of trans work and told me they have NEVER had to change the seal on a 4l60e unless they were overhauling the entire transmission because the seal is that tight.In earlier posted i suggested what symtoms sucking air at the seal would give....one would be the converter dumping most of it oil back into the pan when the engine was shut off,this would result in a huge delay when starting cold before you could move....it doesn't do that either.

 

[unDummy]

Research predator, LS1-edit, hptuner, jet, superchips........ find the ones that can make the transmission adjustments that you want. And, research shift kits also. Use your favorite web search engine.

 

[99TA]

Please if you are going to post up problems give some back ground to support your post and your credentials on the matter.Example if you never worked on a 4l60e don't post up the seal must be bad etc.TY

 

[Cutehumor]

Originally Posted By: 99TA
Please if you are going to post up problems give some back ground to support your post and your credentials on the matter.Example if you never worked on a 4l60e don't post up the seal must be bad etc.TY


This just sounds plain rude to me. hope you get the help you need.

 

[99TA]

Rude? because i have made it clear the fluid is not foaming or the seal leaking but the same thing gets posted over and over?I don't think so,i want suggestions not the same thing over and over.I think its rude yu posted up like this!